Should Christians masturbate?

[levipattar]

Please dont drag Song of Solomon into this (as someone brought in here and I dont want to qoute). It is NOT AT ALL SEXUAL. The love between Christ and the Church is completely pure. That is why He calls His church, my sister and my spouse. He calls 'sister' because the love is as pure as love towards a sister and 'spouse' because the love is as intense as love towards a spouse.

 

[healinhandsman]

my theology on this situation is simple:

If you are being convicted about it then stop, if you do not allow it to get in the way of your personal relationship with Jesus Christ and is only to "be healthy" then continue doing it without conviction. :shade:

 

[fuzzball]

my theology on this situation is simple:

If you are being convicted about it then stop, if you do not allow it to get in the way of your personal relationship with Jesus Christ and is only to "be healthy" then continue doing it without conviction. :shade:

And with that simple statement you have boiled down a huge issue to one easy to understand and follow rule.

 

[SpiritLedEd]

Please dont drag Song of Solomon into this (as someone brought in here and I dont want to qoute). It is NOT AT ALL SEXUAL.

In my opinion Song of Solomon is very much sexual but not at all lustful.The romantic attractions depicted in SS are not to be spiritualized to the point that humans cannot feel them.

SLE

 

[palms25]

hello eveyone im new to all this and i am not a christian just a seeker so you may be a bit wary of what i say but this all seems rather odd to me! Why would God create such a wonderful thing as sex and such a wonderful thing as the human body and forbid us from enjoying it? why is there so much shame and guilt attached to something that is so normal and so unharming of others? I suspect that God finds this all a bit odd too!

 

[levipattar]

In my opinion Song of Solomon is very much sexual but not at all lustful. The romantic attractions depicted in SS are not to be spiritualized to the point that humans cannot feel them. SLE

I would disagree completely with you according to the faith that I have received from my God. Song of Solomon is NOT AT ALL SEXUAL. God cannot talk sex with His sister. I would like to remind you once again that sex only began after the fall of man.

Psalms 51:5
Behold, I was shapen in iniquity; and in sin did my mother conceive me.
Sex was not the requirement for becoming fruitful and multiplying on this earth for man else the Lord would not have blessed man of the blessing before the fall. He would have multiplied in some other way and only He knows how; but not by sex.

Genesis 1:28
And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth.

Song of Solomon is completely spiritual. The word of God has to be understood spiritually.

Song of Solomon 4
1 Behold, thou art fair, my love; behold, thou art fair; thou hast doves' eyes within thy locks: thy hair is as a flock of goats, that appear from mount Gilead.
2 Thy teeth are like a flock of sheep that are even shorn, which came up from the washing; whereof every one bear twins, and none is barren among them.

How romantic must be for a man to think that his spouse's teeth are like a flock of sheep!

Carnal mind can never understand God nor can it please Him. So if we need to know God then we need to think spiritually.
Lastly, if you try to understand His word esp. Song of Solomon or about the Church the bride and Christ the bridegroom carnally then you will all be confused.

God bless you.

 

[jesusdriven]

I would disagree completely with you according to the faith that I have received from my God. Song of Solomon is NOT AT ALL SEXUAL. God cannot talk sex with His sister. I would like to remind you once again that sex only began after the fall of man.

Psalms 51:5
Behold, I was shapen in iniquity; and in sin did my mother conceive me.
Sex was not the requirement for becoming fruitful and multiplying on this earth for man else the Lord would not have blessed man of the blessing before the fall. He would have multiplied in some other way and only He knows how; but not by sex.

Genesis 1:28
And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth.

Song of Solomon is completely spiritual. The word of God has to be understood spiritually.

Song of Solomon 4
1 Behold, thou art fair, my love; behold, thou art fair; thou hast doves' eyes within thy locks: thy hair is as a flock of goats, that appear from mount Gilead.
2 Thy teeth are like a flock of sheep that are even shorn, which came up from the washing; whereof every one bear twins, and none is barren among them.

