Must A Christain Be Perfect To Enter Into Heaven?

[soberxp]

[WTF? ARE YOU TRYING TO TELLING ME,CHINESE IS THE Israel’s enemies !WE ARE IN PEACE!!!!!!!OUR LEADER IS BETTER THAN YOURS!!!!!

I'm not sure what you are saying with the WTF or where Chinese comes in? Could you tell me what that abbreviation means in Christian terms and where Chinese comes in? I know quite a few Chinese people who are true believers but not all of them are, if that is the point you are trying to make.

my point is "World Taekwondo Federation"

2Corinthians 11:14 And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.

I wanted to apologize for my mad.sorry.

what if for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light(good),then for the god himself is transformed into Chinese dragon(the dragon meaning is as bad as it can be in west).

I did a lot of research about the word "dragon",ONLY found in REV.and I didn't even know the word in Heb or greek.

Isaiah 14:
29 Rejoice not thou, whole Palestina, because the rod of him that smote thee is broken: for out of the serpent's root shall come forth a cockatrice, and his fruit shall be a fiery flying serpent.
30 And the firstborn of the poor shall feed, and the needy shall lie down in safety: and I will kill thy root with famine, and he shall slay thy remnant.
31 Howl, O gate; cry, O city; thou, whole Palestina, art dissolved: for there shall come from the north a smoke, and none shall be alone in his appointed times.
32 What shall one then answer the messengers of the nation? That the LORD hath founded Zion, and the poor of his people shall trust in it.

you should know the chinese constellation "representing the eleven realistic animal(include:serpent), only the chinese dragon(long) is not the realistic animal."
1.mouse
2.bull
3.tiger
4.rabbit
5.chinese dragon(long)
6.serpent(snake)
7.horse
8.sheep
9.monkey
10.chicken
11.dog
12.pig


Exo 4:1 And Moses answered and said, But, behold, they will not believe me, nor hearken unto my voice: for they will say, The LORD hath not appeared unto thee.
Exo 4:2 And the LORD said unto him, What is that in thine hand? And he said, A rod.
Exo 4:3 And he said, Cast it on the ground. And he cast it on the ground, and it became a serpent; and Moses fled from before it.
Exo 4:4 And the LORD said unto Moses, Put forth thine hand, and take it by the tail. And he put forth his hand, and caught it, and it became a rod in his hand:
Exo 4:5 That they may believe that the LORD God of their fathers, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob, hath appeared unto thee.

P.S
cockatrice monster hatched by a reptile from a c .o. c. k's egg; able to kill with a glance"Ark of the Covenant????"
movie:"Men Who Stare at Goats "
The ark???cockatrice???????????chinese legendary phoenix bird who was raised from the dead????????????????；

O GOD that's too hard for me,lack of that other nations culture..............

sorry to anyone who can't understanding or catch up with my Jumping way of thinking...............sorry again and again,but I'll never feel ashamed for anything what I have done.Rom 9:33 As it is written, Behold, I lay in Sion a stumblingstone and rock of offence: and whosoever believeth on him(Lord Jesus) shall not be ashamed.

BTW!
for the word dragon in the bible! for the chinese dragon in our history! for seek the fact about my testimony from god or satan!
if anyone want to use the word to look down your noise at chinese Diaoyu Islands and so on about war!,you will be fool,hypocrite,snake!!!!!!!!!!!!

P.S 2

REV 22:19And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.
for SOME PEOPLE SAID THE VERSE 31 Howl, O gate; cry, O city; thou, whole Palestina, art dissolved: for there shall come from the north a smoke IS NOT RIGHT,be care of what you have done and what you have said!!!!!

 

[The Robster]

These are verses calling the church (Christians) to repent:Rev 3:19,Rev 3:3 ,Rev 2:16, Rev 2:5.

There are many things that the church needs to repent from. Many Christians are not doing a lot of what the Bible calls us to do. Many Christians do not honor God and despise His things and His ways. Trust me, there is a lot of sinful behavior within the church that millions of Christians pretend is not sin. Most Christians are just conscious of sinning against people. But many are sinning against God in ways they don't even realize because they have engaged in some serious self deception. God wants us to change a lot in the Body of Christ. If we started going down just a few of these sins against God that are "out of mind and out of sight" many on this board would be spitting venom because they don't like to hear the truth and know they have been guilty for many years of those things.

 

[sunshineaaks]

my point is "World Taekwondo Federation"

2Corinthians 11:14 And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.

I wanted to apologize for my mad.sorry.

what if for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light(good),then for the god himself is transformed into Chinese dragon(the dragon meaning is as bad as it can be in west).

I did a lot of research about the word "dragon",ONLY found in REV.and I didn't even know the word in Heb or greek.

