Heavy metal music is wrong

[KingdomSeeker]

I couldn't find an answer to my second question "What kind of music if any do you think is appropriate for spiritual edification?".

Is there any style of music that you would consider appropriate for worship?

Oh i thought i did answer it, im sorry.


Music that is prompted by the Holy spirit, either in your prayer closet, or with in the congragation. , is music that is exeptible to GOd. Just like ANY action. We are not to just DO things, and call it worshiping God.

Isaiah 29:13
"And the Lord said: “Because this people draw near with their mouth and honor me with their lips, while their hearts are far from me, and their fear of me is a commandment taught by men,"

And THOSE people didnt even have an indwelling Holy spirit!!

its a mockery of God what we do as self proclaimed Christains. We have a reheresed, and practised, and taught way to Worship! Doesnt that seem odd? You cant teach worship...worship comes from Love of GOd, and you cant teach LOVE!

So we have people doing what they want to, and calling that worshiping God. ITs wrong. Then since this is what this post is, we have people Giving into the flesh, and saying "i can worship god however i want" I can worship God with hevy metal music! look, The lyrics talk about Jesus, they talk about feelings, and they are worshiping GOd with there flesh...Which Jesus has told us to Deny, adn Crucify! So is Worshiping GOd, how YOU want to?

NO! Then thats not worshiping God...Worship, come from Love, adoration, and reverence...and it comes from The Holy spirit in you...and not from Your flesh likeing a certain element of the world...but now im going to repeat myself.


So i hope im answering that last question now. What music? Music prompted by the Holy spirit of God, out of Love, reverence adn spirit, that also reflects the fruits of the Holy spirit.

Its not a mystery, truly if you are honest with yourself and God.

Jesus bless you. Pray about it.

 

[KingdomSeeker]

Again, Im not saying Dont listen to music. Any music honestly. But dont call apeasing the flesh, worshiping God. its not.


And since this is a thread about "Christian Metal" You might as well listen to secualr music of the same type, becasue ther is no difference. God doesnt care what we "Appear" to be. God cares taht we worship him, adn surender ourselves to him wholey, ...and you cant do that holdign on to what YOU want.

Its not a threat either...God, Jesus says deny yourself, PAul said Crucify flesh, YOUR wants, YOUR desires, why? as a punishment? NO! AS a reward honestly. when you surrender your will to JEsus, adn give your life totaly to him, he pours his spirit over you, adn Teaches you things, like you could never belive. Just give you your wants and desires to JEsus. Turn your life over completely to him. IN ALL your ways, aknowledge him, doesnt mean in all your ways say hello to Jesus. In all yourways, have HIM have the say in what you do, adn HE will direct your path. Stop dictating yourselves.

 

[jiggyfly]

You seem to be misunderstanding my question. Have you written any music? What music do you play/sing when you worship God? Are hymns acceptable music?

 

[AudreyNicole]

Yes, the Kublefuss, its from Jupiter.:embarasse


But seriously, take a look at ALLL Christians, adn look at all the justification we do of ourself. am I saying you cant praise God musicaly? not really no.

Look, im on the internet...So Im either stupid or a hypocrite, if im saying do NOTHING of the world.

My point is, We justify mimicry of the world, becasue we have come to think that God doesnt want us to do ANYTHING secular. Which is true, but instead of then deny the world, we try to make the world Christian so we can then justify giving into our flesh...we call flesh, adn emotion, the spirit of God. We call obsession "our calling" and no one is truly asking God anything in all of this.

Its a process ok, im not saying its an easy one either....its not. the walk of a follower of Jesus, is painfull and not "Fun" Truly. and if you think we are supposed to just do what ever, and have our own life.

Well...then you are deceived. But that comes...We nned to be IN the spirit abide IN The spirit at all times...but no one teaches how to do that. Christianity has becoem just another religion which it was never ment to be.

ANNNNY way...its a process, we need to continuoulsy deny ourselves, and ask GOD what he would want us to do, or not do.


If you want to listen to heavy metal. Listen to Opeth. Used to be one of my favorite Bands. But God told me to get rid of all my music. Im not saying that YOU should do so...im saying you should ask God what he wants you to do. Im saying we should submit completely to Jesus, adn then HE will convict us of certain things...it WILL be different depending on the person.

But, Chrsitians need to stop trying to justify things and saying "they can worship God how they please" Becaseu...no...you cant...God says specificaly that no, you cant. You worship God on HIS terms...or your not worshiping God.

If You want to listen to heavy metal...fine...thats up to God to tell you not to. BUT DO NOT say that Christian Heavy metal, or most Christian Music, is a GOOD, or a GODLY thing...its not. its the world hiding behind a twisted gospel put to music. Christian metal, most Christian MUSIC is NOT worship of God. its worship of Flesh, but you want to "please god" also, so you make your flesh as happy as possible, and also try to have the lyrics "pleasing to Jesus"


Just stop it. its crazy and wrong. You either listen to worldy music, or you dont. but dont try and justify music by making the lyrics "Reflect Jesus" Your just kinda shoving your own flesh onto the life of Christ, and it seems to me that that is highly insulting.

Again, Hevy metal, is just as evil as pop music(Lady gaga...etc) no more evil, no less evil...sin is sin, the world is the world

To staple the face of Jesus onto something becasue you truly just want to do what you want, but dont want to feel guilty, or convicted about it, is probaly MORE wrong then listening to secular music.

Christian Music, (i dont mean making music unto God in your private prayer closet, or even among the congragation) But making money off of Jesus to please the flesh is MORE evil than secualr music.

and listening to it, is worse for You spirtualy.

But thats the last i will ever type on the subject. understand it or dont. Beleive it or Dont. PRay about it or dont.

its said. Truly, Jesus bless all of you. And take a Good look at the "Christian music industry" Does ANY of that truly reflect the life of Christ?

Ok so you disappeared off this post.... but if you ever come back I have the same question as above.

In your opinion, is there such a thing as spiritual music? Or do you believe that all music is "worldy" and thus, "ungodly"? And if so, what type/style of music qualifies as Godly music?

 

[KingdomSeeker]

Ok so you disappeared off this post.... but if you ever come back I have the same question as above.

In your opinion, is there such a thing as spiritual music? Or do you believe that all music is "worldy" and thus, "ungodly"? And if so, what type/style of music qualifies as Godly music?

Here let me tell everyone here what i beleive. MAybe it will clear some things up.


Music is music. Music CANT be holy, or un holy. Its a tool. its a media.

Its what goes INTO music, that makes it what it is. Its what is Behind it, that controls it.

