False teacher, prophets and doctrines.. again.

[Rhema]

So while we are on the topic of false teachers, prophets and doctrines again ...

So which gospel is that? As there are many gospels to choose from.

HI WAGGLES !!! ... good to see you again. (Maybe one day I can visit.)

Which Gospel ? Over the summer I sat down to answer that, and came up with one of our First Principles -

2) We believe that since the Father sent Jesus Christ His Son to preach the Gospel, then the Gospel is what Jesus preached, and Him alone. (Acts 13:38,39)​

​

I would gladly receive comment from you by PM as to whether this gets the message across and is written well.

Be blessed,
Rhema
( It is, of course, a Gospel of Forgiveness, not one of payment.)

PS: I almost got to your sister church in GA USA (if memory serves correctly).

 

[Jonathan_Gale]

{{ I've recently run into this "movement"(?) that declares the Gospel of the Kingdom is completely different than the Gospel of Grace. They call themselves Acts 28 Christians(?), and preach that the TRUE Gospel was only revealed to Paul. In essence, they purport that the Gospel of the Kingdom was only in force and effect while Jesus was on Earth, and tis now defunct. I have an ongoing conversation with a group of these on another forum. Quite perplexing. }}
Yes @Br. Bear, stay on OP... I know... I know... but to me, the AC28-ers seem to be preaching a false gospel, while to them, I am most definitely an evil heretic.

There is only ONE gospel, defined in 1 Cor. 15:1-11, it's all about the resurrection of Christ. As related to the OP, anybody who preaches a different gospel or bringing in confusion is not from the Christ.

 

[Jonathan_Gale]

With all due respect, Mr. Gale, I'm fairly sure you don't know what the sword of the Spirit even is.
It took me awhile to get all that false teaching from other pastors out of my head, and learn to read what was directly written.

Please read my following post, and let me know what you think (by PM, please as we are rather off OP).

Eph. 6:17 clearly states that the sword of the Spirit is the word of God. Actually as a matter of fact, information warfare is a new generation of warfare, and we're in the battleground everyday!

 

[Jonathan_Gale]

When Jesus gave that teaching, every Jew present knew without a shadow of a doubt that NOTHING was to be rendered to Caesar.

The Jewish nation had capitulated in FEAR to Rome, having lost FAITH in God.

Rhema
(Think about it.)

Have you checked out that false teaching known as "The Pledge of Allegiance" yet? (And my apologies for the presumption that you're American, but am I wrong?) No Christian should let their child utter those words of Satan. (Day after day after day after day in their government schools.)

I was taught that don't swear on anything in any name, just let your yes be yes and no be no. Again, I'm not here to discuss the pledge of allegiance, that has nothing to do with the OP. Your attempt of distraction with this is futile - and annoying.

 

[Jonathan_Gale]

Greetings and blessings to you Mr. Gale, but I'm about to ask a question that will likely get me banned.

If by "word of God" you mean the Bible, then please, just say Bible. Now the Bible does have this phrase "the word of God" (and there are two of them), but when the Bible defines "the word of God" (both of them) it does not include itself in its own definition (either of them). So if I use a phrase to mean something that it is not, don't I lose the Truth about what it is?

Rhema
(As the truth sets us free.)

Oh... and the Communist Manifesto wasn't written by the devil. Just some guy named Marx.
It's a short book, and you really should read it.... know thine enemy and all that ???

Sir, when did I say that the Communist Manifesto was written by the devil? The bible was not written by God, it's written by His people who were inspired by God, same goes to the Communist Manifesto, written by Karl Marx, but definitely inspired by the devil. I don't need to read it damn thing to know that regarding wealth distribution, "everyone according to his ability" (Matt 25:15) is changed to "everyone according to his need," that comes straight from hell. Also, I don't wanna waste time on this grand social experiment that was proven to be an abject failure more than 30 years ago when the Soviet Union collapsed.

 

[Jonathan_Gale]

So when "Yeshua" declared that all authority was given to him it wasn't true ("accomplished")?

I don thin so.

Most likely, though, it's pronoun purgatory. You said "it." Perhaps you and I are thinking about different "its."

I'm referring to His millennial kingdom, the completion of the Great Commission.

