Question regarding Commands of Jesus

[TheTruthWithin37]

James 3:15-17 (KJV)

15 This wisdom descendeth not from above, but is earthly, sensual, devilish.

16 For where envying and strife is, there is confusion and every evil work.

17 But the wisdom that is from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, and easy to be intreated, full of mercy and good fruits, without partiality, and without hypocrisy.

It is enough for students to be like their teachers, and servants like their masters. If the head of the house has been called Beelzebul, how much more the members of his household! Matthew 10:25

 

[Chad4Him]

What do you think is deceitful about what we are saying?

We are just simply saying that we believe that we must follow and listen to what Jesus says, (The Sermon on the Mount for example). We are taking a passage that Jesus had said (John 12:43-50), he is talking about why he came, and that we will be judged by what he said, it's not just one "isolated verse". Believe me when I say we try to make sure we're not just cherry picking. This is why we believe we must do the things that he has said to us, we are taking in context and we are making sure we're not reading between the lines. We both agree that not many are listening to Jesus and that we must do more of it, but all we are saying is that we should do what he said simply because that is what we are going to be judged by. I do not believe there is anything deceitful or wrong with that. We are just taking Jesus literally, I don't believe that we will be punished for that.

I appreciate this conversation and don't mean to be calling names!

I'll try to simplify it...

I think it is possible for someone to literally follow all of Jesus' commands and still be lost at the judgement.

Do you? If so, how or why?

 

[Bendito]

It is enough for students to be like their teachers, and servants like their masters. If the head of the house has been called Beelzebul, how much more the members of his household! Matthew 10:25

What does the master teach? here is what he commanded us!
Matthew 22:37-40 (KJV)

37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.

38 This is the first and great commandment.

39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

Jesus said "All of the law, and all of the teachings of all the prophets is based on these two commandments."
So, do these two commandments and all of the rest are kept too, just by keeping these two.

 

[Dovegiven]

I agree that following Jesus' commands proves our love......

I think it was @TheTruthWithin37 who admitted that they still did have possessions, but were using them for the gospel. So taking this into account - you admit that Jesus' commands still are not being followed completely (selling and forsaking all). I don't say this to accuse of hypocrisy but perhaps to point out that the overall focus of our life and what we use our possessions for is what Jesus really meant, and it looks like in actual practice, that is probably how you are practicing it too :smile:

Good post! I believe every time Jesus spoke to a single person, a command was given to that particular person to obey to overcome idolatry or some other form of false belief, simple "unbelief" perhaps, a weakness to fully believe. I take it that Jesus recognozed the rich young ruler was willing to follow Jesus on certain terms, such as retaining his own power. I doubt all people were thensforth required to divest all their wealth to follow him. If I did that now I would have to depend on a Uber driver to get me to appointments on time. That would have in times past included sound/video equipment not to be rained upon. Getting that service in a remote town is still often very difficult. I believe God provides the means of preaching the gospel. If I said "Lord, I gave my van away, so couldn't do that last trip." He might say back "That was the van I provided for that. Who told you to give it away?" I can say that because I've done that three times on my own mental congnition.

Well, I finally had enough sense to realize what God intended me to possess, and for what reasons. Everything has its own time and purpose.

It took me several years to get beyond giving a token of myself to the Lord, then more to solidly tithing, then more to tithe on the gross. As I got older and generating income became harder to do, the more I had to yield by faith, and all the more people around me turned to ask for helps from me. It's difficult to meet someone's need while with an empty pocket. I tried that a while, finding that not effective in ministry to the hurting. "Why, you must be as poor as me!" What good is to them that you gave it all to the poor years ago, and remain empty of pocket on that belief basis?

No. When you check out at the grocery, using a card asks "Do you want cash back?" Say Yes. Select an amount the Spirit advises. Then be easy to supply some or all of that to someone the Lord leads to you. If what they need matches what you made available, you and the Spirit will say together "WOW" and do a spiritual High Five together. That's a much smaller "ticket" to witness Christ than a church spending hundreds per person in a revival.