If a Christian wants to listen to music, and God hasnt personaly convicted that individual, Then that Christian Can listen to what ever he wants to. "“All things are lawful,” but not all things are helpful. “All things are lawful,” but not all things build up. 1 Corinthians 10:23 "
Granted there is a line that A christian should not cross when it comes to lyrics, and when it comes to the person singing...but we know this.
However there are allot of Christians out there that wont listen to anythign but "Christian" music, and still go to rated R movies, adn sit adn hear people curse there brains out, damn God, Curse Jesus, and kill each other for 2 hours...and then walk out of the theater saying "Oh that was a GOOD movie" ...but thats neither here nor there.

SO all that i mentioned above is ENTERTAINMENT...and NOT worship.


The Christian music industry, is probably JUST as wrong and contrived, and dirty, and worldy as the secular are. But, its entertainment. I dont see it any more holy then secular music is...its up to YOU if you want to continue listening or NOT, I would say ASk GOd aout everything...but some people take that as an insult...i dont know why...but hey...whatever.


However, ALL of the above mentioned, is NOT worship! Its entertainment...and truly, I dont think anyone gets on there knees and truly PRAISES God and worships him for hours, while Kutless is playing in the background....Or Since this thread is about Hevy metal Here's some Christian heavy metal YouTube - Demon Hunter - Collapsing Listen to this....and picture a WHITE, and Holy perfect God, who wants your devotion, and submission, and to "be still and know that I am GOd" You cant worship God to this. Impossible. Can i Say that these people ARE NOT born again...sometimes i want to...but no, I cant say they arent...i CAN say that is NOT worship. Plain and simple. Antithisis of Worship...its SELF worship maybe....But not God.


So ALL music, is a medium, like i said above...there for it is for entertainment. Most Hyms, Look there are some Old hyms that have realy great, spirit filled lyrics in them...then there are some that have contrived lyrics in them....ITS STILL ENTERTAINMENT...am i Saying dont sing hyms NO!!! Just stop calling that worshiping God. Listen to wht you want but dont call a dog a cat, dont call what isnt, what IS.

Question, Can you, or do you worship God without music? alone? if you do, and can...whats the need for anything else? have you ever been so deep in the spirit of God, that you sing your own songs to him? I have...THAT my friend, is a song for the worshp of the ALMIGHTY, something that is moved by the spirt. its not contrived...its not planned, its prompted...if you want to then write that down, adn share it with friends and family....thats WONDERFUL.

Also, Most(not all but most) American Hymns, are Old Bar tunes, with Jesus centered lyrics...and i have listend to these lyrics...none are "BAD" but they lack a certain spiritual essence that others(very few) have.

Look, Keith green, one of the Few "Christian" musicians I listen to, His ministry was Music. Thats how he spread the gospel. He used Music(a medium) to spread the Gospel...Which im sure Gave GLORY to GOd, but that is not Worshiping God...do you see the difference?

I cant prove it, but im almost certain that Keithe green, in his prvate prayer closet, when he would Worship God, it would be with out music
maybe not always...but most ofthe time...Why? Because you cant worship GOd on YOUR terms...and when the spirit moves, you are silent...Truly, or if not silent, you are praising him with your lips, your heart, and your mind.



SO Again, Nothing qulifies as GODLY music, Especially NOT "christian Music" If you want to listen to Christian music, GO AHEAD, but dont make your reason for doing so, to be "becasue this is what holy music sounds like" Becasue you would be wrong...there is no such thing...just like there is no such thing as EVIL music... All people without the holy spirit, are Evil...'mans heart is inherently wicked'(paraphrased) Music is a medium. its a tool.



To recap:

Holy music? No such thing.

Hymns are Godly? No, hyms are God centered...Some lyrics are Holyspirit inspired...most are contrived, and put to "secular" salloon tunes. Some hymns I love, becasue not only do the lyrics relfect Jesus, but so does the music, the spirit is IN it...but that is VERY few and far between.

Christian Heavy metal? Oxymoron. Wrong. I dont like it. I think it ruins you weather you know it or not. However if you Like heavy metal(thats the flesh my dear, like...thats an emotion...not spirit) Then listen to Secular heavy metal, I think its just as wrong. Lyrics mean nothing when you are doing your own thing.


Christian music in general? Entertainment. Even worship music, If you need music to "get you in the mood to worship God" then there is somethign Wrong.

Christian music Bad? Never said that...Christian music is music, with a label, Just like ALL music has a label. Its not good nor bad. The lyrics might not be sin filled....but then again...Just becasue its "Christian" doesnt make it Correct.


Secular music bad? No. Music cant be bad, the people are. the intent is. The HEART is evil. God judges the heart. Something that even we cant see, thats why we are supposed to GO to GOD with everything. Ask him, plead with him, to show us our hidden wicked ness adn remove it. CONSTATNLY.

Anyway, Secualr music, is only evil becasue the spirit of God is not in those with out Jesus Christ. However, "Christian" music also lacks the Holy spirit...It does. Allot of it, especially the ones dicussed here. So what does that make the people? RIGHT!! thats my point...if your heart is far from GOd, then your heart is far from God, no matter what you say TO him, no matter wht you CALL yourself.

Religion, has replaced spirit. Anyway, this isnt about that. Its about music.

If you are moved by the holyspirit to make music, adn sing UNTO the Lord, then that is a wonderfull beautiful thing. However, if you read a portion of scripture, and come up with an idea, About God, and then make a 5 chord, pop song about God...THATS NOT THE SAME THING.

One is YOU, the other is God moving you.


So considering im long winded and go in circles. this is the end. Take it. pray about it if you may. Last words I will say on the subject, truly.

Christian music, is Entertainment, at best, a medium for the gospel.

NOTHING WRONG WITH THAT.

But PLEASE dont put your own opinion on what worshiping GOd is. You cant worship God in YOUR opinion. Thats SELF worship, thats worship your Idea, adn NOT God.

If you have NOT been convicted of "Secular music" then thats fine. its between you and God. If you have not been convicted on "christian music" Thats fine...may be a Harder thing for people to be convicted Becasue not many pray about what they have set in there mind to be True allready.

And lastly, to repaet myself for the hundreth time. Christian Metal, is JUST as bad as Secualr metal. Why? because its justification of FLESH. its Still Doing what YOU want to. its evil. Its pridefull.

"im going to do it becasue i can worship God how i want to"

Oh? Can you? Thats a SIN. Pride may be the worst Sin. And we have a whole Culture of Pride filled "Christians" ...So ...Justification of SELF(which is repeatedly said that we need to crucify and deny)... and pride Are running Christian music. So how is that following Jesus? Truly?