Isaiah 14:
29 Rejoice not thou, whole Palestina, because the rod of him that smote thee is broken: for out of the serpent's root shall come forth a cockatrice, and his fruit shall be a fiery flying serpent.
30 And the firstborn of the poor shall feed, and the needy shall lie down in safety: and I will kill thy root with famine, and he shall slay thy remnant.
31 Howl, O gate; cry, O city; thou, whole Palestina, art dissolved: for there shall come from the north a smoke, and none shall be alone in his appointed times.
32 What shall one then answer the messengers of the nation? That the LORD hath founded Zion, and the poor of his people shall trust in it.

you should know the chinese constellation "representing the eleven realistic animal(include:serpent), only the chinese dragon(long) is not the realistic animal."
1.mouse
2.bull
3.tiger
4.rabbit
5.chinese dragon(long)
6.serpent(snake)
7.horse
8.sheep
9.monkey
10.chicken
11.dog
12.pig


Exo 4:1 And Moses answered and said, But, behold, they will not believe me, nor hearken unto my voice: for they will say, The LORD hath not appeared unto thee.
Exo 4:2 And the LORD said unto him, What is that in thine hand? And he said, A rod.
Exo 4:3 And he said, Cast it on the ground. And he cast it on the ground, and it became a serpent; and Moses fled from before it.
Exo 4:4 And the LORD said unto Moses, Put forth thine hand, and take it by the tail. And he put forth his hand, and caught it, and it became a rod in his hand:
Exo 4:5 That they may believe that the LORD God of their fathers, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob, hath appeared unto thee.



O GOD that's too hard for me,lack of that other nations culture..............

sorry to anyone who can't understanding or catch up with my Jumping way of thinking...............sorry again and again,but I'll never feel ashamed for anything what I have done.Rom 9:33 As it is written, Behold, I lay in Sion a stumblingstone and rock of offence: and whosoever believeth on him(Lord Jesus) shall not be ashamed.


BTW!
for the word dragon in the bible! for the chinese dragon in our history! for seek the fact about my testimony from god or satan!
if anyone want to use the word to look down your noise at chinese Diaoyu Islands and so on about war!,you will be fool,hypocrite,snake!!!!!!!!!!!!

Thank you for the clarification on the abbreviation. I thought that is what it meant but was not sure. :wink: And you are forgiven for the rant. I'm thinking there must be some sort of misunderstanding since I made no mention of a dragon.

However, since you did, the dragon mentioned in Revelation is not God transformed into evil. I'm not sure where you are getting that God transforms Himself into a dragon or anything evil since there is no evil in Him. Impossible for something good to be good when there is evil. Unless you mean 'the god himself' is referring to the devil?

God does warn that Satan can and does 'transform' or appear as an angel of light, but that is only to deceive many not encourage one to God. Just because someone appears to be good does not mean they really are. He also warns to test the spirits to see which are of God and which are not. (1 John 4:1) And He gives the reason because false prophets who have gone out into the world. Many of the 'dragons' we find in Rev.

Though, you did say "the god himself" and not God, I hope that you mean Satan = 'the god himself' and not God the creator='the god himself'? I’m not sure, that is why I ask.

 

[soberxp]

2Co 13:2 I told you before, and foretell you, as if I were present, the second time; and being absent now I write to them which heretofore have sinned, and to all other, that, if I come again, I will not spare: 2Co 13:3 Since ye seek a proof of Christ speaking in me, which to you-ward is not weak, but is mighty in you.

if what I have seen that came from satan, how about others in bible,Well I know I am but really who isn't?:shock::shade:

just go on babbling about well nothing come to think of it

I believ in god, and following the Lord Jesus Christ.

 

[sunshineaaks]

Mark 2:17 When Jesus heard it, he saith unto them, They that are whole have no need of the physician, but they that are sick: I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.
Rom 2:29 But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.Col 1:28 Whom we preach, warning every man, and teaching every man in all wisdom; that we may present every man perfect in Christ Jesus

Romans - 9:31 kjv:But Israel, which followed after the law of righteousness（But Israel, which followed after the god of Jacob）, hath not attained to the law of righteousness.

The Doctrine of Balaam.Numbers[/B](Numbers)《-----check it out



Rom 9:30-33 What shall we say then? (understanding what was just said in the previous verses, we reach the conclusion) That the Gentiles, which did not follow after righteousness, have attained to righteousness, even the righteousness which is of faith. But Israel, which followed after the law of righteousness, has not attained to the law of righteousness.

Wherefore? (why not?) Because they(The Scribes and Pharisees) sought it not by faith(IN NT redemption；salvation), but as it were by the works of the law(IN OT 10 commandments). For they stumbled at that stumblingstone; As it is written, Behold, I lay in Sion a stumblingstone and rock of offence: and whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.

Jesus said keep the commandments.

Mat 19:17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.
Mar 10:18 And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God.

Maybe I should rephrase my ‘pure of heart willing to be in obedience to God” and “like the Pharisees who called Jesus a heretic”

Mark 2:17 mentions the Pharisees who believe they are righteous enough to call Jesus a heretic or blasphemer. (Matthew 9:3; 26:65; Mark 2:7; Luke 5:21) No, Jesus didn’t come to save the ‘righteous’ who did not need Him. The Pharisees believed they were much higher than this man called Jesus who they accused of blasphemy.