Well if it has taken you guys two thousand years and you're doing worse than when you started, y'all may want to rethink what you're doing. At this rate, he's never gonna come back.

And if I may, I'm fairly sure that what needs to be re-thunk is this "STILL under Satan's dominion." Sir, NOTHING is under Satan's dominion (power/authority). But according to your faith ??? This teaching, "STILL under Satan's dominion," is why it's still under Satan's dominion (or rather looks that way).

Under Satan's dominion or not, Satan is still present to kill, steal and destroy, and the only way to push him back is to exert the authority and power - given to Yeshua.

Well if the work you're doing isn't working, then one should obviously re-evaluate. But when you say "the word of God" I'm tempted to ask which one? (There are two, you know.)

Deut. 6-8 for starter, where all Yeshua's replies to the three temptations came from.

 

[Waggles]

There is only ONE gospel, defined in 1 Cor. 15:1-11, it's all about the resurrection of Christ.

That is not the gospel, but only a brief reference to Christ Jesus and his death, burial and resurrection for the atonement of sins. To reconcile us back to God our Father.
Paul is only addressing the doctrinal confusion in the Pentecostal Corinthian ekklesia about the resurrection of the dead.
The FULL gospel of salvation is much more extensive in doctrine and commandments that need to be believed and enacted upon.

John 3:3 Jesus answered and said to him, Amen, Amen, I say unto thee, Except one be born from above, he cannot see the kingdom of God.
4 Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born being an old man? can he enter a second time into the womb of his mother, and be born?
5 Jesus answered, Amen, Amen, I say unto thee, Except one be born of water and Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
6 What is born of the flesh is flesh; and what is born of the Spirit is spirit.
7 Marvel not that I said to thee, Ye must be born from above.
8 The Spirit breatheth where he willeth, and thou hearest his voice, but knowest not whence he cometh, and whither he goeth: so is everyone born of the Spirit.

Mark 16:15 And he said to them, Go into all the world, and preach the gospel to the whole creation.
16 Who hath believed and is baptized shall be saved; but who hath disbelieved shall be condemned.
17 And these signs shall follow them that have believed: in my name shall they cast out demons, speak with tongues;
18 and in their hands they shall take up serpents, and if they drink aught deadly, it shall in now wise hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.
19 So then the Lord Jesus, after he had spoken to them, was taken up into heaven, and sat down at the right hand of God.
20 And THEY went forth, and preached everywhere, the Lord working with them, and confirming the word by the signs that followed.

Acts 2:37 Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and the rest of the apostles, [Men] Brethren, what shall we do?
38 And Peter said unto them, Repent and be baptized each of you in the name of Jesus Christ unto remission of your sins; and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.
39 For to you is the promise, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, as many as the Lord our God shall call unto him.
40 And with many other words he testified, and exhorted them, saying, Be saved from this crooked generation.
41 They then that received his word were baptized: and in that day were added about three thousand souls.

Romans 15:18 For I dare not speak aught save the things which Christ wrought through me, for obedience of the nations, by word or deed,
19 in power of signs and wonders, in power of the Holy Spirit; so that from Jerusalem, and round about even unto Illyricum, I have fully preached the gospel of the Christ;

Galatians 1:11 But I make known to you, brethren, as to the gospel which was preached by me, that it is not after man.
12 For neither did I receive it from man, nor was I taught it, but through revelation of Jesus Christ.

Jude 1:20 But ye, beloved, building up yourselves on your most holy faith, praying in the Holy Spirit, [that is praying in tongues]
21 keep yourselves in God’s love, looking for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ unto eternal life.

 

[Jonathan_Gale]

That is not the gospel, but only a brief reference to Christ Jesus and his death, burial and resurrection for the atonement of sins. To reconcile us back to God our Father.
Paul is only addressing the doctrinal confusion in the Pentecostal Corinthian ekklesia about the resurrection of the dead.
The FULL gospel of salvation is much more extensive in doctrine and commandments that need to be believed and enacted upon.

OK, if you say so, boss. I can only tell you what I know, that if the gospel is to be summed up in five words, then the answer is in 1 Cor. 15:3 - Jesus died for my sins.

 

[Jonathan_Gale]

Well if the work you're doing isn't working, then one should obviously re-evaluate. But when you say "the word of God" I'm tempted to ask which one? (There are two, you know.)

