What Is HELL ?

[Bill Taylor]

Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honour and power everlasting. Amen. (1 Tim 6:13-16)King James Version.

Butch5, I am a context freak and find it important to consider what the highlighted, by me, states. If your are correct then the same must apply to the ¿saved? But my thought; we are instructed in:

1 Corinthians 15:35-58
​

New King James Version
​

​

A Glorious Body​

35 But someone will say, “How are the dead raised up? And with what body do they come?” 36 Foolish one, what you sow is not made alive unless it dies. 37 And what you sow, you do not sow that body that shall be, but mere grain—perhaps wheat or some other grain. 38 But God gives it a body as He pleases, and to each seed its own body.

39 All flesh is not the same flesh, but there is one kind [a]of flesh of men, another flesh of animals, another of fish, and another of birds.

40 There are also [b]celestial bodies and [c]terrestrial bodies; but the glory of the celestial is one, and the glory of the terrestrial is another. 41 There is one glory of the sun, another glory of the moon, and another glory of the stars; for one star differs from another star in glory.

42 So also is the resurrection of the dead. The body is sown in corruption, it is raised in incorruption. 43 It is sown in dishonor, it is raised in glory. It is sown in weakness, it is raised in power. 44 It is sown a natural body, it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body. 45 And so it is written, “The first man Adam became a living being.” The last Adam became a life-giving spirit.

46 However, the spiritual is not first, but the natural, and afterward the spiritual. 47 The first man was of the earth, made[d] of dust; the second Man is [e]the Lord from heaven. 48 As was the [f]man of dust, so also are those who are made of dust; and as is the heavenly Man, so also are those who are heavenly. 49 And as we have borne the image of the man of dust, we[g] shall also bear the image of the heavenly Man.

Our Final Victory​

50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; nor does corruption inherit incorruption. 51 Behold, I tell you a [h]mystery: We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed— 52 in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. 53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. 54 So when this corruptible has put on incorruption, and this mortal has put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written: “Death is swallowed up in victory.”

55 “O[i] Death, where is your sting?
O Hades, where is your victory?”

56 The sting of death is sin, and the strength of sin is the law. 57 But thanks be to God, who gives us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.

58 Therefore, my beloved brethren, be steadfast, immovable, always abounding in the work of the Lord, knowing that your labor is not in vain in the Lord.
When men are ressurrected to eternal life and to eternal death we are, none of us created from the dust of the Earth but it is our Spirits and there is scripture teaching we will not have sexual relations with one another but will be like the angels, sexless. I do not see the Immortal Body in the same light but rather as a Spiritual Being.

I might be all wet but it is food for thought.

 

[B-A-C]

Aion and aionios are the same word. One is the noun and the other is the adjective

No that is incorrect.

Regarding the definition, who is more likely to be correct, modern theologians or Jesus and the apostles? I

We don't even have to depend on someones theology we can look at secular dictionaries which have no interest in a specific theology.

The words have not changed, nor have they changed meaning.

translate greek to english "aionios" - Google Search

As long as you keep insisting the Bible is wrong, and you are right, you will have this on-going conflict.

 

[Butch5]

No that is incorrect.

No, it's not. Look at a Greek lexicon. Just Google, " what is the adjective form of aion?" You'll find that it's aionios.

We don't even have to depend on someones theology we can look at secular dictionaries which have no interest in a specific theology.

The words have not changed, nor have they changed meaning.

Do secular dictionaries trump what Jesus and the apostles said?

As long as you keep insisting the Bible is wrong, and you are right, you will have this on-going conflict.

I'm not insisting the Bible is wrong. I'm insisting the translation is wrong. I 100% believe there will be aionios punishment. I just don't believe aionios means eternal.

Tell me, where do the wicked get their eternal life from?

 

[B-A-C]

Tell me, where do the wicked get their eternal life from?

Here we go round in circles once more. This is known as bait and switch in some circles.

I don't know that they have "eternal life". I do know they will be tormented forever and ever. They will face eternal punishment.

Now for sake of argument let's say youre right, ( youre not, but.. )

Lets say it isn't forever, lets say it's just a few billion years, would that make you feel better? What does that really change?
I would say after 5 seconds, they'll be ready to leave.