How romantic must be for a man to think that his spouse's teeth are like a flock of sheep!

Carnal mind can never understand God nor can it please Him. So if we need to know God then we need to think spiritually.
Lastly, if you try to understand His word esp. Song of Solomon or about the Church the bride and Christ the bridegroom carnally then you will all be confused.

God bless you.

Wow! You don't really believe this do you? Are we reading the same Bible?

 

[levipattar]

Wow! You don't really believe this do you? Are we reading the same Bible?

We do read the same Bible but sadly, we understand it differently. One understands spiritually and another carnally. Needless to say, this makes a LOT OF DIFFERENCE.

 

[jesusdriven]

I am not trying to start an argument, but I would like you to show us your scripture references to prove what you are saying. Because the two that you provided don't prove anything you said about not having sex before the fall of man.

 

[SpiritLedEd]

One understands spiritually and another carnally. Needless to say, this makes a LOT OF DIFFERENCE.

That's a prettry pompous, prideful sounding statement, my friend. you seem to be claiming that you are on the spiritual high road and those who disagree with you are not.

SLE

 

[fuzzball]

Man is one of the very few species that has "recreational" sex. Most of the rest of the animal kingdom has little or no interest in sex except during very narrow windows of estrus, or the ability to concieve. Some species only have this ability for a short time each year and some more often, but show no interest in anything sexual at other times.

I consider this a gift from a loving GOD. I simply don't think GOD gave us this gift as any kind of temptation or punishment. I believe just the opposite in fact. I believe that to deny our sexuality has caused more trrouble than wrongful use of it.

Just look at the mess the Catholic church is in. While they are not the only ones who have these problems they definitely are the highest profile group. The celibacy of the Roman Catholic church has led to fornication with each other and members of their congregations, pedophelia, homosexuality, and a host of lesser sexual sins. And if there is any truth at all to some of the older rumors there are also some babies who were victims of abortion or infanticide buried in more than one Catholic church basement.

 

[dooglebie]

hello eveyone im new to all this and i am not a christian just a seeker so you may be a bit wary of what i say but this all seems rather odd to me! Why would God create such a wonderful thing as sex and such a wonderful thing as the human body and forbid us from enjoying it? why is there so much shame and guilt attached to something that is so normal and so unharming of others? I suspect that God finds this all a bit odd too!

In order to answer these questions satisfactorily, you would have to have an understanding of God's word. God doesn't forbid us from enjoying the bodies He gave us but we must submit ourselves to Him in all things.

We are to enjoy them according to His will and not our own. We are to put Him first in all things. ALL things. I would recommend reading Matthew, chapter 6, verses 19-34. It does a good job of stressing how important it is that we put God first and above everything else. How not to worry about these things but to put everything in His care and be obedient to His will.

One thing I have noticed in this thread (my first one as I, too, am a newbie) is that there are a lot of "I's" here. "I feel..." "I think..." "My opinion..." "My point of view..." It doesn't matter what we feel, what we think, and our opinions are meaningless unless they are in agreement with, and bring glory to, God's word and kingdom. (John, chapters 14 & 15 make good points on this too)

Bottom line is we don't decide what is right or what is wrong. God does. If we love Him then we must be willing to live our lives on His terms and not our own. (Matthew 10:24-39 makes some good points)

I would also recommend that you invest in a good study Bible. Choose a version that is easy for you to read and understand (the King James Version would be a good addition to accompany the easier to understand Bible like a New International Version. The KJV has a little more content and info. than the others.) Or you can use an online Bible reference site.

In parting, I leave you with this little tidbit to research in your Bible. 1Peter 4:1-11

Yay! I just completed my first post! =)

 

[dooglebie]

I would also recommend that you invest in a good study Bible. Choose a version that is easy for you to read and understand (the King James Version would be a good addition to accompany the easier to understand Bible like a New International Version. The KJV has a little more content and info. than the others.) Or you can use an online Bible reference site.