Jesus came to save the sinner like Paul, the woman at the well, the demon possessed man chained outside the city. All who repented and were saved. They knew they were sick and needed the Great Physician. They knew they were sinners and needed to repent to the One who could forgive. They also lived lives that showed that change. Their testimony helped to draw many to Christ.

By ‘the pure of heart willing to be in obedience to God” ARE the sinners Christ calls to repentance. Those like the Pharisees or those who believe they can continue in sin ‘because Jesus will forgive anyway” attitude in all their self righteous defiance believed they were whole and didn’t need Christ to enter heaven. So, no, Jesus didn’t come to call the righteous to Him but rather the sinners.

 

[sunshineaaks]

With all due respect:



All of these are basically the same:
The use of perfect here as all your other references is the Greek term telos, which meant “fully equipped for an assigned task i.e.
1 Broken limbs being healed and becoming useful again
2 Fishing nets being mended again and thereby being able to catch fish
3 The term “something used but in perfect condition
4 A common one: “Ships being fitted with ropes and sails and otherwise made ready for sea
It does not imply sinlessness, but functional maturity

Wonderful! The analogies are great!

 

[soberxp]

Wonderful! The analogies are great!

+1

Pro 28:3 A poor man that oppresseth the poor is like a sweeping rain which leaveth no food.
Pro 28:8 He that by usury and unjust gain increaseth his substance, he shall gather it for him that will pity the poor.
Rev 2:9 I know thy works, and tribulation, and poverty, (but thou art rich) and I know the blasphemy of them which say they are Jews, and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan.

Pro 30:11 "There are those who curse their fathers and do not bless their mothers; Pro 30:12 those who are pure in their own eyes and yet are not cleansed of their filth; Pro 30:13 those whose eyes are ever so haughty, whose glances are so disdainful; Pro 30:14 those whose teeth are swords and whose jaws are set with knives to devour the poor from the earth, the needy from among mankind.





Isa 49:26 And I will feed them that oppress thee with their own flesh; and they shall be drunken with their own blood, as with sweet wine: and all flesh shall know that I the LORD am thy Saviour and thy Redeemer, the mighty One of Jacob.


poor lost lose one

bible assign a topic for an essay: poor lost lose one: Pro 28:3+Pro 28:8+Rev 2:9+Pro 30:11+Pro 30:12+Pro 30:13+Pro 30:14=Isa 49:26



http://biblia.com/bible/kjv1900/Gal 4.21

Gal 4:21 Tell me, ye that desire to be under the law, do ye not hear the law?
Gal 5:14 For all the law is fulfilled in one word, even in this; Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
Job 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
Jesus who is the image of god.the law is one word love.

salvation fulfilled in love.
law is fulfilled in love.
but Jesus just is salvation? no,Jesus is love.

Rom 7:14 For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.
Pro 23:23 buy the truth, and sell it not; also wisdom, and instruction, and understanding.

sold under sin,buy the truth,and sell it not.this is just so call salvation and the law is spiritual(the holy spirit)
===========================================
Eph 2:8-9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.

Not of works:this is meaning the works which before you creating yourself in christ by faith.

lest any man should boast:Look,the sinner in christ, before the sinner is no more good works than mine.

Eph 2:8-9:this is not telling us,we don't need good work in Christ.

do u understand my bro ans sis?

sell(1.teach 2.betray )
buy(1.learning 2.save or teach or warning)

rev 13:17 And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.



Rom 7:14 For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.

Mat 19:21 Jesus said to him, "If you want to be perfect, go, sell (Col 1:28 Whom we preach, warning every man, and teaching every man in all wisdom; that we may present every man perfect in Christ Jesuswhat you have and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven;

Spiritually speaking, if we sell (ie;acknowledge His Truths to others) what has have been given to us concerning the Truths of the Spirit to those who are poor in His truths,we then will become more like Jesus the Christ who is that perfect treasure in heaven.

 

[sunshineaaks]

2Co 13:2 I told you before, and foretell you, as if I were present, the second time; and being absent now I write to them which heretofore have sinned, and to all other, that, if I come again, I will not spare: 2Co 13:3[ Since ye seek a proof of Christ speaking in me, which to you-ward is not weak, but is mighty in you.

if what I have seen that came from satan, how about others in bible,Well I know I am but really who isn't?:shock::shade:

just go on babbling about well nothing come to think of it

I believ in god, and following the Lord Jesus Christ.

The verses you post are quite nice and you shouldn’t call what you say babble about nothing because I think you hit on some important aspects. Understanding it, however, comes from work and study that many people aren’t interested in putting the time into.

This question is a bit confusing and I'm not sure what you mean here?

if what I have seen that came from satan, how about others in bible,Well I know I am but really who isn't?

I'm also not sure what you have 'seen' or what 'others in the bible' you are talking about?