 

[Butch5]

Butch5, I am a context freak and find it important to consider what the highlighted, by me, states. If your are correct then the same must apply to the ¿saved? But my thought; we are instructed in:

1 Corinthians 15:35-58​

​

​

New King James Version​

​

​

​

A Glorious Body​

35 But someone will say, “How are the dead raised up? And with what body do they come?” 36 Foolish one, what you sow is not made alive unless it dies. 37 And what you sow, you do not sow that body that shall be, but mere grain—perhaps wheat or some other grain. 38 But God gives it a body as He pleases, and to each seed its own body.

39 All flesh is not the same flesh, but there is one kind [a]of flesh of men, another flesh of animals, another of fish, and another of birds.

40 There are also [b]celestial bodies and [c]terrestrial bodies; but the glory of the celestial is one, and the glory of the terrestrial is another. 41 There is one glory of the sun, another glory of the moon, and another glory of the stars; for one star differs from another star in glory.

42 So also is the resurrection of the dead. The body is sown in corruption, it is raised in incorruption. 43 It is sown in dishonor, it is raised in glory. It is sown in weakness, it is raised in power. 44 It is sown a natural body, it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body. 45 And so it is written, “The first man Adam became a living being.” The last Adam became a life-giving spirit.

46 However, the spiritual is not first, but the natural, and afterward the spiritual. 47 The first man was of the earth, made[d] of dust; the second Man is [e]the Lord from heaven. 48 As was the [f]man of dust, so also are those who are made of dust; and as is the heavenly Man, so also are those who are heavenly. 49 And as we have borne the image of the man of dust, we[g] shall also bear the image of the heavenly Man.

Our Final Victory​

50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; nor does corruption inherit incorruption. 51 Behold, I tell you a [h]mystery: We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed— 52 in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. 53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. 54 So when this corruptible has put on incorruption, and this mortal has put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written: “Death is swallowed up in victory.”

55 “O[i] Death, where is your sting?
O Hades, where is your victory?”

56 The sting of death is sin, and the strength of sin is the law. 57 But thanks be to God, who gives us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.

58 Therefore, my beloved brethren, be steadfast, immovable, always abounding in the work of the Lord, knowing that your labor is not in vain in the Lord.
When men are ressurrected to eternal life and to eternal death we are, none of us created from the dust of the Earth but it is our Spirits and there is scripture teaching we will not have sexual relations with one another but will be like the angels, sexless. I do not see the Immortal Body in the same light but rather as a Spiritual Being.

I might be all wet but it is food for thought.

Jesus was raised in the same body that went into the grave.

But, again, Bill, this goes to presuppositions. If we start with the idea that man is an immaterial being living in a temporary flesh body of course we'll read spiritual body as being a spirit. However, the word spiritual is an adjective. An adjective gives the qualities of the noun to something. Heavenly is also an adjective. If I had some ice cream and I said, "this ice cream is heavenly," how many people do you suppose would understand me to be saying the ice cream came from heaven? Hopefully none. They would understand that I'm applying the qualities of Heaven to the ice cream. So, if spiritual is an adjective, which it is, then it would apply the qualities of the Spirit to the resurrected bodies.

It all depends on what we bring to the text.

 

[Butch5]

Here we go round in circles once more. This is known as bait and switch in some circles.

I don't know that they have "eternal life". I do know they will be tormented forever and ever. They will face eternal punishment.

Now for sake of argument let's say youre right, ( youre not, but.. )

Lets say it isn't forever, lets say it's just a few billion years, would that make you feel better? What does that really change?
I would say after 5 seconds, they'll be ready to leave.

It's not bait and switch. It's that you guys won't answer the question. The dead can't be tormented, they're dead. In order to be tormented they have to be alive. In order to be alive they have to get life from God. If that torment is eternal then they have to get eternal life from God. Yet we find no such thing in Scripture.

The time frame wouldn't matter because they're dead. If someone falls into a fire they don't live long. Once they're dead the don't feel any pain. If they feel nothing what is the point in burning dead bodies for eternity?