Hardly anyone is following Jesus. ON HIS TERMS, not ours.
Hardly anyone is worshiping God. ON HIS TERMS, not ours.

Anyway. Jesus bless all you guys. Pray about it. Talk to God about it.

and if you still dont think there is Anything wrong with Christian musc..ok...thats fine...but DONT call what is not worship...Worship.


I hope it sticks this time.

1.)No music is worship, unless its moved by the spirit privately(or in a small congragation)by God unto God. For HIS glory. Not ours. For HIS edification...not ours. David played music unto the lord, adn he danced unto the lord. Do you think he practised it? or was it moved by the spirit, and love for GOD?

2.) Christian music, is music with a theme...listen to it if you dont feel convicted not to. But its not worship.

 

[jiggyfly]

Here let me tell everyone here what i beleive. MAybe it will clear some things up.


Music is music. Music CANT be holy, or un holy. Its a tool. its a media.

Its what goes INTO music, that makes it what it is. Its what is Behind it, that controls it.

If a Christian wants to listen to music, and God hasnt personaly convicted that individual, Then that Christian Can listen to what ever he wants to. "“All things are lawful,” but not all things are helpful. “All things are lawful,” but not all things build up. 1 Corinthians 10:23 "
Granted there is a line that A christian should not cross when it comes to lyrics, and when it comes to the person singing...but we know this.
However there are allot of Christians out there that wont listen to anythign but "Christian" music, and still go to rated R movies, adn sit adn hear people curse there brains out, damn God, Curse Jesus, and kill each other for 2 hours...and then walk out of the theater saying "Oh that was a GOOD movie" ...but thats neither here nor there.

SO all that i mentioned above is ENTERTAINMENT...and NOT worship.


The Christian music industry, is probably JUST as wrong and contrived, and dirty, and worldy as the secular are. But, its entertainment. I dont see it any more holy then secular music is...its up to YOU if you want to continue listening or NOT, I would say ASk GOd aout everything...but some people take that as an insult...i dont know why...but hey...whatever.


However, ALL of the above mentioned, is NOT worship! Its entertainment...and truly, I dont think anyone gets on there knees and truly PRAISES God and worships him for hours, while Kutless is playing in the background....Or Since this thread is about Hevy metal Here's some Christian heavy metal YouTube - Demon Hunter - Collapsing Listen to this....and picture a WHITE, and Holy perfect God, who wants your devotion, and submission, and to "be still and know that I am GOd" You cant worship God to this. Impossible. Can i Say that these people ARE NOT born again...sometimes i want to...but no, I cant say they arent...i CAN say that is NOT worship. Plain and simple. Antithisis of Worship...its SELF worship maybe....But not God.


So ALL music, is a medium, like i said above...there for it is for entertainment. Most Hyms, Look there are some Old hyms that have realy great, spirit filled lyrics in them...then there are some that have contrived lyrics in them....ITS STILL ENTERTAINMENT...am i Saying dont sing hyms NO!!! Just stop calling that worshiping God. Listen to wht you want but dont call a dog a cat, dont call what isnt, what IS.

Question, Can you, or do you worship God without music? alone? if you do, and can...whats the need for anything else? have you ever been so deep in the spirit of God, that you sing your own songs to him? I have...THAT my friend, is a song for the worshp of the ALMIGHTY, something that is moved by the spirt. its not contrived...its not planned, its prompted...if you want to then write that down, adn share it with friends and family....thats WONDERFUL.

Also, Most(not all but most) American Hymns, are Old Bar tunes, with Jesus centered lyrics...and i have listend to these lyrics...none are "BAD" but they lack a certain spiritual essence that others(very few) have.

Look, Keith green, one of the Few "Christian" musicians I listen to, His ministry was Music. Thats how he spread the gospel. He used Music(a medium) to spread the Gospel...Which im sure Gave GLORY to GOd, but that is not Worshiping God...do you see the difference?

I cant prove it, but im almost certain that Keithe green, in his prvate prayer closet, when he would Worship God, it would be with out music
maybe not always...but most ofthe time...Why? Because you cant worship GOd on YOUR terms...and when the spirit moves, you are silent...Truly, or if not silent, you are praising him with your lips, your heart, and your mind.



SO Again, Nothing qulifies as GODLY music, Especially NOT "christian Music" If you want to listen to Christian music, GO AHEAD, but dont make your reason for doing so, to be "becasue this is what holy music sounds like" Becasue you would be wrong...there is no such thing...just like there is no such thing as EVIL music... All people without the holy spirit, are Evil...'mans heart is inherently wicked'(paraphrased) Music is a medium. its a tool.



To recap:

Holy music? No such thing.

Hymns are Godly? No, hyms are God centered...Some lyrics are Holyspirit inspired...most are contrived, and put to "secular" salloon tunes. Some hymns I love, becasue not only do the lyrics relfect Jesus, but so does the music, the spirit is IN it...but that is VERY few and far between.

Christian Heavy metal? Oxymoron. Wrong. I dont like it. I think it ruins you weather you know it or not. However if you Like heavy metal(thats the flesh my dear, like...thats an emotion...not spirit) Then listen to Secular heavy metal, I think its just as wrong. Lyrics mean nothing when you are doing your own thing.


Christian music in general? Entertainment. Even worship music, If you need music to "get you in the mood to worship God" then there is somethign Wrong.

Christian music Bad? Never said that...Christian music is music, with a label, Just like ALL music has a label. Its not good nor bad. The lyrics might not be sin filled....but then again...Just becasue its "Christian" doesnt make it Correct.


Secular music bad? No. Music cant be bad, the people are. the intent is. The HEART is evil. God judges the heart. Something that even we cant see, thats why we are supposed to GO to GOD with everything. Ask him, plead with him, to show us our hidden wicked ness adn remove it. CONSTATNLY.

Anyway, Secualr music, is only evil becasue the spirit of God is not in those with out Jesus Christ. However, "Christian" music also lacks the Holy spirit...It does. Allot of it, especially the ones dicussed here. So what does that make the people? RIGHT!! thats my point...if your heart is far from GOd, then your heart is far from God, no matter what you say TO him, no matter wht you CALL yourself.

Religion, has replaced spirit. Anyway, this isnt about that. Its about music.

If you are moved by the holyspirit to make music, adn sing UNTO the Lord, then that is a wonderfull beautiful thing. However, if you read a portion of scripture, and come up with an idea, About God, and then make a 5 chord, pop song about God...THATS NOT THE SAME THING.

One is YOU, the other is God moving you.


So considering im long winded and go in circles. this is the end. Take it. pray about it if you may. Last words I will say on the subject, truly.