 

[JCslover]

The only way we can be made perfect is through Jesus,all have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God,but Jesus died for the sins of the world so we can be made perfect through him.

 

[sunshineaaks]

Mat 19:21 Jesus said to him, "If you want to be perfect, go, sell (Col 1:28 Whom we preach, warning every man, and teaching every man in all wisdom; that we may present every man perfect in Christ Jesuswhat you have and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven;

Spiritually speaking, if we sell (ie;acknowledge His Truths to others) what has have been given to us concerning the Truths of the Spirit to those who are poor in His truths,we then will become more like Jesus the Christ who is that perfect treasure in heaven.

I’m not entirely sure what you are trying to say with Matthew 19:21 by leaving out the most important part of that verse…. “THEN COME FOLLOW ME.”

Are you trying to say that if you want to be perfect you have to go sell what you have and give to the poor so that you will have treasures in heaven but don’t have to follow God’s command and order?

Or as you claim in the last paragraph, all we have to do is give our great and vast amount of knowledge to those who don’t know Christ so that we then become perfect and can miserly collect our treasures in heaven? Just asking because that is what it sounds like in the out of context quote.

“go and sell your possessions and give to the poor” was exposing the young ruler’s heart. Jesus wasn’t setting terms for salvation here by ‘works’ (IE. selling possessions or "acknowledging His Truths to others".

He knew the young ruler loved himself and his possessions more than he did in keeping the commandments and love for his neighbor. There were only 6 of the 10 given. And second the young ruler lacked true faith that involved a willingness to surrender all to Christ. (“and come follow me” the completion of your verse 21)

Jesus wasn’t giving a statement of salvation by charity or generosity or acknowledgment of His Truths given out, but rather He was demanding first place in the young ruler’s life. The young ruler failed the test and refused to place Jesus first in his life (evidence in vs 22)

Also Col 1:28 what is your take on ‘teaching every man in all wisdom’? Do you mean the wisdom of God or what man considers ‘wise’ in his own eyes? (Proverbs 26:1-16)

Colossians 2:16-23 helps in understanding the ‘perfect’ or spiritual maturity in 1:28 putting it in context rather than just another random verse. With maturity, we do become more like Jesus.

 

[The Robster]

If we are in Christ then we are perfect. We are blameless when we stand before God and Jesus' blood perpetually cleanses us. I mean we're a new creation with new dna. Our old self is crucified with Him. When God looks at you He sees you at your best. You're all decked out in your bridgeroom outfit. We're a king and a priest on this planet so I don't understand why some Christians can't embrace that and believe it. You are righteous in God's eyes 24hrs a day/7 days a week. No matter how bad you miss the mark some days, it doesn't change you being blameless before God. Becoming a more mature Christian and producing fruit for the Lord is different than being what you are in Christ. This is a big problem within the Body of Christ today. Many Christians do not walk in these truths. They read them int he Bible and they can quote these wonderful truths but they don't believe they are that nor do they walk like it. I can't tell you how many Christians I come across that still talk about themselves as if they are sinners. Your debt has been settled witht he Lord. Quit talking and thinking about sin and walk in these truths and you will resist and reject sin so much better.

 

[sunshineaaks]

If we are in Christ then we are perfect. We are blameless when we stand before God and Jesus' blood perpetually cleanses us. I mean we're a new creation with new dna. Our old self is crucified with Him. When God looks at you He sees you at your best. You're all decked out in your bridgeroom outfit. We're a king and a priest on this planet so I don't understand why some Christians can't embrace that and believe it. You are righteous in God's eyes 24hrs a day/7 days a week. No matter how bad you miss the mark some days, it doesn't change you being blameless before God. Becoming a more mature Christian and producing fruit for the Lord is different than being what you are in Christ. This is a big problem within the Body of Christ today. Many Christians do not walk in these truths. They read them int he Bible and they can quote these wonderful truths but they don't believe they are that nor do they walk like it. I can't tell you how many Christians I come across that still talk about themselves as if they are sinners. Your debt has been settled witht he Lord. Quit talking and thinking about sin and walk in these truths and you will resist and reject sin so much better.

Are you without sin?

 

[The Robster]

Are you without sin?

I still sin, but I rest easy knowing that every sin is forgiven. And that when I ask the Lord for forgiveness it is done and He FORGETS them. I'm not over 2000 years old. Everyone of the sins of my life, past, present and future were yet future when Jesus died on the Cross and took my sins. Are you over 2000 years old? Why do Christians have such difficulty wrapping their minds around this biblical fact? Why are so many Christians sin conscious rather than being conscious of being God's righteousness and wearing the robe of righteousness all day long and being conscious that Jesus' blood cleansed you of every sin of your life? Christians spend way too much time being sin conscious as opposed to being conscious of what being a new creation is all about. We are the righteousness of God on this planet. Our debt is settled with God. The enemy will never stop trying to tempt us to sin. And if you do, just ask for forgiveness and be done with it instead of trying to be self righteous and find ways to punish yourself and to wallow in self pity because you committed a sin.