 

[Lily Miller]

I appreciate this conversation and don't mean to be calling names!

I'll try to simplify it...

I think it is possible for someone to literally follow all of Jesus' commands and still be lost at the judgement.

Do you? If so, how or why?

If I am being honest with you, I cannot give you an answer to that, and it's because it's not my call whether someone gets into heaven or does not get into heaven. God judges us based on our hearts, which is mentioned in the Bible, but I believe if we do the things that Jesus taught, we will be judged according to our works, and how our hearts are, are they filled with wickedness or love. That's between us and God.

 

[Chad4Him]

I'll get back to you.. Busy now.

But just a quick question.. Do you guys work for bitcoin?

 

[Dovegiven]

What does the master teach? here is what he commanded us!
Matthew 22:37-40 (KJV)

37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.

38 This is the first and great commandment.

39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

Jesus said "All of the law, and all of the teachings of all the prophets is based on these two commandments."
So, do these two commandments and all of the rest are kept too, just by keeping these two.

I believe it took all the rest of the New Testament to teach how to keep those. There are way too many ways to live that out for everyone to always know which is the commanded way.

I was a private consultant forester called to survey a property line. When I arrived, the rancher said he really just wanted me to move a property corner to make it look authentic and set according to an old deed. By his family records the rock post belonged "by leaps and bounds" rules hundreds of years old to be in a certain spot. A fence running about 25 feet to the side of a county road singled out about 400 mature loblolly pine trees of high value, encroaching on this man's property which appeared to lie on the other side of the public road. The neighbor had just died, so this man wanted it all corrected since the dispute was never settled. I told him he owed me nothing for the trip or advice, so would he please listen to advice? I asked him, "Being a fine Christian around here, as I have heard, did you love your neighbor." He said he did. "I wish you had settled this before he died. But now his son, who knows how the property lays out, would know such a change. Would you sell that love for him and his son for those tree values, even though you have a survey giving you rights?" The piled stones on the forty corner remained in place, sealed by our handshake.

I told that to demonstrate how difficult it might be for someone in a difficult position to know exactly how to love their neighbor. The many parables and commands of Jesus and his apostles do a great job wrapping up that issue.

 

[Bendito]

I believe it took all the rest of the New Testament to teach how to keep those. There are way too many ways to live that out for everyone to always know which is the commanded way.

I was a private consultant forester called to survey a property line. When I arrived, the rancher said he really just wanted me to move a property corner to make it look authentic and set according to an old deed. By his family records the rock post belonged "by leaps and bounds" rules hundreds of years old to be in a certain spot. A fence running about 25 feet to the side of a county road singled out about 400 mature loblolly pine trees of high value, encroaching on this man's property which appeared to lie on the other side of the public road. The neighbor had just died, so this man wanted it all corrected since the dispute was never settled. I told him he owed me nothing for the trip or advice, so would he please listen to advice? I asked him, "Being a fine Christian around here, as I have heard, did you love your neighbor." He said he did. "I wish you had settled this before he died. But now his son, who knows how the property lays out, would know such a change. Would you sell that love for him and his son for those tree values, even though you have a survey giving you rights?" The piled stones on the forty corner remained in place, sealed by our handshake.

I told that to demonstrate how difficult it might be for someone in a difficult position to know exactly how to love their neighbor. The many parables and commands of Jesus and his apostles do a great job wrapping up that issue.

I'm not arguing how the Word teaches how...I'm simply saying that the 'Do's' are not as complicated as some suggest.

 

[Dovegiven]

I appreciate this conversation and don't mean to be calling names!

I'll try to simplify it...

I think it is possible for someone to literally follow all of Jesus' commands and still be lost at the judgement.

Do you? If so, how or why?