Like this site! It has a Bible reference section already for your scripture perusing enjoyment!

Yay! I just did my first quote! LOL!

 

[palms25]

Hello dooglebie,
thank you for your reply oh and congratulations on working out the intricacies of this site iim only just getting the hang of it myself.

It does a good job of stressing how important it is that we put God first and and above everything else. How not to worry about these things but to put everything in His care and be obedient to His will.

Im not actually worried about this but i do find the whole thing rather odd and even a little disturbing. The very fact that the original question was asked implies some guilt on the part of the writer and almost certainly on the part of many readers.
Gods will as you put it could hardly be anything other than the enjoyment and experience of his creation. The only way we can err in this is in the understanding of a punishing God that needs to be obeyed.
this is certainly an old understanding of God and one (i would suggest) that hasnt served us particularly well. A new understanding of God proclaims that God is love. There is nothing to feel guilty about for God loves us unconditionally. once we are released from these bonds of guilt we are free to manifest the greatest version of who we truly are. If this version of grandness includes sexuality then so be it. What we feel does indeeed matter. God communicates thru feelings. and yes we do decide what is right and what is wrong we have been deciding this (and changing our minds about this) for generations. Undoubtldy we will continue to change our minds about what is right and what is wrong, but that is ok. For each time we make such a decison we are recreating who we are.
Thanks again for your post and for your recommended readings which i am sure if time allows i will endevour to get to.
God bless

 

[levipattar]

That's a prettry pompous, prideful sounding statement, my friend. you seem to be claiming that you are on the spiritual high road and those who disagree with you are not.

Thank you brother or sister for the comment you have made. Is this just because I requested you not to drag Song of Solomon into this?
Fine. Well I better take the onslaught. You seem to be badly hurt, which I did not intend to, because I said you need to think spiritually. I am sorry you felt the pinch. I don't care what you think of me 'pompous, prideful....', but remember I am a defender of faith. Woe unto them that call good evil and evil good.
But because you force me to say this then so be it. I would like to ask you few questions so please answer me.

1. Do you understand Song of Solomon is written about Christ and His Church or about just a simple man and a woman? If you say that it is about a simple man and a woman, then I dont want to talk further because I take the word of God spiritually. If it is about Christ and His Church, then in what kind of godly mind do you think that Christ having sex with His Church? (Lord forgive me).
2. As you said that Song of Solomon is sexual (not lustful), do you go and talk to the world about your sexual life with others? Do you do that? I am surprised if you are doing that because only the worldly sinful people are right now doing it. The Bible is open for everyone, both for believers and unbelievers. There are many churches who refuse to read this wonderful and PURE scripture just because of this false understanding. If it is so with the people who claim to know the word of God then what about the unbelievers who are offended by this misunderstanding of the Scripture? You do nothing better than strengthening them in getting offended.
3. In the same book, you will find the Lord calling the same woman, both His Spouse and His Sister as well. Do you think that a man can have sex with his sister? How shameful to think of it!
4. What do you say? Is sex carnal or spiritual? If it is carnal, then our Lord is Spirit which is contrary to carnal things. And if you say sex is spiritual, then goodbye friend, it is wise not to discuss with you.

God bless you!

 

[dooglebie]

Gods will as you put it could hardly be anything other than the enjoyment and experience of his creation. The only way we can err in this is in the understanding of a punishing God that needs to be obeyed.
this is certainly an old understanding of God and one (i would suggest) that hasnt served us particularly well. A new understanding of God proclaims that God is love. There is nothing to feel guilty about for God loves us unconditionally. once we are released from these bonds of guilt we are free to manifest the greatest version of who we truly are. If this version of grandness includes sexuality then so be it. What we feel does indeeed matter. God communicates thru feelings. and yes we do decide what is right and what is wrong we have been deciding this (and changing our minds about this) for generations. Undoubtldy we will continue to change our minds about what is right and what is wrong, but that is ok. For each time we make such a decison we are recreating who we are.
Thanks again for your post and for your recommended readings which i am sure if time allows i will endevour to get to.