 

[sunshineaaks]

I still sin, but I rest easy knowing that every sin is forgiven. And that when I ask the Lord for forgiveness it is done and He FORGETS them. I'm not over 2000 years old. Everyone of the sins of my life, past, present and future were yet future when Jesus died on the Cross and took my sins. Are you over 2000 years old? Why do Christians have such difficulty wrapping their minds around this biblical fact? Why are so many Christians sin conscious rather than being conscious of being God's righteousness and wearing the robe of righteousness all day long and being conscious that Jesus' blood cleansed you of every sin of your life? Christians spend way too much time being sin conscious as opposed to being conscious of what being a new creation is all about. We are the righteousness of God on this planet. Our debt is settled with God. The enemy will never stop trying to tempt us to sin. And if you do, just ask for forgiveness and be done with it instead of trying to be self righteous and find ways to punish yourself and to wallow in self pity because you committed a sin.

By ‘forgets them’ (sins) do you mean like does not bring them up again like a nagging wife does or He ‘forgets them’ like an absent minded professor who forgets things?

You claim that “Jesus’ blood cleansed you of every sin in your life” and yet you say you ‘still sin’ which is it?

Have you ever heard the prisoner say how sorry he/she is when they sit in the courtroom? I am left to ask, are they sorry they got caught (not sincere sorrow for a sin) or were they really sorry for what they did in taking full responsibility for what they did AND then admitting that they DESERVE the consequence (true sorrow for a sin).

People can superficially ask God to forgive them but go right back to what they were doing the next day believing they can come to God tomorrow to ask Him to forgive; all the while having no intention of turning from that sin.

People don’t have to find ways to punish themselves for sin, God’s quite capable of doing that without our help. Good examples might be the Christian man who slips and has an adulterous affair and gets aids. He repents of his sin whole heartedly but that doesn’t take away the consequence of his sin which he accepts as a result of his sin. Like David, who lost his first born son as a consequence for his sin, we must take our own consequence and learn from them.

Self righteous? Hardly. Self righteous comes in when a person believes they can sin repeatedly because Jesus died over 2000 years ago for all their past, present and future sins. Self righteous is the one who believes they can repeatedly sin without any consequence or repercussion.

Self pity is another self absorbed attribute that has nothing to do with God, repentance, remorse for sin or sorrow for continued sin against God.

WE are not the righteousness of God. Not one of us could ever be that good. Christ IN us IS the righteousness of God. Jesus being the ONLY one good enough, righteous enough to please God in every way IS our righteousness.

In another post you claim that we are ‘new creation with new DNA” could you give scientific proof of this? DNA from a new born child who grows up and then accepts Christ and shows that their DNA is new? I think I must have missed that article in Science Weekly. Could you elaborate please,

 

[The Robster]

By ‘forgets them’ (sins) do you mean like does not bring them up again like a nagging wife does or He ‘forgets them’ like an absent minded professor who forgets things?

You claim that “Jesus’ blood cleansed you of every sin in your life” and yet you say you ‘still sin’ which is it?

Have you ever heard the prisoner say how sorry he/she is when they sit in the courtroom? I am left to ask, are they sorry they got caught (not sincere sorrow for a sin) or were they really sorry for what they did in taking full responsibility for what they did AND then admitting that they DESERVE the consequence (true sorrow for a sin).

People can superficially ask God to forgive them but go right back to what they were doing the next day believing they can come to God tomorrow to ask Him to forgive; all the while having no intention of turning from that sin.

People don’t have to find ways to punish themselves for sin, God’s quite capable of doing that without our help. Good examples might be the Christian man who slips and has an adulterous affair and gets aids. He repents of his sin whole heartedly but that doesn’t take away the consequence of his sin which he accepts as a result of his sin. Like David, who lost his first born son as a consequence for his sin, we must take our own consequence and learn from them.

Self righteous? Hardly. Self righteous comes in when a person believes they can sin repeatedly because Jesus died over 2000 years ago for all their past, present and future sins. Self righteous is the one who believes they can repeatedly sin without any consequence or repercussion.

Self pity is another self absorbed attribute that has nothing to do with God, repentance, remorse for sin or sorrow for continued sin against God.

WE are not the righteousness of God. Not one of us could ever be that good. Christ IN us IS the righteousness of God. Jesus being the ONLY one good enough, righteous enough to please God in every way IS our righteousness.