No. John contains powerful statements of Jesus concerning believing on him. He appealed to the higher authority of salvation, the Father, throug him. Nowhere do I know of doing such things leaves a person lost. Folowing all Jesus' teachings (comandments) leads only to eternal life. In addition, Jesus will bring to earth rewards for what believers did do, those works that don't burn up, you know, the kindling, the wood, hay, stubble of life. That suggests he recognizes some or even most of our lives amount to rubbish to burned up, yet some will be saved as though by fire.
1 Corinthians 3:15 (KJV)
15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.

Primary:
John 5:24 (KJV)
24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.

John 6:35
35 And Jesus said unto them, I am the bread of life: he that cometh to me shall never hunger; and he that believeth on me shall never thirst.

John 6:40
40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

John 6:47
47 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me hath everlasting life.

John 7:38
38 He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water.

John 12:44
44 Jesus cried and said, He that believeth on me, believeth not on me, but on him that sent me.

John 12:46
46 I am come a light into the world, that whosoever believeth on me should not abide in darkness.

John 14:12
12 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father.

Proof of our belief is in living out his commandments. Some of us won't even live long enough to experience an opportunity to obey every command. I can think back in time recognizing I missed some through ignorance, and some by wilful disobedience due to what appeared to me as excessive demand considering my resources. We all learn faith-living all our lives.

 

[Dovegiven]

I'm not arguing how the Word teaches how...I'm simply saying that the 'Do's' are not as complicated as some suggest.

I must admit my problem is trying to keep up with an active thread like this one, so please forgive any appearance of slight from me. By the time I finish a comment it usually falls out of context. :wink: Looking back I think I was trying to piggy back your comment, trying to support it.

 

[Bendito]

I must admit my problem is trying to keep up with an active thread like this one, so please forgive any appearance of slight from me. By the time I finish a comment it usually falls out of context. :wink: Looking back I think I was trying to piggy back your comment, trying to support it.

LOL I know what you mean..

 

[Chad4Him]

If I am being honest with you, I cannot give you an answer to that, and it's because it's not my call whether someone gets into heaven or does not get into heaven. God judges us based on our hearts, which is mentioned in the Bible, but I believe if we do the things that Jesus taught, we will be judged according to our works, and how our hearts are, are they filled with wickedness or love. That's between us and God.

I am on the same page with you as far as making a final judgement on a person's life - that is not for us to do, although we are given signs in the Word of God and can sometimes see if someone is living in sin etc. I am not asking you to judge a certain individual.

I am just wondering what you think about the "possibility" of a person doing all the right things (outwardly) yet not being a child of God.

 

[Lily Miller]

I am on the same page with you as far as making a final judgement on a person's life - that is not for us to do, although we are given signs in the Word of God and can sometimes see if someone is living in sin etc. I am not asking you to judge a certain individual.

I am just wondering what you think about the "possibility" of a person doing all the right things (outwardly) yet not being a child of God.

Can you clarify what you mean, are you meaning someone a Pharisee of Jesus’ time, or someone who is of a different religion?

 

[Chad4Him]

Can you clarify what you mean, are you meaning someone a Pharisee of Jesus’ time, or someone who is of a different religion?

I am meaning anyone today who reads the Bible.

 

[Sue D.]

Yeah bro, that is exactly the way we see it. I


Yeah bro, that is exactly the way I see it. I am sorry if this post twice, my computer went nuts for a second.

Hey Chad,

I base my salvation on the things that Jesus commanded his followers to do. No one is perfect, we all mess up a lot. So we needed Jesus' sacrifice to cover our multitude of sins. So it is a combination of both. Let's look at it like this we are on strait path, if we are walking on the strait path and we mess up and fall off the path, then that's when Jesus' blood covers our sins. But, to walk on the path we have to follow the rules that Jesus told us to. A lot of people think what Paul spoke, "that this is the gospel I preached to you, that Jesus died for your sins" (Corinthians 15:1-3) is the gospel. I do agree that he did die for our sins but that's not the gospel. In (1Peter 4:17) says, "it is time for the judgement to begin with God's family, and if it begins with us, what about the one's who did not obey the gospel". If the gospel is only believing that Jesus died for our sins, then how do we obey that?