What's the point of resurrecting the wicked? It's so they can be judged. If they were just spirits that were going to burn for eternity what does their decayed body have to do with anything? They're resurrected because they're judged in the body. So, if the judgment is eternal then they will be living in there bodies for eternity in the Lake of Fire. However, Isaiah tells us about the Lake of fire and it's corpses that burning not living people.

You guys have latched onto the word aion and are ignoring a ton of evidence against this doctrine.

For instance, David tells us that the thoughts of the dead perish.


Put not your trust in princes,
Nor in the son of man, in whom there is no help.
His breath goeth forth, he returneth to his earth;
In that very day his thoughts perish.
(Ps 146:3-4)
The Holy Bible: King James Version.

Yet, there is a multitude of Christians who say that Lazarus and the Rich Man is literal and an actual historical event.

Who is wrong. The prophet King David or the Christians who claim that the story of Lazarus and the Rch man is an actual event? Someone has to be wrong because the two statements contradict one another. But, people will just ignore what David said and keep on claiming that the parable is an actual event.

Many clain the Lake of Fire will burn forever, yet the Prophet Jeremiah said it will one day be made Holy to the Lord. It will no more be plucked up or thrown down.

If it's going to be restored and made Holy how can I burn forever?

I could on and on with problems this doctrine has with Scipture. But, people just ignore them. Instead they latch onto the word aion try to make argument.

Here's a site that deals with ancient Hebrew. Note the definition of olam. Aion is the Greek word that the translators of the Septuagint used to translate olam

Hebrew Word Definition: Eternity | AHRC

Defining Hebrew words within their original cultural context.

www.ancient-hebrew.org

 

[Bill Taylor]

Jesus was raised in the same body that went into the grave.

But, again, Bill, this goes to presuppositions. If we start with the idea that man is an immaterial being living in a temporary flesh body of course we'll read spiritual body as being a spirit. However, the word spiritual is an adjective. An adjective gives the qualities of the noun to something. Heavenly is also an adjective. If I had some ice cream and I said, "this ice cream is heavenly," how many people do you suppose would understand me to be saying the ice cream came from heaven? Hopefully none. They would understand that I'm applying the qualities of Heaven to the ice cream. So, if spiritual is an adjective, which it is, then it would apply the qualities of the Spirit to the resurrected bodies.

It all depends on what we bring to the text.

I see why you are, recently, accused of bait and switch, we are not dealing with nouns, verbs, adjetives and/other word classes. You just trashed the context of the scripture and dove head first into nonsense. In a class you would fail there. Please try again and discuss the context without word class avoidance. Truuely, the answer smells of contempt.

 

[Butch5]

I see why you are, recently, accused of bait and switch, we are not dealing with nouns, verbs, adjetives and/other word classes. You just trashed the context of the scripture and dove head first into nonsense. In a class you would fail there. Please try again and discuss the context without word class avoidance. Truuely, the answer smells of contempt.

It's interesting that you talk about trashing thr context. Then say "our spirit". The only spirit in man is that of God. His breath of life. That begs the question what is this "our spirit" that you speak of?

If it's not the same body it's not resurrection it's reincarnation.

 

[Bill Taylor]

It's interesting that you talk about trashing thr context. Then say "our spirit". The only spirit in man is that of God. His breath of life. That begs the question what is this "our spirit" that you speak of?

If it's not the same body it's not resurrection it's reincarnation.

You will not man up then and address Biblical Context? Seem petty.

 

[Butch5]

You will not man up then and address Biblical Context? Seem petty.

State your case. All of this is really a moot point until someone can tell us how the wicked get eternal life

 

[Bill Taylor]

State your case. All of this is really a moot point until someone can tell us how the wicked get eternal life

I will overaccommodate your pettiness this time but in consideration to the Admin. here I'll do it often with long quotes.

1 Corinthians 15:35-58

New King James Version

A Glorious Body
35 But someone will say, “How are the dead raised up? And with what body do they come?” 36 Foolish one, what you sow is not made alive unless it dies. 37 And what you sow, you do not sow that body that shall be, but mere grain—perhaps wheat or some other grain. 38 But God gives it a body as He pleases, and to each seed its own body.