God bless,
Rhema

May I ask, sir, that by what standard do you evaluate whether it's "working" or not? When Christ himself preached an "offensive" message, many turned away (John 6:60-71); when He was arrested, his own disciples all fled and forsook him (Matt 26:56), should the Lord himself re-evaluate?

 

[Brother Paul]

May I ask, sir, that by what standard do you evaluate whether it's "working" or not? When Christ himself preached an "offensive" message, many turned away (John 6:60-71); when He was arrested, his own disciples all fled and forsook him (Matt 26:56), should the Lord himself re-evaluate?

Sorry Jonathan but I do not see that as relative to Rhema's point at all. But you are correct. Jesus did die for our sins. The gospel of grace is that we are already going to Hell and Jesus was sent to be our redemption. Some preach and teach falsely that message in reverse which for many makes Jesus the problem and not the solution. They teach (and usually flavored by their denominational theology) that if you do not accept Jesus you are sent to Hell (that is backwards).

We are not the judge and we cannot know if ALL who did not accept Jesus go to Hell because the Bible ALSO teaches (Rev. 20:12 and elsewhere) that AFTER the 1000 year reign the rest of the dead will be raised and they will be judged according to their works as written in the BOOKS (plural, i.e., the book of remembrance AND the book of life) and we cannot know whether some of them were written into the book of life. As the Lord Himself says in Ezekiel, when an unrighteous person does what is that which God has willed is it not counted as righteousness?

At least we ought to look at the big picture for God is grace and love and merciful beyond our ability to comprehend

 

[Waggles]

Jesus died for my sins

Yeah even the Mormons and Jehovah Witnesses will state this.
The gospel is a lot more than five words.

 

[Rhema]

There is only ONE gospel, defined in 1 Cor. 15:1-11, it's all about the resurrection of Christ.

Yes, I am quite sure you believe that. But there are many others on "TheologyOnline" who ardently believe something else.
(Perhaps you could be helpful in fighting that false doctrine?)

As related to the OP, anybody who preaches a different gospel or bringing in confusion is not from the Christ.

Of course these people think YOU are the one preaching a different gospel and bringing in confusion. (I'm not an Acts 28-er, btw.)

As posted before, this is from our First Principles:

2) We believe that since the Father sent Jesus Christ His Son to preach the Gospel, then the Gospel is what Jesus preached, and Him alone. (Acts 13:38,39)​

Eph. 6:17 clearly states that the sword of the Spirit is the word of God.

No. No it doesn't.

Have you read my post regarding this? (I provided a link.)

When read in Greek, Eph. 6:17,18 clearly states that the sword is prayer.

And since you cannot (or do not) read the New Testament texts in Greek, then you can't see that the New Testament states that there are TWO "word of God"(s).

So basically, GIGO (garbage in, garbage out). Although that might be too harsh, so maybe... imprecision in, misunderstanding out?

Now just tell me that have you no inclination to read my post on the Sword (of the Spirit) and I can spend my time more wisely.

Actually as a matter of fact, information warfare is a new generation of warfare, and we're in the battleground everyday!

Oh dear... that's actually been going on, like, forever, which is why one can point to 2 Timothy 3:16 as a purposeful mistranslation in order to promote misinformation. Just read the actual canons of the Council of Nicaea, and it becomes readily clear that "information warfare" was always around ("Hath God said?")

Today, one has access to much more accurate information than in times past. (Although the Internet was much more valuable when only smart people knew how to use it.)

I was taught that don't swear on anything in any name, just let your yes be yes and no be no.

Indeed, make no oath or pledge. I completely agree.

Again, I'm not here to discuss the pledge of allegiance, that has nothing to do with the OP.

Actually it does. It promotes a false teaching that distracts from the teachings of Jesus to make no oath or swear no pledge.

But I'm saddened by your obvious rejection to learn something new.

(Luke 5:39 KJV) No man also having drunk old wine straightway desireth new: for he saith, The old is better.​

Your attempt of distraction with this is futile - and annoying.

Well, sir, if you're annoyed, that's something you may wish to deal with.

Sir, when did I say that the Communist Manifesto was written by the devil?

Like... seriously ??
The first section of this post...