Christian music, is Entertainment, at best, a medium for the gospel.

NOTHING WRONG WITH THAT.

But PLEASE dont put your own opinion on what worshiping GOd is. You cant worship God in YOUR opinion. Thats SELF worship, thats worship your Idea, adn NOT God.

If you have NOT been convicted of "Secular music" then thats fine. its between you and God. If you have not been convicted on "christian music" Thats fine...may be a Harder thing for people to be convicted Becasue not many pray about what they have set in there mind to be True allready.

And lastly, to repaet myself for the hundreth time. Christian Metal, is JUST as bad as Secualr metal. Why? because its justification of FLESH. its Still Doing what YOU want to. its evil. Its pridefull.

"im going to do it becasue i can worship God how i want to"

Oh? Can you? Thats a SIN. Pride may be the worst Sin. And we have a whole Culture of Pride filled "Christians" ...So ...Justification of SELF(which is repeatedly said that we need to crucify and deny)... and pride Are running Christian music. So how is that following Jesus? Truly?

Hardly anyone is following Jesus. ON HIS TERMS, not ours.
Hardly anyone is worshiping God. ON HIS TERMS, not ours.

Anyway. Jesus bless all you guys. Pray about it. Talk to God about it.

and if you still dont think there is Anything wrong with Christian musc..ok...thats fine...but DONT call what is not worship...Worship.


I hope it sticks this time.

1.)No music is worship, unless its moved by the spirit privately(or in a small congragation)by God unto God. For HIS glory. Not ours. For HIS edification...not ours. David played music unto the lord, adn he danced unto the lord. Do you think he practised it? or was it moved by the spirit, and love for GOD?

2.) Christian music, is music with a theme...listen to it if you dont feel convicted not to. But its not worship.

Thanks for clarifying your opinion KS.

 

[KingdomSeeker]

Thanks for clarifying your opinion KS.

You are very welcome Jiggyfly! one thing though...how do you tell the difference between Opinion, and Holy Spirit Truth, that now comes out of you?

 

[AudreyNicole]

Here let me tell everyone here what i beleive. MAybe it will clear some things up.


Music is music. Music CANT be holy, or un holy. Its a tool. its a media.

Its what goes INTO music, that makes it what it is. Its what is Behind it, that controls it.

If a Christian wants to listen to music, and God hasnt personaly convicted that individual, Then that Christian Can listen to what ever he wants to. "“All things are lawful,” but not all things are helpful. “All things are lawful,” but not all things build up. 1 Corinthians 10:23 "
Granted there is a line that A christian should not cross when it comes to lyrics, and when it comes to the person singing...but we know this.
However there are allot of Christians out there that wont listen to anythign but "Christian" music, and still go to rated R movies, adn sit adn hear people curse there brains out, damn God, Curse Jesus, and kill each other for 2 hours...and then walk out of the theater saying "Oh that was a GOOD movie" ...but thats neither here nor there.

SO all that i mentioned above is ENTERTAINMENT...and NOT worship.


The Christian music industry, is probably JUST as wrong and contrived, and dirty, and worldy as the secular are. But, its entertainment. I dont see it any more holy then secular music is...its up to YOU if you want to continue listening or NOT, I would say ASk GOd aout everything...but some people take that as an insult...i dont know why...but hey...whatever.


However, ALL of the above mentioned, is NOT worship! Its entertainment...and truly, I dont think anyone gets on there knees and truly PRAISES God and worships him for hours, while Kutless is playing in the background....Or Since this thread is about Hevy metal Here's some Christian heavy metal YouTube - Demon Hunter - Collapsing Listen to this....and picture a WHITE, and Holy perfect God, who wants your devotion, and submission, and to "be still and know that I am GOd" You cant worship God to this. Impossible. Can i Say that these people ARE NOT born again...sometimes i want to...but no, I cant say they arent...i CAN say that is NOT worship. Plain and simple. Antithisis of Worship...its SELF worship maybe....But not God.


So ALL music, is a medium, like i said above...there for it is for entertainment. Most Hyms, Look there are some Old hyms that have realy great, spirit filled lyrics in them...then there are some that have contrived lyrics in them....ITS STILL ENTERTAINMENT...am i Saying dont sing hyms NO!!! Just stop calling that worshiping God. Listen to wht you want but dont call a dog a cat, dont call what isnt, what IS.

Question, Can you, or do you worship God without music? alone? if you do, and can...whats the need for anything else? have you ever been so deep in the spirit of God, that you sing your own songs to him? I have...THAT my friend, is a song for the worshp of the ALMIGHTY, something that is moved by the spirt. its not contrived...its not planned, its prompted...if you want to then write that down, adn share it with friends and family....thats WONDERFUL.

Also, Most(not all but most) American Hymns, are Old Bar tunes, with Jesus centered lyrics...and i have listend to these lyrics...none are "BAD" but they lack a certain spiritual essence that others(very few) have.

Look, Keith green, one of the Few "Christian" musicians I listen to, His ministry was Music. Thats how he spread the gospel. He used Music(a medium) to spread the Gospel...Which im sure Gave GLORY to GOd, but that is not Worshiping God...do you see the difference?

I cant prove it, but im almost certain that Keithe green, in his prvate prayer closet, when he would Worship God, it would be with out music
maybe not always...but most ofthe time...Why? Because you cant worship GOd on YOUR terms...and when the spirit moves, you are silent...Truly, or if not silent, you are praising him with your lips, your heart, and your mind.



SO Again, Nothing qulifies as GODLY music, Especially NOT "christian Music" If you want to listen to Christian music, GO AHEAD, but dont make your reason for doing so, to be "becasue this is what holy music sounds like" Becasue you would be wrong...there is no such thing...just like there is no such thing as EVIL music... All people without the holy spirit, are Evil...'mans heart is inherently wicked'(paraphrased) Music is a medium. its a tool.



To recap:

Holy music? No such thing.

Hymns are Godly? No, hyms are God centered...Some lyrics are Holyspirit inspired...most are contrived, and put to "secular" salloon tunes. Some hymns I love, becasue not only do the lyrics relfect Jesus, but so does the music, the spirit is IN it...but that is VERY few and far between.

Christian Heavy metal? Oxymoron. Wrong. I dont like it. I think it ruins you weather you know it or not. However if you Like heavy metal(thats the flesh my dear, like...thats an emotion...not spirit) Then listen to Secular heavy metal, I think its just as wrong. Lyrics mean nothing when you are doing your own thing.


Christian music in general? Entertainment. Even worship music, If you need music to "get you in the mood to worship God" then there is somethign Wrong.