39 All flesh is not the same flesh, but there is one kind [a]of flesh of men, another flesh of animals, another of fish, and another of birds.

40 There are also celestial bodies and [c]terrestrial bodies; but the glory of the celestial is one, and the glory of the terrestrial is another. 41 There is one glory of the sun, another glory of the moon, and another glory of the stars; for one star differs from another star in glory.

42 So also is the resurrection of the dead. The body is sown in corruption, it is raised in incorruption. 43 It is sown in dishonor, it is raised in glory. It is sown in weakness, it is raised in power. 44 It is sown a natural body, it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body. 45 And so it is written, “The first man Adam became a living being.” The last Adam became a life-giving spirit.
46 However, the spiritual is not first, but the natural, and afterward the spiritual. 47 The first man was of the earth, made[d] of dust; the second Man is [e]the Lord from heaven. 48 As was the [f]man of dust, so also are those who are heavenly. 49 And as we have borne the image of the man of dust, we[g] shall also bear the image of the heavenly Man.

 

[Butch5]

I will overaccommodate your pettiness this time but in consideration to the Admin. here I'll do it often with long quotes.

1 Corinthians 15:35-58

New King James Version

A Glorious Body
35 But someone will say, “How are the dead raised up? And with what body do they come?” 36 Foolish one, what you sow is not made alive unless it dies. 37 And what you sow, you do not sow that body that shall be, but mere grain—perhaps wheat or some other grain. 38 But God gives it a body as He pleases, and to each seed its own body.

39 All flesh is not the same flesh, but there is one kind [a]of flesh of men, another flesh of animals, another of fish, and another of birds.

40 There are also celestial bodies and [c]terrestrial bodies; but the glory of the celestial is one, and the glory of the terrestrial is another. 41 There is one glory of the sun, another glory of the moon, and another glory of the stars; for one star differs from another star in glory.

42 So also is the resurrection of the dead. The body is sown in corruption, it is raised in incorruption. 43 It is sown in dishonor, it is raised in glory. It is sown in weakness, it is raised in power. 44 It is sown a natural body, it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body. 45 And so it is written, “The first man Adam became a living being.” The last Adam became a life-giving spirit.
46 However, the spiritual is not first, but the natural, and afterward the spiritual. 47 The first man was of the earth, made[d] of dust; the second Man is [e]the Lord from heaven. 48 As was the [f]man of dust, so also are those who are heavenly. 49 And as we have borne the image of the man of dust, we[g] shall also bear the image of the heavenly Man.

Ok, you posted the Scripture again. Are you going to make a case? I think it's obvious we understand this passage differently. I don't read minds so I'll need you to explain how you understand this.

 

[Bill Taylor]

See post 221, I accommodated your selfserving attitude once, now, please act like a Christian and go back and read the instructions in post #221 as any Christian should have and it appears you are the only one missing what I said. You will not drag this into the outhouse with our attitude. Please answer the question. I did not give you an opinion, I gave you scripture clearly stating we are all created in His Image and Yehovah is eternal.

 

[Butch5]

See post 221, I accommodated your selfserving attitude once, now, please act like a Christian and go back and read the instructions in post #221 as any Christian should have and it appears you are the only one missing what I said. You will not drag this into the outhouse with our attitude. Please answer the question. I did not give you an opinion, I gave you scripture clearly stating we are all created in His Image and Yehovah is eternal.

And I asked you explain how you understand the passage. I don't read minds.

We are made in God's image. Can you raise the dead? Can you walk on water? Can you cure the sick? Can you lay the foundations of the earth? Can you tell the sea it's limits? Using the reasoning above you should be able to do all of these too.

 

[Bill Taylor]

And I asked you explain how you understand the passage. I don't read minds.

We are made in God's image. Can you raise the dead? Can you walk on water? Can you cure the sick? Can you lay the foundations of the earth? Can you tell the sea it's limits? Using the reasoning above you should be able to do all of these too.

Comprehension problem? Or is being rude and playing ignorant common? My previous post was not just scripture, it ask for an answer that you are pretending not to see... very unchrist like!

 

[Butch5]

Bill, I'm a very sarcastic person by nature. You're making this conversation difficult.

In post 221 you quoted my post.