False teacher, prophets and doctrines.. again.

And yet it will get nowhere unless one has a deep faith that indeed ALL power / authority had been (in the past) given to Jesus. The best way to nullify that power is to get "believers" to think it speaks about the future. I tell you that he will avenge them speedily. Nevertheless when the Son...

www.talkjesus.com

Also, I don't wanna waste time on this grand social experiment that was proven to be an abject failure

It was proven to be an abject failure back in the book of Acts. Which is why Paul had to make a special journey to help the church in Jerusalem financially.

(Romans 15:25-26 KJV) But now I go unto Jerusalem to minister unto the saints. For it hath pleased them of Macedonia and Achaia to make a certain contribution for the poor saints which are at Jerusalem.​

But if you don't wish to waste your time to learn about anything on this (or any other matter, even) that's your prerogative, and that's fine by me.

this grand social experiment that was proven to be an abject failure more than 30 years ago when the Soviet Union collapsed.

Do you know just how many of the 10 planks of the Communist Manifesto have been implemented in the US? (Sorry, how could you, you've never read it.)

And the US pledge of Allegiance was written in the late 1800's by the Socialist Party of America.

AHHHH... but you've tricked me into moving on before the important things were taken care of first. By which I refer to this post:

False teacher, prophets and doctrines.. again.

And yet it will get nowhere unless one has a deep faith that indeed ALL power / authority had been (in the past) given to Jesus. The best way to nullify that power is to get "believers" to think it speaks about the future. I tell you that he will avenge them speedily. Nevertheless when the Son...

www.talkjesus.com

Rhema

 

[Rhema]

May I ask, sir, that by what standard do you evaluate whether it's "working" or not? When Christ himself preached an "offensive" message, many turned away (John 6:60-71); when He was arrested, his own disciples all fled and forsook him (Matt 26:56), should the Lord himself re-evaluate?

Briefly.... ALL of that was before the resurrection.

But if you need an example. (Here's the entire passage...)

(Acts 3:1-10 KJV) Now Peter and John went up together into the temple at the hour of prayer, being the ninth hour. And a certain man lame from his mother's womb was carried, whom they laid daily at the gate of the temple which is called Beautiful, to ask alms of them that entered into the temple; Who seeing Peter and John about to go into the temple asked an alms. And Peter, fastening his eyes upon him with John, said, Look on us. And he gave heed unto them, expecting to receive something of them. Then Peter said, Silver and gold have I none; but such as I have give I thee: In the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth rise up and walk. And he took him by the right hand, and lifted him up: and immediately his feet and ankle bones received strength. And he leaping up stood, and walked, and entered with them into the temple, walking, and leaping, and praising God. And all the people saw him walking and praising God: And they knew that it was he which sat for alms at the Beautiful gate of the temple: and they were filled with wonder and amazement at that which had happened unto him.​

And all the above is after the resurrection.

Thanks,
Rhema

(More, if and when....)

 

[Brother Paul]

Briefly.... ALL of that was before the resurrection.

But if you need an example. (Here's the entire passage...)

(Acts 3:1-10 KJV) Now Peter and John went up together into the temple at the hour of prayer, being the ninth hour. And a certain man lame from his mother's womb was carried, whom they laid daily at the gate of the temple which is called Beautiful, to ask alms of them that entered into the temple; Who seeing Peter and John about to go into the temple asked an alms. And Peter, fastening his eyes upon him with John, said, Look on us. And he gave heed unto them, expecting to receive something of them. Then Peter said, Silver and gold have I none; but such as I have give I thee: In the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth rise up and walk. And he took him by the right hand, and lifted him up: and immediately his feet and ankle bones received strength. And he leaping up stood, and walked, and entered with them into the temple, walking, and leaping, and praising God. And all the people saw him walking and praising God: And they knew that it was he which sat for alms at the Beautiful gate of the temple: and they were filled with wonder and amazement at that which had happened unto him.​

And all the above is after the resurrection.

Thanks,
Rhema

(More, if and when....)