Christian music Bad? Never said that...Christian music is music, with a label, Just like ALL music has a label. Its not good nor bad. The lyrics might not be sin filled....but then again...Just becasue its "Christian" doesnt make it Correct.


Secular music bad? No. Music cant be bad, the people are. the intent is. The HEART is evil. God judges the heart. Something that even we cant see, thats why we are supposed to GO to GOD with everything. Ask him, plead with him, to show us our hidden wicked ness adn remove it. CONSTATNLY.

Anyway, Secualr music, is only evil becasue the spirit of God is not in those with out Jesus Christ. However, "Christian" music also lacks the Holy spirit...It does. Allot of it, especially the ones dicussed here. So what does that make the people? RIGHT!! thats my point...if your heart is far from GOd, then your heart is far from God, no matter what you say TO him, no matter wht you CALL yourself.

Religion, has replaced spirit. Anyway, this isnt about that. Its about music.

If you are moved by the holyspirit to make music, adn sing UNTO the Lord, then that is a wonderfull beautiful thing. However, if you read a portion of scripture, and come up with an idea, About God, and then make a 5 chord, pop song about God...THATS NOT THE SAME THING.

One is YOU, the other is God moving you.


So considering im long winded and go in circles. this is the end. Take it. pray about it if you may. Last words I will say on the subject, truly.

Christian music, is Entertainment, at best, a medium for the gospel.

NOTHING WRONG WITH THAT.

But PLEASE dont put your own opinion on what worshiping GOd is. You cant worship God in YOUR opinion. Thats SELF worship, thats worship your Idea, adn NOT God.

If you have NOT been convicted of "Secular music" then thats fine. its between you and God. If you have not been convicted on "christian music" Thats fine...may be a Harder thing for people to be convicted Becasue not many pray about what they have set in there mind to be True allready.

And lastly, to repaet myself for the hundreth time. Christian Metal, is JUST as bad as Secualr metal. Why? because its justification of FLESH. its Still Doing what YOU want to. its evil. Its pridefull.

"im going to do it becasue i can worship God how i want to"

Oh? Can you? Thats a SIN. Pride may be the worst Sin. And we have a whole Culture of Pride filled "Christians" ...So ...Justification of SELF(which is repeatedly said that we need to crucify and deny)... and pride Are running Christian music. So how is that following Jesus? Truly?

Hardly anyone is following Jesus. ON HIS TERMS, not ours.
Hardly anyone is worshiping God. ON HIS TERMS, not ours.

Anyway. Jesus bless all you guys. Pray about it. Talk to God about it.

and if you still dont think there is Anything wrong with Christian musc..ok...thats fine...but DONT call what is not worship...Worship.


I hope it sticks this time.

1.)No music is worship, unless its moved by the spirit privately(or in a small congragation)by God unto God. For HIS glory. Not ours. For HIS edification...not ours. David played music unto the lord, adn he danced unto the lord. Do you think he practised it? or was it moved by the spirit, and love for GOD?

2.) Christian music, is music with a theme...listen to it if you dont feel convicted not to. But its not worship.

First of all, love the Demon Hunter.... one of my favorite bands And I certainly appreciate your reply; it's completely understandable... thanks for clarifying.

And I definitely appreciate your opinion, but I must say I don't agree, The Bible says that you can praise (worship) God with music... in fact it even says to use "loud clashing cymbals". Add a drum beat, some crazy vocals, and some nice guitar... you got yourself some rockin' worship. I guess I just don't see how that could possibly not be praising the Lord if He Himself the Lord tells us to do that. He doesn't tell us how to write music or play the instruments He gave us. As you stated it is a moving by the Spirit. But He also gives us free will to sing and play instruments as we please, as long as we are worshiping Him.

In fact I would even argue that it would be against the very virtue of free will if God told us how we must sing to Him in praise. He loves us and respects our free will, why should musical praise be the exception? It is true that we are not to be of the world, but that does not mean we are to be miserable. If we enjoy doing something on this earth we ought to find a way to use that passion to glorify God's name. Like I am an architecture student, I enjoy designing buildings, and I want to use this passion in my career to glorify God. Some people write and use their writings to glorify God. Music is not any different than any other passion God puts in our heart. So we ought to find a way to glorify God's name in our singing. And whether that singing praise uses "loud clashing cymbals"(Psalm 150:5) or loud crashing drums, it makes no difference as long as we are glorifying His holy and beautiful name.


Oh, and P.S.: I've actually been asking God in prayer about this particular subject, and the Holy Spirit has led me to the knowledge that there is absolutely nothing wrong with listening to Christian Heavy Metal (You know they say you always know when its God calling you... it was definitely Him) That was my personal answer so I can't say this is true for everyone.... I say each should ask God. Perhaps it is for some, obviously it isn't for others; but, again, I really believe it is a personal preference and style. So if you don't like it, don't listen. But if you do, make sure you are using it to worship God and make sure you are following the guiding of the Spirit and demonstrating all the good fruits

 

[KingdomSeeker]

First of all, love the Demon Hunter.... one of my favorite bands And I certainly appreciate your reply; it's completely understandable... thanks for clarifying.

And I definitely appreciate your opinion, but I must say I don't agree, The Bible says that you can praise (worship) God with music... in fact it even says to use "loud clashing cymbals". Add a drum beat, some crazy vocals, and some nice guitar... you got yourself some rockin' worship. I guess I just don't see how that could possibly not be praising the Lord if He Himself the Lord tells us to do that. He doesn't tell us how to write music or play the instruments He gave us. As you stated it is a moving by the Spirit. But He also gives us free will to sing and play instruments as we please, as long as we are worshiping Him.

In fact I would even argue that it would be against the very virtue of free will if God told us how we must sing to Him in praise. He loves us and respects our free will, why should musical praise be the exception? It is true that we are not to be of the world, but that does not mean we are to be miserable. If we enjoy doing something on this earth we ought to find a way to use that passion to glorify God's name. Like I am an architecture student, I enjoy designing buildings, and I want to use this passion in my career to glorify God. Some people write and use their writings to glorify God. Music is not any different than any other passion God puts in our heart. So we ought to find a way to glorify God's name in our singing. And whether that singing praise uses "loud clashing cymbals"(Psalm 150:5) or loud crashing drums, it makes no difference as long as we are glorifying His holy and beautiful name.