I must say, for someone who isn't a Christian, you seem to know more about God than His elect do. lol! To even begin to try, one must have the mind of Christ. Apart from Him it simply isn't possible. -1Corinthians 2:9-16

It's difficult to "talk shop" with someone who isn't a part of business, if you know what I mean. So I'll just point out a few quick truths from God's own word.

Understanding God's nature:
God is unchanging. As He was in the beginning, so is He now. We don't decide what His nature is or should be. God is God, not who we decide He is. -Hebrews 6:17

Unconditional love without discipline:
A father loves his child but if that child does wrong, should that child be surprised when he is punished by his father? It isn't done out of anger or spite but love and for the benefit of the child. What is to be gained if we are allowed to get away with disobeying our parents? Who would want to put up with someone who has been allowed to do whatever they wanted, no matter how wrong, their entire lives and never once been disciplined for it? Not good. -Hebrews 12:2-11,

God doesn't work that way. We reap what we sow and if what we sow is bad or evil then God allows that bad or evil harvest to come into our lives and, like it our not, we will reap it. -Galatians 6:7-9, Genesis 3:8-23

An understanding of God that hasn't served us well:
God doesn't serve us. We serve God. Even Jesus, Himself was not exempt from this rule. -Matthew 4:10, Mark 10:45 & Luke 4:8, 1Corinthians 2:9-16

God communicates through feelings:
God communicates with His elect through His word, His spirit, and prayer. I may "feel" like punching my boss in the face so that righteous justice is done but God's word teaches me to respect authority, have patience in long-suffering, show compassion, and be quick to forgive and slow to anger. Satan is the one who uses feelings to coerce us into action. -Luke 11:23-28, Matthew 6:6 & Matthew 16:23, 1Corinthians 9-16

Recreating ourselves (?)
I have to admit, I find this concept rather pompous and absurd but I think I understand what you mean, so bear with me on this one, okay?

We have already been created as a complete and whole being. We were made in God's own image. What's to recreate? If man hasn't gotten things right by now then it's obviously not going to happen. Ever. Not according to his will, anyway. Doing things our own way has done nothing but make a giant mess out of ourselves and our world. We aren't able to make things right. We are, and always will be, a house divided.
-Genesis 5:1 & 2, Ephesians 2:10 & 4:20-24, Luke 11:17

In closing, I'll say that this has been a lot of fun because I'm by no means a Bible scholar and I had to do some digging to find all of these scriptures. I would also reiterate that you should get your hands on a good study Bible. Most Christians won't give credence to any argument you make unless you can back it up with scripture. The Bible is the one, real, and incorrupt truth this world has. If you can't back yourself up with God's word then you have no credit in the eyes of His elect. Just a little FYI for you.

This was fun! We should do it again sometime.
I'm praying that God gets a hold on you.

 

[WangLili]

Unless one is going to beget child, apart from this, should be no sex. Not for pleasure. This is the christian principle.

Huh? Can you explain that last line.. Do you mean that married couples can't have sex for pleasure?

 

[dooglebie]

Getting back on topic...

No. We shouldn't masturbate. Jesus is our first love; We must put Him above all things, including our spouses and our desires. The point was made that masturbation isn't a sin if the object of your desire is your spouse but it's a sin if you fantasize about someone else. Respectfully, that's like saying it isn't a sin to steal if you are going hungry but it's a sin if done for personal gain. A sin is a sin.

Speaking from personal experience, masturbation is always induced by lust. Whether it's a lust toward someone or a lust for pleasure, lust is the motivator.