Rhema I must have missed your post on the sword of the Spirit. Send me a link or the name

 

[Jonathan_Gale]

Sorry Jonathan but I do not see that as relative to Rhema's point at all. But you are correct. Jesus did die for our sins. The gospel of grace is that we are already going to Hell and Jesus was sent to be our redemption. Some preach and teach falsely that message in reverse which for many makes Jesus the problem and not the solution. They teach (and usually flavored by their denominational theology) that if you do not accept Jesus you are sent to Hell (that is backwards).

We are not the judge and we cannot know if ALL who did not accept Jesus go to Hell because the Bible ALSO teaches (Rev. 20:12 and elsewhere) that AFTER the 1000 year reign the rest of the dead will be raised and they will be judged according to their works as written in the BOOKS (plural, i.e., the book of remembrance AND the book of life) and we cannot know whether some of them were written into the book of life. As the Lord Himself says in Ezekiel, when an unrighteous person does what is that which God has willed is it not counted as righteousness?

At least we ought to look at the big picture for God is grace and love and merciful beyond our ability to comprehend

Yes, it is sad that everyone can recite John 3:16, but the next two verses that state the purpose of John 3:16 is often ignored - “for God did not send him to condemn the world, but that the world through him might be saved. He who believes in him is not condemned, but he who does not believe in him is ALREADY condemned.”

 

[Jonathan_Gale]

Yeah even the Mormons and Jehovah Witnesses will state this.
The gospel is a lot more than five words.

Maybe, but false version of Yeshua cannot die for anybody's sins.

 

[Jonathan_Gale]

Yes, I am quite sure you believe that. But there are many others on "TheologyOnline" who ardently believe something else.
(Perhaps you could be helpful in fighting that false doctrine?)

Of course these people think YOU are the one preaching a different gospel and bringing in confusion. (I'm not an Acts 28-er, btw.)

As posted before, this is from our First Principles:

2) We believe that since the Father sent Jesus Christ His Son to preach the Gospel, then the Gospel is what Jesus preached, and Him alone. (Acts 13:38,39)

Then what are we arguing about? This is the same message that Paul reiterated in 1 Cor. 1-11. Gospel of grace and gospel of kingdom are one, when the gospel of grace is preached and accepted, progress of the Great Commission is made, God's kingdom is one step closer.

No. No it doesn't.

Have you read my post regarding this? (I provided a link.)

When read in Greek, Eph. 6:17,18 clearly states that the sword is prayer.

And since you cannot (or do not) read the New Testament texts in Greek, then you can't see that the New Testament states that there are TWO "word of God"(s).

So basically, GIGO (garbage in, garbage out). Although that might be too harsh, so maybe... imprecision in, misunderstanding out?

Now just tell me that have you no inclination to read my post on the Sword (of the Spirit) and I can spend my time more wisely.

Prayer is our communication with God. Paul didn't teach anybody to point a double-edged sword at God and pierce his bones and marrow. The sword of the spirit is a weapon for the "rulers of darkness", Yeshua never prayed any of them away, he cast out demons - evil, malevolent spirits - with the sword of the HOLY spirit. I mentioned information warfare to make a point that this is not just rhetorics as most Christians think, this is real, "information warfare" tactics is just Eph. 6:10-20 translated into modern language.

Actually it does. It promotes a false teaching that distracts from the teachings of Jesus to make no oath or swear no pledge.

But I'm saddened by your obvious rejection to learn something new.

(Luke 5:39 KJV) No man also having drunk old wine straightway desireth new: for he saith, The old is better.

Well, sir, if you're annoyed, that's something you may wish to deal with.

It was proven to be an abject failure back in the book of Acts. Which is why Paul had to make a special journey to help the church in Jerusalem financially.

(Romans 15:25-26 KJV) But now I go unto Jerusalem to minister unto the saints. For it hath pleased them of Macedonia and Achaia to make a certain contribution for the poor saints which are at Jerusalem.
But if you don't wish to waste your time to learn about anything on this (or any other matter, even) that's your prerogative, and that's fine by me.

Do you know just how many of the 10 planks of the Communist Manifesto have been implemented in the US? (Sorry, how could you, you've never read it.)

And the US pledge of Allegiance was written in the late 1800's by the Socialist Party of America.