"Butch5 said:
Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honour and power everlasting. Amen. (1 Tim 6:13-16)King James Version."

Then you said that in context it must also apply to the Saved. You are correct. No man, means no man, saved or unsaved.

Then you posted this passage from 1 Corinthians.

"1 Corinthians 15:35-58
New King James Version
A Glorious Body​

35 But someone will say, “How are the dead raised up? And with what body do they come?” 36 Foolish one, what you sow is not made alive unless it dies. 37 And what you sow, you do not sow that body that shall be, but mere grain—perhaps wheat or some other grain. 38 But God gives it a body as He pleases, and to each seed its own body.

39 All flesh is not the same flesh, but there is one kind [a]of flesh of men, another flesh of animals, another of fish, and another of birds.

40 There are also [b]celestial bodies and [c]terrestrial bodies; but the glory of the celestial is one, and the glory of the terrestrial is another. 41 There is one glory of the sun, another glory of the moon, and another glory of the stars; for one star differs from another star in glory.

42 So also is the resurrection of the dead. The body is sown in corruption, it is raised in incorruption. 43 It is sown in dishonor, it is raised in glory. It is sown in weakness, it is raised in power. 44 It is sown a natural body, it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body. 45 And so it is written, “The first man Adam became a living being.” The last Adam became a life-giving spirit.

46 However, the spiritual is not first, but the natural, and afterward the spiritual. 47 The first man was of the earth, made[d] of dust; the second Man is [e]the Lord from heaven. 48 As was the [f]man of dust, so also are those who are made of dust; and as is the heavenly Man, so also are those who are heavenly. 49 And as we have borne the image of the man of dust, we[g] shall also bear the image of the heavenly Man.

Our Final Victory​

50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; nor does corruption inherit incorruption. 51 Behold, I tell you a [h]mystery: We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed— 52 in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. 53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. 54 So when this corruptible has put on incorruption, and this mortal has put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written: “Death is swallowed up in victory.”

55 “O[i] Death, where is your sting?
O Hades, where is your victory?”

56 The sting of death is sin, and the strength of sin is the law. 57 But thanks be to God, who gives us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.

58 Therefore, my beloved brethren, be steadfast, immovable, always abounding in the work of the Lord, knowing that your labor is not in vain in the Lord."

Then you said,

"When men are ressurrected to eternal life and to eternal death we are, none of us created from the dust of the Earth but it is our Spirits and there is scripture teaching we will not have sexual relations with one another but will be like the angels, sexless. I do not see the Immortal Body in the same light but rather as a Spiritual Being.

I might be all wet but it is food for thought."

I agree with the first part of the last line.

The context in that passage is not about being a spirit. As I originally said when you posted this. Jesus was resurrected in the same body that went into the grave. If it's not the same body then it isn't resurrection, it's reincarnation.

The Greek word translated resurrection literally mean to stand again. If its a different body it's not standing again, it completely new.



For I know that my redeemer liveth, And that he shall stand at the latter day upon the earth: And though after my skin worms destroy this body, Yet in my flesh shall I see God: Whom I shall see for myself, And mine eyes shall behold, and not another; Though my reins be consumed within me.

The Holy Bible: King James Version

 

[B-A-C]

It's not bait and switch. It's that you guys won't answer the question.

For instance, David tells us that the thoughts of the dead perish

Somehow we've gone from from what Jesus and the apostles say, to what David says... but that's not "bait and switch"?

The Bible talks about "the second death". But does the Bible say this is annihilation anywhere? Does the Bible say you cease to exist anywhere? What happens to people who go to the second death,
also known as the Lake of Fire. ( Rev 20:14; Rev 21:8; ) Do they live forever, or do they just cease to exist?

Rev 14:9; Then another angel, a third one, followed them, saying with a loud voice, "If anyone worships the beast and his image, and receives a mark on his forehead or on his hand,
Rev 14:10; he also will drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is mixed in full strength in the cup of His anger; and he will be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels and in the presence of the Lamb.
Rev 14:11; "And the smoke of their torment goes up forever and ever; they have no rest day and night, those who worship the beast and his image, and whoever receives the mark of his name."