In another post you claim that we are ‘new creation with new DNA” could you give scientific proof of this? DNA from a new born child who grows up and then accepts Christ and shows that their DNA is new? I think I must have missed that article in Science Weekly. Could you elaborate please,

Seriously man is it really so hard to understand what the bible says about your sins and how Jesus took them at the Cross? When I sin, I ask God for forgivenes and I remind myself that every one of my sins were taken and forgiven by Jesus' blood nearly 2000 years ago. One of the big problems we have within Christianity today is that so many Christians over complicate and try to intellectualize every scripture to the point that they end up not understanding the scriptures. Jesus did not forgive me of my sins until Oct 31, 2010. They are forgiven for my entire life. And yes WE are the righteousness of God in Christ. The Bible says so. I think its prudent for you to spend a little more time in this area of the Word before you make statements contrary to what the Word says about every believer, about YOU. These scriptures speak for themselves. Yes sir I am what the Bible says I am. If you and other Christians want to be something else then by all means, I won't stop you. But I will always confess and believe what God says I am in Jesus Christ. Your righteousness is a gift from Jesus so stop being so self righteous and declaring yourself unworthy of that gift from Jesus and declaring yourself unworthy of calling yourself God's righteousness. Praise Jesus!


1 Corinthians 1:30 (Amplified Bible)

30But it is from Him that you have your life in Christ Jesus, Whom God made our Wisdom from God, [revealed to us a knowledge of the divine plan of salvation previously hidden, manifesting itself as] our Righteousness [thus making us upright and putting us in right standing with God], and our Consecration [making us pure and holy], and our Redemption [providing our ransom from eternal penalty for sin].


2 Corinthians 5:21 (Amplified Bible)

21For our sake He made Christ [virtually] to be sin Who knew no sin, so that in and through Him we might become [[a]endued with, viewed as being in, and examples of] the righteousness of God [what we ought to be, approved and acceptable and in right relationship with Him, by His goodness].


Romans 8:1 (Amplified Bible)


1THEREFORE, [there is] now no condemnation (no adjudging guilty of wrong) for those who are in Christ Jesus, who live [and] walk not after the dictates of the flesh, but after the dictates of the Spirit.



Ephesians 2:10 (Amplified Bible)

10For we are God's [own] handiwork (His workmanship), [a]recreated in Christ Jesus, [born anew] that we may do those good works which God predestined (planned beforehand) for us [taking paths which He prepared ahead of time], that we should walk in them [living the good life which He prearranged and made ready for us to live].


2 Corinthians 5:17 (Amplified Bible)

17Therefore if any person is [ingrafted] in Christ (the Messiah) he is a new creation (a new creature altogether); the old [previous moral and spiritual condition] has passed away. Behold, the fresh and new has come!

 

[RJ]

I still sin, but I rest easy knowing that every sin is forgiven. And that when I ask the Lord for forgiveness it is done and He FORGETS them. I'm not over 2000 years old. Everyone of the sins of my life, past, present and future were yet future when Jesus died on the Cross and took my sins. Are you over 2000 years old? Why do Christians have such difficulty wrapping their minds around this biblical fact? Why are so many Christians sin conscious rather than being conscious of being God's righteousness and wearing the robe of righteousness all day long and being conscious that Jesus' blood cleansed you of every sin of your life? Christians spend way too much time being sin conscious as opposed to being conscious of what being a new creation is all about. We are the righteousness of God on this planet. Our debt is settled with God. The enemy will never stop trying to tempt us to sin. And if you do, just ask for forgiveness and be done with it instead of trying to be self righteous and find ways to punish yourself and to wallow in self pity because you committed a sin.

I agree with a lot of what you say. I am sure that there are those that "wallow" in it as you mention.

God said that he would never look at our sin again but, your thought on forgiveness I am not too sure of.

If our sin debt is paid in full, why do you ask for forgiveness?
Everytime you ask for forgiveness is Jesus going to be crucified again?What do you do if you forget a sin? Isn't that a lot like what God said about the 10 Commandments, in that, if you don't do all of them perfectly, all the time, then you are still in sin?

If you are going to ask for forginess, I think you would have to do it every day, I just don't see us getting by one day witout some sort of sin in our lives.
God looks at us and sees no sin because he sees Jesus Christ and in him ( and he in us) we are Righteous, Holy and Blameless not of our own accord, because not one, no not one of us are worthy. It is just like it is not our fruits (works) but the one who lives in us that we bear.

I see too many people that are in bondage because of asking for forgiveness; they have a bad or negative feeling (unclean) if they don't do it every day, or they are forgetting some or they haven't asked it in a while.

I think that one of the truths that sets you free, is the "Finality of The Cross"... why ask God for what he has already done?

I would rather live in the peace that, the one who lives in me, will let me know when I have done wrong and will convict me to make it right, otherwise, I know I have already been forgiven. It's not that we are perfect but the one inside of us all is perfect.

It's not that I don't care about sin, I do and I hate it. And it's not that I don't look at, when I see it I do but, it's that God said he wouldn't look at it any more!