Oh, and P.S.: I've actually been asking God in prayer about this particular subject, and the Holy Spirit has led me to the knowledge that there is absolutely nothing wrong with listening to Christian Heavy Metal (You know they say you always know when its God calling you... it was definitely Him) That was my personal answer so I can't say this is true for everyone.... I say each should ask God. Perhaps it is for some, obviously it isn't for others; but, again, I really believe it is a personal preference and style. So if you don't like it, don't listen. But if you do, make sure you are using it to worship God and make sure you are following the guiding of the Spirit and demonstrating all the good fruits

"I guess I just don't see how that could possibly not be praising the Lord if He Himself the Lord tells us to do that."


Thats actually my point. YOU dont see it. Becasue you praise God how YOU think. Your flesh is praising Jesus. And you are NOT worshiping in spirit and Truth. You are worshiping in flesh, and opinion...



"And I definitely appreciate your opinion, but I must say I don't agree, The Bible says that you can praise (worship) God with music... in fact it even says to use "loud clashing cymbals". Add a drum beat, some crazy vocals, and some nice guitar... you got yourself some rockin' worship."


Again, Whats opinion? Can anyone have the truth of the spirit? or is it all just opinion?

First of all, if you re read my posts(all of them) i never said you COULDNT praise god with music...i said it would be moved by the spirit.

Secondly, The bible does not say to use "loud clashing cymbols"

It says in psalm 150:5 "Praise him upon the loud cymbals" - literally, "the cymbals of sound" or hearing.

It means praise him with audibly expressed Joy...if there are cymbols around...go ahead bang on the cymbols...its not REALLY talking about music...its talking about expresing your love, to god in worship...But if you read THE NEW TESTEMENT which is for the church...we are supposed to pray adn worship in secret. Truly. Worship in TRUTH right? Well thats the truth. Again, Im not saying DONT play music...Im saying DONT justify your actions, and claim it to be worshiping GOD. If you want to listen to Demon hunter...thats Fine...BUT DO NOT SAY THAT LISTENING TO DEMON HUNTER IS WORSHIP! becasue that would not be spirit adn that would NOT be truth...it would be flesh..and lies. ALso, since i have brought it to Truth of Scripture...i would like to see where in the scripture it says Drums? of any kind?

Hmm, well im not doubting free will, Free wil las far as God doesnt FORCE us to do anything. that is correct. But God expects complete submission. And Complete Holiness. Holiness doesnt come by our free will does it?

"He loves us and respects our free will, why should musical praise be the exception? "

He loves and respects our free will? NO he doesnt!! those are lies my friend. God is pleased by FAITH. God is pleased by LOVE of him adn others. Waht is LOVE of GOD? To obey his commandments. ALL of them. And denial of Self is the MAIN commandment of Jesus if you watn to FOLLOW him. And NOTHING about "Demon hunter" or any other band, shows denial of Self. none.

"It is true that we are not to be of the world, but that does not mean we are to be miserable."


I have never once been misserable Worshiping God my Dear sister.

EVER.

But giving into the flesh, again, IS NOT Worship. its SELF Worship. Its entertainment. Its not worship. If you are misserable worshiping God, in any respect other then Demon hunter...or even Maranatha! ...if you NEED stimulation other then the pure Holy spirit of The ALmighty, in order to Worship God, then you have never been doing so, you have been decieved...you were not worshiping God in Truth, Nor spirit. adn should go before God and ask him to truly fill you with the spirit( daily...I ask to be filled and guided, adn focused on him all the time...It just doesnt HAPPEN...you need to SEEK the kingdom...You need to ASK "you dont have because you dont ask"

Again, There is adifference between What GOD lays on your heart, ad nwhat YOU think GOd would want you to do, becasue YOU have a fleshly passion for it. If you desire it in the flesh, then its FLesh, it self, Even if you want to do it "For GOD" you are doing it IN VAIN, FLeshly, Selfishly...and therfore worshipng God in vain. NOT in spirit and in truth.


The modern Church has been moved by evil, and selfishness soo much, that no one has the intimate quiet relatinship with the spirit of God like they should...Its time to Truly SEEK Gods word for you in your life. Get out of the flesh, Crucify the flesh. KILL it! Get rid of it, it wil only lead to damnation. Paul repeatedly yelled at the Corinthinas, i beleive it was, becasue he kept telling thme what to do, and he would find out the kept living in the flesh, they were CARNAL, and not SPiritual.

THAT is what this "Christian" world is, STILL, Carnal...NOT spiritual...every one wants to "DO things" for God, but no one wants to actually OBEY GOD ON HIS TERMS and DIE to self....we Think that Becasue we say we love God, adn God Gave us a desire for something, adn a mind...that we need to Usee our minds, FOR GOd. YOU CANT....JEsus told us to deny our selves, Paul said Crusify the flesh, YOUR wants YOUR Ideas of what YOU can do for GOd is FLESH...and should be put under so you can TRULY obey God.

But no one EVER preaches that. The main "Gospel" i hear preached is "try your best" and "Strive to do all you can for Jesus" excpet you cant do ANYTHING for GOd, or Jesus untill you DENY SELF. Truly just completely utterly submitt yourself.


....THAT is obeying God, THAT is love, OBEDIENCE. NOT opinion.

And ALL this over some hevy metal. Again, STOP trying to justify self. Thats what Christians do, they want Jesus, AND Stuff....Jesus AND themselves...Jesus AND music, Jesus and There Life..Jesus said if you dont HATE your life, YOU CANT be My disciple....EVERYONE MUST be a disciple of Chirst...otherowse yu cant truly love him. If JEsus isnt YOUR LORD, then you dont love Jesus and you dont love God.


Obedience is soooo crucial. We as the body of Jesus, need to stop justifying our selfish desires. Truly. You said YOU asked God, But thats truly not true...Becasue if you did, you would stop saying its a personal Choice ...ITS NOT, if i had my personal Choice...Well theres allot of Things i would do, in the flesh...none would be sin persay, but NONE is spiritual, none is GOD moved, spirit Moved...it would be self promoted, self inspired...HUMANISTIC...and thats what Christinty has become Humanism with Jesus stapled on the side.....


We need to SUBMIT ourselves 100% over to Jesus, just keep giving ourselves to his Rule, and be SLAVES of Righteousness. SLaves have no say in there lives. If Jesus is your MASTER, your LORD, then YOU have no say....it is no longer about YOU.

We need to wake up. Truly. I dont say any of this to condem, or to be "Right" No...its crucial that more people hear this...I wish some one would have told me, this when i was younger...This is the time to get SERIOUS with Jesus, and we cant do that justifying our actions, adn making Opinion to be TRUTH, there is only ONE truth, and we need to Submit to HIM. Jesus bless you. (this has been to EVERYONE who reads this, and not just you Audrey... So i hope this doesnt come off as an attack...God puts things on my heart, so i must speak them as the spirit moves me...)