This group of people will be "tormented with fire and brimstone".. in the presence of Jesus ( the Lamb ). For how long? Forever and ever... they have no rest day and night.
You can call this eternal life if you want, or you can call it eternal death. It doesn't matter, either way they are tormented with fire forever and ever. They never have any rest from the torment.

Rev 20:10; And the devil who deceived them was thrown into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are also; and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.

Again, we have Satan, the beast, and the false prophet...

How long will they be tormented? "forever and ever". Again, call it eternal life ( if you call this living ) or call it eternal death. Call it whatever you like, but these people will feel pain "forever and ever".

Matt 25:46; "These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life."

How long will these people be punished? "eternal" punishment.

I can not see how this doesn't answer the question. Dead people will feel torment forever. You can ignore these verses if you want to.
I have yet to see you address them in any post.

There's nothing in Scripture that says man is a spirit.

Psa 146:4; His spirit departs, he returns to the earth; In that very day his thoughts perish.
Eccl 12:7; then the dust will return to the earth as it was, and the spirit will return to God who gave it.
Psa 104:29; You hide Your face, they are dismayed; You take away their spirit, they expire And return to their dust.

"His" spirit ( the man's spirit )
"their" spirit ( the person's spirit )

No, it's not. Look at a Greek lexicon. Just Google, " what is the adjective form of aion?" You'll find that it's aionios.

I have, it's not in ANY Bible I have, nor ANY lexicon I have.

Mat 25:46 "These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life."

From Strongs

αἰώνιος
aiōnios
ahee-o'-nee-os
From G165; perpetual (also used of past time, or past and future as well): - eternal, for ever, everlasting, world (began).
Total KJV occurrences: 71

From NASEC

αἰώνιος
aiōnios; from 165; eternal:—
eternal(66), eternity(1), forever(1).

From Google

https://translate.google.com/?sl=el&tl=en&text=%CE%B1%CE%B9%CF%8E%CE%BD%CE%B9%CE%BF%CF%82%20&op=translate

From concordant

The Greek Words Aiõn and Aiõnios - Concordant Publishing Concern

www.concordant.org

 

[Bill Taylor]

First, sarcasm is not a fruit of the Spirit but is a mark of a worldly life.

Quote:
42 So also is the resurrection of the dead. The body is sown in corruption, it is raised in incorruption. 43 It is sown in dishonor, it is raised in glory. It is sown in weakness, it is raised in power. 44 It is sown a natural body, it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body. 45 And so it is written, “The first man Adam became a living being.” The last Adam became a life-giving spirit.

How, for the pure glaring of this verse can you possibly, not see and understand that it speaks of the last resurrection, the resurrection of the Dead, not those in Heaven, whose spirits await, alive, to receive their Glorified Bodies? Even Lost People are created with the Image Of Yehovah, who is eternal.

You're forming personal opinions about the scriptures instead of allowing Ruah to teach you. That is a bad habit.

 

[Butch5]

First, sarcasm is not a fruit of the Spirit but is a mark of a worldly life.

Quote:
42 So also is the resurrection of the dead. The body is sown in corruption, it is raised in incorruption. 43 It is sown in dishonor, it is raised in glory. It is sown in weakness, it is raised in power. 44 It is sown a natural body, it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body. 45 And so it is written, “The first man Adam became a living being.” The last Adam became a life-giving spirit.

How, for the pure glaring of this verse can you possibly, not see and understand that it speaks of the last resurrection, the resurrection of the Dead, not those in Heaven, whose spirits await, alive, to receive their Glorified Bodies? Even Lost People are created with the Image Of Yehovah, who is eternal.

You're forming personal opinions about the scriptures instead of allowing Ruah to teach you. That is a bad habit.

I seriously doubt that the Ruah is teaching the Patonic Dualism that you're espousing here. So, I would encourage you to check the source of your teaching. The Bible teaches resurrection, not reincarnation. You've got a mixture of philosophies here. Platonic Dualism and reincarnation.

Platonic Dualism

www.webpages.uidaho.edu

 

[Br. Bear]

Greetings @Butch5

Sure, here's the link.

thanks Harry.

Patience is listed in the fruit of the Spirit.


Bless you ....><>