 

[sunshineaaks]

Seriously man is it really so hard to understand what the bible says about your sins and how Jesus took them at the Cross? When I sin, I ask God for forgivenes and I remind myself that every one of my sins were taken and forgiven by Jesus' blood nearly 2000 years ago. One of the big problems we have within Christianity today is that so many Christians over complicate and try to intellectualize every scripture to the point that they end up not understanding the scriptures. Jesus did not forgive me of my sins until Oct 31, 2010. They are forgiven for my entire life. And yes WE are the righteousness of God in Christ. The Bible says so. I think its prudent for you to spend a little more time in this area of the Word before you make statements contrary to what the Word says about every believer, about YOU. These scriptures speak for themselves. Yes sir I am what the Bible says I am. If you and other Christians want to be something else then by all means, I won't stop you. But I will always confess and believe what God says I am in Jesus Christ. Your righteousness is a gift from Jesus so stop being so self righteous and declaring yourself unworthy of that gift from Jesus and declaring yourself unworthy of calling yourself God's righteousness. Praise Jesus!


1 Corinthians 1:30 (Amplified Bible)

30But it is from Him that you have your life in Christ Jesus, Whom God made our Wisdom from God, [revealed to us a knowledge of the divine plan of salvation previously hidden, manifesting itself as] our Righteousness [thus making us upright and putting us in right standing with God], and our Consecration [making us pure and holy], and our Redemption [providing our ransom from eternal penalty for sin].


2 Corinthians 5:21 (Amplified Bible)

21For our sake He made Christ [virtually] to be sin Who knew no sin, so that in and through Him we might become [[a]endued with, viewed as being in, and examples of] the righteousness of God [what we ought to be, approved and acceptable and in right relationship with Him, by His goodness].


Romans 8:1 (Amplified Bible)


1THEREFORE, [there is] now no condemnation (no adjudging guilty of wrong) for those who are in Christ Jesus, who live [and] walk not after the dictates of the flesh, but after the dictates of the Spirit.



Ephesians 2:10 (Amplified Bible)

10For we are God's [own] handiwork (His workmanship), [a]recreated in Christ Jesus, [born anew] that we may do those good works which God predestined (planned beforehand) for us [taking paths which He prepared ahead of time], that we should walk in them [living the good life which He prearranged and made ready for us to live].


2 Corinthians 5:17 (Amplified Bible)

17Therefore if any person is [ingrafted] in Christ (the Messiah) he is a new creation (a new creature altogether); the old [previous moral and spiritual condition] has passed away. Behold, the fresh and new has come!

Excellent verses proclaiming Jesus righteous! Thank you!

Self righteous is considering one's self to be God's righteousness. The lack of self righteousness is to know Jesus is God's righteousness in us. We are nothing without Him.

Here are a few questions I think you might have missed in the previous post.

By ‘forgets them’ (sins) do you mean like does not bring them up again like a nagging wife does or He ‘forgets them’ like an absent minded professor who forgets things?

In another post you claim that we are ‘new creation with new DNA” could you give scientific proof of this? DNA from a new born child who grows up and then accepts Christ and shows that their DNA is new? I think I must have missed that article in Science Weekly. Could you elaborate please,

Thanks.

 

[sunshineaaks]

I agree with a lot of what you say. I am sure that there are those that "wallow" in it as you mention.

God said that he would never look at our sin again but, your thought on forgiveness I am not too sure of.

If our sin debt is paid in full, why do you ask for forgiveness?
Everytime you ask for forgiveness is Jesus going to be crucified again?What do you do if you forget a sin? Isn't that a lot like what God said about the 10 Commandments, in that, if you don't do all of them perfectly, all the time, then you are still in sin?

If you are going to ask for forginess, I think you would have to do it every day, I just don't see us getting by one day witout some sort of sin in our lives.
God looks at us and sees no sin because he sees Jesus Christ and in him ( and he in us) we are Righteous, Holy and Blameless not of our own accord, because not one, no not one of us are worthy. It is just like it is not our fruits (works) but the one who lives in us that we bear.

I see too many people that are in bondage because of asking for forgiveness; they have a bad or negative feeling (unclean) if they don't do it every day, or they are forgetting some or they haven't asked it in a while.

I think that one of the truths that sets you free, is the "Finality of The Cross"... why ask God for what he has already done?

I would rather live in the peace that, the one who lives in me, will let me know when I have done wrong and will convict me to make it right, otherwise, I know I have already been forgiven. It's not that we are perfect but the one inside of us all is perfect.

It's not that I don't care about sin, I do and I hate it. And it's not that I don't look at, when I see it I do but, it's that God said he wouldn't look at it any more!

Couldn't have said it better myself!


I just wanted to reiterate a part of your post in agreement and add a few verses to confirm to make sure there is understanding and make sure I didn’t misunderstand or read into something that wasn’t there?:

I would rather live in the peace that, the one who lives in me, will let me know when I have done wrong and will convict me to make it right, otherwise, I know I have already been forgiven. It's not that we are perfect but the one inside of us all is perfect.

It's not that I don't care about sin, I do and I hate it. And it's not that I don't look at, when I see it I do but, it's that God said he wouldn't look at it any more!

The verses I believe that go along with this are:

First, we are forgiven (1John 1:9) When we have the attitude of repentance and ask forgiveness His grace is incredible!