AHHHH... but you've tricked me into moving on before the important things were taken care of first. By which I refer to this post:

Well sir, forgive me for refusing to fall into another rabbit hole, especially a rabbit hole with a political flare. I grew up listening to Rush Limbaugh and other conservative pundits who were warning about cultural Marxist in America day in and day out, and I'm mighty tired of that. I come to this forum because the only way to cast out those Marxist demons is not Trump, but Yeshua.

 

[Rhema]

Rhema I must have missed your post on the sword of the Spirit. Send me a link or the name

Not a problem....This should get you there, but ignore the link splash screen text, though, it's irreverent to the actual post.

How Do I Put on the Armor of God?

I was busy with my wife earlier today. The reason i asked if you had seen the armor of God . Simply. We Christian will often jump to conclusions that words like Truth, and Righteousness are example of faith. And they are, but they are more than words in the Love of God. Just as Jesus is a...

www.talkjesus.com

Rhema

 

[Rhema]

Then what are we arguing about?

Are we arguing? I wasn't aware that we were arguing.

I did ask some rather pointed questions that you ignored, though.
That was disappointing.

This is the same message that Paul reiterated in 1 Cor. 1-11.

What is "the same message"? And are you actually referencing 11 chapters of this epistle? (You may need to narrow it down. It covers a lot of ground.) As an example, I don't know of any scripture where Jesus taught that you would be judging angels.

Prayer is our communication with God. Paul didn't teach anybody to point a double-edged sword at God and pierce his bones and marrow.

You are conflating two separate concepts. Deal with the actual Greek language in Eph. 6 first, to get a clear understanding of that metaphor first, before mixing it with others.

The passage in Hebrews speaks about an entirely different "word of God" than does Ephesians. Hadn't I said there were two Words?

Yeshua never prayed any of them away, he cast out demons - evil, malevolent spirits - with the sword of the HOLY spirit. I mentioned information warfare to make a point that this is not just rhetorics as most Christians think, this is real, "information warfare" tactics is just Eph. 6:10-20 translated into modern language.

And you? (You who think me to be posting misinformation....) How many demons have you cast out?( And no, that is most certainly not a rhetorical question.)

I'm not the one mixing up words, kind sir.

I grew up listening to Rush Limbaugh and other conservative pundits who were warning about cultural Marxist in America day in and day out, and I'm mighty tired of that.

I'm sorry to hear of your travails. None of that rather affected me at all. The Truth is much more subtle. When I understood the command of Jesus regarding oaths when I was in ninth grade, I stopped reciting the Pledge of Allegiance altogether, and never did since then.

I come to this forum because the only way to cast out those Marxist demons is not Trump, but Yeshua.

How would you know what a Marxist is if you've never read any of their teachings?

Kindly,
Rhema
(And it would be good if you stop avoiding the important things.)

 

[Jonathan_Gale]

What is "the same message"? And are you actually referencing 11 chapters of this epistle? (You may need to narrow it down. It covers a lot of ground.) As an example, I don't know of any scripture where Jesus taught that you would be judging angels.

OK my bad, I meant 1 Cor. 15:1-11, but the gospel message is still consistent.

You are conflating two separate concepts. Deal with the actual Greek language in Eph. 6 first, to get a clear understanding of that metaphor first, before mixing it with others.

The passage in Hebrews speaks about an entirely different "word of God" than does Ephesians. Hadn't I said there were two Words?

Yes, the Word of God that became flesh and dwelt among us, and the word of God as the sword of the Spirit that "cut to the heart" through conviction of sins (Acts 7:54). However, the first one has ascended to heaven and seated at the right hand of God, so the second one is the only one that's left, and that is for OUR advantage.

And you? (You who think me to be posting misinformation....) How many demons have you cast out?( And no, that is most certainly not a rhetorical question.)

I'm not the one mixing up words, kind sir.

One stronghold at a time, sir. And meanwhile, no more new footholds.

I'm sorry to hear of your travails. None of that rather affected me at all. The Truth is much more subtle. When I understood the command of Jesus regarding oaths when I was in ninth grade, I stopped reciting the Pledge of Allegiance altogether, and never did since then.

I'm sorry to hear of your obsession with the pledge of allegiance. If you stopped reciting it, why can't you stop bitching about it and turn your attention back to Yeshua?

How would you know what a Marxist is if you've never read any of their teachings?

Because I don't have to play with fire to know what a burn feels like, sir.