 

[AudreyNicole]

It says in psalm 150:5 "Praise him upon the loud cymbals" - literally, "the cymbals of sound" or hearing.

It means praise him with audibly expressed Joy...if there are cymbols around...go ahead bang on the cymbols...its not REALLY talking about music...

Hmmmm, the definition of music is "an art of sound in time that expresses ideas and emotions in significant forms through the elements of rhythm, melody, harmony" so I would have to say that using cymbals (rhythm) and audibly expressing joy (sound) qualifies this particular passage as being indeed music.

He loves and respects our free will? NO he doesn't!! those are lies my friend.

....I hope you don't mean He doesn't love us or respect our free will, and if you do than I think we are talking about two different God's which would explain the differences in opinion.

But giving into the flesh, again, IS NOT Worship. its SELF Worship. Its entertainment. Its not worship. If you are miserable worshiping God, in any respect other then Demon hunter...or even Maranatha! ...if you NEED stimulation other then the pure Holy spirit of The Almighty, in order to Worship God, then you have never been doing so, you have been deceived...you were not worshiping God in Truth, Nor spirit. adn should go before God and ask him to truly fill you with the spirit( daily...I ask to be filled and guided, and focused on him all the time...It just doesn't HAPPEN...you need to SEEK the kingdom...You need to ASK "you don't have because you don't ask"

Well I wouldn't agree that music is only entertainment because again, God tell us in the Bible to praise Him through music, so obviously we can worship Him through music, as He tells us. And I am definitely never miserable worshiping God, I was just saying that we ought to use everything we interact with to glorify His name, including music. I have asked for much guidance in this area and the Spirit has led me to many forms of worship, including music. I see and hear the Lord in everything I do thanks to the renewing of my mind, He is a part of every aspect of my life including the music I listen to... that is how eagerly I seek Him, and that is one of the ways He has revealed Himself to me.

The modern Church has been moved by evil, and selfishness soo much, that no one has the intimate quiet relatinship with the spirit of God like they should...Its time to Truly SEEK Gods word for you in your life. Get out of the flesh, Crucify the flesh. KILL it! Get rid of it, it wil only lead to damnation. Paul repeatedly yelled at the Corinthinas, i beleive it was, becasue he kept telling thme what to do, and he would find out the kept living in the flesh, they were CARNAL, and not SPiritual.

THAT is what this "Christian" world is, STILL, Carnal...NOT spiritual...every one wants to "DO things" for God, but no one wants to actually OBEY GOD ON HIS TERMS and DIE to self....we Think that Becasue we say we love God, adn God Gave us a desire for something, adn a mind...that we need to Usee our minds, FOR GOd. YOU CANT....JEsus told us to deny our selves, Paul said Crusify the flesh, YOUR wants YOUR Ideas of what YOU can do for GOd is FLESH...and should be put under so you can TRULY obey God.

....THAT is obeying God, THAT is love, OBEDIENCE. NOT opinion.

Obedience is soooo crucial. We as the body of Jesus, need to stop justifying our selfish desires. Truly. You said YOU asked God, But thats truly not true...Becasue if you did, you would stop saying its a personal Choice ...ITS NOT, if i had my personal Choice...Well theres allot of Things i would do, in the flesh...none would be sin persay, but NONE is spiritual, none is GOD moved, spirit Moved...it would be self promoted, self inspired...HUMANISTIC...and thats what Christinty has become Humanism with Jesus stapled on the side.....

We need to SUBMIT ourselves 100% over to Jesus, just keep giving ourselves to his Rule, and be SLAVES of Righteousness. SLaves have no say in there lives. If Jesus is your MASTER, your LORD, then YOU have no say....it is no longer about YOU.

(this has been to EVERYONE who reads this, and not just you Audrey... So i hope this doesnt come off as an attack...God puts things on my heart, so i must speak them as the spirit moves me...

I guess this is just all hard for me to "get" or "agree" to because the Bible says that God will "remove from me my heart of stone and give me a heart of flesh. And will put His Spirit in me and move me". There are so many verses that promise me this so I know that it is true. If indeed the Lord truly thought this music was wrong for me to listen to He would have told me. I have asked Him about it, I have seeked Him over it, I have come to Him willingly and faithfully in 100% obedience, just as you say, begging and thirsting for this very truth and this very knowledge. I have been praying about it for many months, asking for Him to show me the error of my ways and bless me with unmistakable clarity of truth and sight. I hourly crucify my flesh and am always completely aware of His presence in every step that I take. HE guides my ways and I have many many examples to demonstrate such leading. My greatest desire is to follow ONLY GOD. And I continually ask for Him to sever all ties I have with the world. The Bible says ask and you shall receive... well, I have asked, and the answer I received was just what I said last time.

God would NOT deceive me; God would NOT lie to me; He would NOT lead me to anything that was not true. I know in complete truth that there is nothing wrong with this music. That is the knowledge Lord has led me to, and again, God does NOT lie. So I respectfully cannot agree with you because that would be ignoring/doubting God. So I suppose I must agree to disagree with you on this one. As long as we follow truth and only truth we will not be led astray. That is exactly what I am doing, I am following and doing everything you said and everything the Bible says, so I must come to the conclusion that I am not being deceived. And if you believe I am, that is your own judgment (not the Lord's), and again, I only follow truth, and as long as you do too I suppose we are all doing just fine.

 

[AudreyNicole]

P.S. Here are some lovely Underoath lyrics that worship (defn: adoring reverence or regard) God through 'audibly expressed joy'..... and they use cymbals too (like the Bible says)

Always did it my way on my own then one day I realized
I was blind, nothing I could do on my own
Turn, we have found a way to see, look up... feel the Almighty
Take control as we gaze into your eyes
We're just the tool you use to bring this world to you
Oh, Lord, how we love you
With your grace, take away the hurt and the bruises inside,
reach down let your glory reside
The cross carried for all of us, paint the image in my mind
So I will never think I am something,
but nothing am I but you, you are something
Lord you keep me alive, you give me rest at night
When there seems no way to find calmness in the storm you come and
take me in your arms and then the waves drown me no more
With you I'll last this battle and many others
Through the ages your name will reign forever... never to be replaced
In these trials I face, I pray you humble me
Humble me I want to be like you Jesus more and more like you
I was crucified on that day with Christ
Nailing you there with sin, accepting you
I nailed my soul to the cross and now my life begins
This world so cold but your love keeps me warm
My father holds me in his nailed scarred hands which I put there
But for some reason he still loves me with all his heart
Even through I betray him constantly
He always keeps his arms open waiting, till I give up my old ways
God my father, you are the only one that can give me comfort
You touch my heart in such a way that all I can do is cry your name
Jesus Christ I love you
My heart aches for your love

Jesus Christ I love you
Jesus Christ I love you
Jesus Christ I love you

 

[KingdomSeeker]

It says in psalm 150:5 "Praise him upon the loud cymbals" - literally, "the cymbals of sound" or hearing.