Second in Matthew 18:21-22, we are to forgive others infinitely as God forgives us. (this does not mean we can forgive their sin, just the person since God is the only one who can forgive sin)

Third in 1John 3:8-9 the believer will not continue in a sinful lifestyle but will “Examine yourself to see whether you are in the faith; test yourself. Do you not realize that Christ Jesus is in you – unless, of course, you fail the test?” (2 Corinthians 13:5) We as Christians will stumble, but we do not live a lifestyle of continual, unrepentant sin. Paul maybe said it best in Romans 7:15 who hated sin, repented of it and then asked for God’s grace to over come it. (Romans 7:24-25)

Grace is a gift from God (Ephesians 2:8) and when we sin, the Spirit convicts with a godly sorrow (2 Corinthians 7:10-11). We aren’t condemned (Romans 8:1) because we are in Christ, but Grace does not give us the excuse to go on sinning (Romans 6:1-2).

It can not be emphasized enough that we are given grace upon grace (John 1:16) just for the fact that we are still on this earth and continually bombarded with sin; some we fall to and others gladly rejected.

When we give a gift to someone and see it rusting in the back yard, it kind of hurts. Is God much different with the Gift He has given only to see it misused?

Why would someone knowingly sin and claim that Jesus forgave years ago when there is no repentance of it? Why would anyone knowingly live a shadowy live when Christ offers to make us clean and whole in the bright sight of God?

(sorry, I know that men and women speak such alien languages, I have to make sure I understand what someone else is saying….. most the time anyway)

 

[soberxp]

I’m not entirely sure what you are trying to say with Matthew 19:21 by leaving out the most important part of that verse…. “THEN COME FOLLOW ME.”

Are you trying to say that if you want to be perfect you have to go sell what you have and give to the poor so that you will have treasures in heaven but don’t have to follow God’s command and order?

Or as you claim in the last paragraph, all we have to do is give our great and vast amount of knowledge to those who don’t know Christ so that we then become perfect and can miserly collect our treasures in heaven? Just asking because that is what it sounds like in the out of context quote.

“go and sell your possessions and give to the poor” was exposing the young ruler’s heart. Jesus wasn’t setting terms for salvation here by ‘works’ (IE. selling possessions or "acknowledging His Truths to others".

He knew the young ruler loved himself and his possessions more than he did in keeping the commandments and love for his neighbor. There were only 6 of the 10 given. And second the young ruler lacked true faith that involved a willingness to surrender all to Christ. (“and come follow me” the completion of your verse 21)

Jesus wasn’t giving a statement of salvation by charity or generosity or acknowledgment of His Truths given out, but rather He was demanding first place in the young ruler’s life. The young ruler failed the test and refused to place Jesus first in his life (evidence in vs 22)

Also Col 1:28 what is your take on ‘teaching every man in all wisdom’? Do you mean the wisdom of God or what man considers ‘wise’ in his own eyes? (Proverbs 26:1-16)

Colossians 2:16-23 helps in understanding the ‘perfect’ or spiritual maturity in 1:28 putting it in context rather than just another random verse. With maturity, we do become more like Jesus.

all wisdom good or bad.......:shade: cool
being pedantic I'm super than yours.
being your watchman..........I have told you the truth:"but you have been warned depend on what you have said."
you should read all of my posts.

 

[The Robster]

I agree with a lot of what you say. I am sure that there are those that "wallow" in it as you mention.

God said that he would never look at our sin again but, your thought on forgiveness I am not too sure of.

If our sin debt is paid in full, why do you ask for forgiveness?
Everytime you ask for forgiveness is Jesus going to be crucified again?What do you do if you forget a sin? Isn't that a lot like what God said about the 10 Commandments, in that, if you don't do all of them perfectly, all the time, then you are still in sin?

If you are going to ask for forginess, I think you would have to do it every day, I just don't see us getting by one day witout some sort of sin in our lives.
God looks at us and sees no sin because he sees Jesus Christ and in him ( and he in us) we are Righteous, Holy and Blameless not of our own accord, because not one, no not one of us are worthy. It is just like it is not our fruits (works) but the one who lives in us that we bear.

I see too many people that are in bondage because of asking for forgiveness; they have a bad or negative feeling (unclean) if they don't do it every day, or they are forgetting some or they haven't asked it in a while.

I think that one of the truths that sets you free, is the "Finality of The Cross"... why ask God for what he has already done?

I would rather live in the peace that, the one who lives in me, will let me know when I have done wrong and will convict me to make it right, otherwise, I know I have already been forgiven. It's not that we are perfect but the one inside of us all is perfect.

It's not that I don't care about sin, I do and I hate it. And it's not that I don't look at, when I see it I do but, it's that God said he wouldn't look at it any more!

You know what brother I like your approach even better and I'm going to start putting it in practice this day forward. From now on when I happen to sin, rather than ask for forgiveness I'm just going to say that I am the righteousness of God in Christ. Jesus, You are my holiness and perfection. And just rest knowing that all my sins were forgiven. Glad I jumped into this thread. I appreciate it brother. Your approach is definitely the way to go! Thanks.