Just some thoughts, I hope this helps you understand what I see it takes to get salvation. Also, "he who endures to the end will be saved" (Mathew 24:13). Has anyone achieved salvation yet?

The 1 Corinthians 15 passage starts out saying ..."I want to remind you of the Gospel I preached to you....... by this Gospel you are saved....... that Jesus Christ died for our sins, according to the Scripture, that He was buried, that He was raised on the third day, according to the Scriptures....." -- you need to add vs 4 -- according to God's Word that IS the Gospel unto salvation.

Then there is also Romans 10:9-10 "That if you confess with your mouth, Jesus Is Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved. For it is with your heart that you believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth that you confess and are saved,"

Jesus Christ paid for our salvation on the cross -- God will see us through the blood of Christ -- just as though we'd never sinned. The only 'rules' to follow would be to 'love the Lord our God with all our heart, soul, mind and our neighbor as ourselves'. Our lives should be lived to glorify God. And we have the great commission in Matthew 28:19-20 Go to all the world and preach the Gospel -making disciples -- baptizing them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit.

 

[Lily Miller]

I am meaning anyone today who reads the Bible.

So when you say “someone doing all the right things (outwardly) but isn’t a child of God” you are talking about people who read the Bible today? Not anyone of a different religion or a Pharisee of Jesus’ day, just someone who reads the Bible? Are they proclaiming to be a child of God or no? And to you what does it mean to be a child of God (to you)? I guess I’m trying to get the full perspective of what you are asking me, sorry I want to be able rock give you a good answer with thought. And I am confused on what you are asking.

 

[Chad4Him]

So when you say “someone doing all the right things (outwardly) but isn’t a child of God” you are talking about people who read the Bible today? Not anyone of a different religion or a Pharisee of Jesus’ day, just someone who reads the Bible? Are they proclaiming to be a child of God or no? And to you what does it mean to be a child of God (to you)? I guess I’m trying to get the full perspective of what you are asking me, sorry I want to be able rock give you a good answer with thought. And I am confused on what you are asking.

Well I am not meaning to ask a very complicated question . I was thinking of someone who is reading the Bible today and proclaiming they are a child of God. Is there a way that they could be seeming to do all the right things and follow the commands and yet not actually be a child of God (as in... saved)

 

[Chad4Him]

Well I am not meaning to ask a very complicated question :smile: . I was thinking of someone who is reading the Bible today and proclaiming they are a child of God. Is there a way that they could be seeming to do all the right things and follow the commands and yet not actually be a child of God (as in... saved)

Someone who at the judgment would hear the words "sorry I never knew you... Depart from me."

 

[Lily Miller]

Well I am not meaning to ask a very complicated question :smile: . I was thinking of someone who is reading the Bible today and proclaiming they are a child of God. Is there a way that they could be seeming to do all the right things and follow the commands and yet not actually be a child of God (as in... saved)

If you read the Bible and keep Jesus’ commands, you are a child of God. If you do not read the Bible but still keep Jesus’ commands, you are a child of God, by sincerity.

The verse that leads me to believe that, is this::
Romans 2:14-15
“14 (Indeed, when Gentiles, who do not have the law, do by nature things required by the law, they are a law for themselves, even though they do not have the law, 15 since they show that the requirements of the law are written on their hearts, their consciences also bearing witness, and their thoughts now accusing, now even defending them.)

 

[Lily Miller]

Someone who at the judgment would hear the words "sorry I never knew you... Depart from me."

You have to walk in all the light that you have, You have to be sincere, and if you have seen what Jesus said and you continue to do it then that is what you will be judged by. But if you are being ignorant, purposely, then you will be judged by that. If you are shown His teachings and you act like you’ve never seen them or heard them you are being ignorant. You have to continually ask Jesus to show you truth, and you have to be able to actually do it because that is what you are required to do as a Christian, listen to the person you are following.

I hope that these responses answer your questions.