Sounds to me like one would be putting one's own wants and desires first; before the Savior. That's idolatry. He must always come first in our lives. In all things. Easier said then done, I know but that doesn't change the truth. We are called to be disciplined and self-controlled to please God and for the glory of His kingdom. Masturbation is a self-pleasing act. It has nothing to do with pleasing God. How is God glorified by an act of self-pleasure?

-Titus 2:12, 1Peter 4:7, 1Peter 5:8, & 2Peter 1:6.

The peace of Christ to all of you!

 

[Veracity]

I am beginning to think that sex has become like a doctrine, and none of us are getting the full understanding.

Sexual sin is one that causes a person to fall personally. Someone who is in and out of relationships has become addicted to finding someone new to stir those feelings of excitement and desire that they long for, if they lose that "feeling" they must begin to search it out again, even if they are married, or in a relationship already.

There is something much higher than anything we can get, or very few get, about "sex" and Gods intentions regarding it. David fell for the spirit of lust...why?

If the marriage bed is un defiled, what exactly does that mean?

The Song of Solomon is about a man and a woman, and about The love Christ has for the Church. So somewhere in there we have missed something.

Marriage has lost it's meaning, the Head of the family, which is supposed to be the man is absent...most of the time looking for new sexual excitement...women feel ignored and unloved so they go seek another lover...the Church is apparently the female of Gods love, He is faithful, He cares unconditionally He seeks us out and keeps us together and safe...but the Church has looked for love somewhere else in better doctrines than what the apostles taught...and no one cares, they make excuses for changing things, sometimes based on one scripture, or some regular plain human being who had a dream...Gods word is all we have, and we should really be hiding it in our heart so that we the "church" can please the Lord and Glorify Him.

Really, too many people get stuck in one belief system or man made standards and never take the time to fully compare it with the other scriptures in the bible. I am not saying one belief is more wrong or more right...all I know is we need to work out our own salvation, the path is narrow, many are called few are chosen, and on that day to many He will say, "Depart from me, I never knew you".

The Church is like a cheating fiance/spouse, and she had better get herself back where she needs to be.

 

[GitRDunn]

Yes, I know all this. That's is why I said at the start of this thread that I stopped masturbating because I knew it to be wrong. I just wanted to open this thought out there to other christians as it's obvious that not all christians believe it's wrong, which confuses me. since you can't masturbate without having lustful thoughts or fantasies. and it's a sin to lust.

First I want to say that I think the physical act of masturbation is not a sin, the sin is the lustful thoughts and fantasies. And, at least for some people, it is possible to masturbate without having lustful thoughts or fantasies.

No. We shouldn't masturbate. Jesus is our first love; We must put Him above all things, including our spouses and our desires. The point was made that masturbation isn't a sin if the object of your desire is your spouse but it's a sin if you fantasize about someone else. Respectfully, that's like saying it isn't a sin to steal if you are going hungry but it's a sin if done for personal gain. A sin is a sin.

Speaking from personal experience, masturbation is always induced by lust. Whether it's a lust toward someone or a lust for pleasure, lust is the motivator.

Sounds to me like one would be putting one's own wants and desires first; before the Savior. That's idolatry. He must always come first in our lives. In all things. Easier said then done, I know but that doesn't change the truth. We are called to be disciplined and self-controlled to please God and for the glory of His kingdom. Masturbation is a self-pleasing act. It has nothing to do with pleasing God. How is God glorified by an act of self-pleasure?

-Titus 2:12, 1Peter 4:7, 1Peter 5:8, & 2Peter 1:6.

The peace of Christ to all of you!

Going to the bathroom is a self-pleasing act. It has nothing to do with pleasing God. How is God glorified by an act of self-pleasure?

Sleeping is a self-pleasing act. It has nothing to do with pleasing God. How is God glorified by an act of self-pleasure?

Taking a pain killer is a self-pleasing act. It has nothing to do with pleasing God. How is God glorified by an act of self-pleasure?

You see how this argument is not a good one to use against masturbation?