It means praise him with audibly expressed Joy...if there are cymbols around...go ahead bang on the cymbols...its not REALLY talking about music...

Hmmmm, the definition of music is "an art of sound in time that expresses ideas and emotions in significant forms through the elements of rhythm, melody, harmony" so I would have to say that using cymbals (rhythm) and audibly expressing joy (sound) qualifies this particular passage as being indeed music.
Ok, again, it is talking about music, and it isnt...Just like song of solomon IS talking about the shulamite, adn is also talking about Love of Gods people, and God...Spiritual consumation of matrimony...Allot of people JUST get the physically aspect...but in ever PHYSICAL word there is the spiritual meaning...ESPECIALLY in the psalms and proverbs and song of solomon. The clanging symbol...the "loud cymbol" doesnt Necessarily mean music...it CAN...but it doesnt fully, its only part...and i never said dont worship in music, or that one couldnt, I stated that if you ARE to praise and woship with music, it will not be contrived it will be from the heart...personal...and not someoen elses....But again...im not attacking...emotion ad ntone is very hard to show in text....hence the pink ...but pink doesnt make this any less true

He loves and respects our free will? NO he doesn't!! those are lies my friend.

....I hope you don't mean He doesn't love us or respect our free will, and if you do than I think we are talking about two different God's which would explain the differences in opinion.
HE loves us. Oh most deffinately. He GIVES us free will, in that we are not Robots. and he doesnt FORCE us to obey him. Yes. But if you call him your father, you WILL obey him...Im not saying you dont, Im also not saying I do in everyway...Im saying...DONT call flesh worship...hahah Im just going to keep it at that.

But giving into the flesh, again, IS NOT Worship. its SELF Worship. Its entertainment. Its not worship. If you are miserable worshiping God, in any respect other then Demon hunter...or even Maranatha! ...if you NEED stimulation other then the pure Holy spirit of The Almighty, in order to Worship God, then you have never been doing so, you have been deceived...you were not worshiping God in Truth, Nor spirit. adn should go before God and ask him to truly fill you with the spirit( daily...I ask to be filled and guided, and focused on him all the time...It just doesn't HAPPEN...you need to SEEK the kingdom...You need to ASK "you don't have because you don't ask"

Well I wouldn't agree that music is only entertainment because again, God tell us in the Bible to praise Him through music, so obviously we can worship Him through music, as He tells us. And I am definitely never miserable worshiping God, I was just saying that we ought to use everything we interact with to glorify His name, including music. I have asked for much guidance in this area and the Spirit has led me to many forms of worship, including music. I see and hear the Lord in everything I do thanks to the renewing of my mind, He is a part of every aspect of my life including the music I listen to... that is how eagerly I seek Him, and that is one of the ways He has revealed Himself to me.
Again, you missunderstand me, but thats you know, understadnable..its atext base conversation. MUSIC is definately one of the many way we can worship God, But if you CANT worship god outside of playing a CD...then you need to do some seeking. Also, Again, MOST music, Christian music, is Flesh. its glitz, its glamour, Its fine to have. But dont call flesh Worship. If you are overcoem by the spirit of the most high God, adn you feel like he put a song on your heart, or a dance in your body, then sing, play, adn dance unto the lord...but if you are putting on music, and then the music, makes your flesh dance, adn you CALL that dancing unto the Lord...the nthere is a difference...Truly. 2 different things
The modern Church has been moved by evil, and selfishness soo much, that no one has the intimate quiet relatinship with the spirit of God like they should...Its time to Truly SEEK Gods word for you in your life. Get out of the flesh, Crucify the flesh. KILL it! Get rid of it, it wil only lead to damnation. Paul repeatedly yelled at the Corinthinas, i beleive it was, becasue he kept telling thme what to do, and he would find out the kept living in the flesh, they were CARNAL, and not SPiritual.

THAT is what this "Christian" world is, STILL, Carnal...NOT spiritual...every one wants to "DO things" for God, but no one wants to actually OBEY GOD ON HIS TERMS and DIE to self....we Think that Becasue we say we love God, adn God Gave us a desire for something, adn a mind...that we need to Usee our minds, FOR GOd. YOU CANT....JEsus told us to deny our selves, Paul said Crusify the flesh, YOUR wants YOUR Ideas of what YOU can do for GOd is FLESH...and should be put under so you can TRULY obey God.

....THAT is obeying God, THAT is love, OBEDIENCE. NOT opinion.

Obedience is soooo crucial. We as the body of Jesus, need to stop justifying our selfish desires. Truly. You said YOU asked God, But thats truly not true...Becasue if you did, you would stop saying its a personal Choice ...ITS NOT, if i had my personal Choice...Well theres allot of Things i would do, in the flesh...none would be sin persay, but NONE is spiritual, none is GOD moved, spirit Moved...it would be self promoted, self inspired...HUMANISTIC...and thats what Christinty has become Humanism with Jesus stapled on the side.....

We need to SUBMIT ourselves 100% over to Jesus, just keep giving ourselves to his Rule, and be SLAVES of Righteousness. SLaves have no say in there lives. If Jesus is your MASTER, your LORD, then YOU have no say....it is no longer about YOU.

(this has been to EVERYONE who reads this, and not just you Audrey... So i hope this doesnt come off as an attack...God puts things on my heart, so i must speak them as the spirit moves me...

I guess this is just all hard for me to "get" or "agree" to because the Bible says that God will "remove from me my heart of stone and give me a heart of flesh.

The heart of stone was removed YOu SHOULD have new desires, that dont go after the flesh but after the spirit.(which has been my point the whole time...We are too fleshy...we repeatedly mistake emotion for the spirit of God. Mistake OUR WANT for What GOd would want). There are still MANY verses That say, "the heart is wicked, and decietful above all things"(paraphrased)

And will put His Spirit in me and move me".

There are so many verses that promise me this so I know that it is true.

If indeed the Lord truly thought this music was wrong for me to listen to He would have told me. I have asked Him about it, I have seeked Him over it, I have come to Him willingly and faithfully in 100% obedience, just as you say, begging and thirsting for this very truth and this very knowledge. I have been praying about it for many months, asking for Him to show me the error of my ways and bless me with unmistakable clarity of truth and sight. I hourly crucify my flesh and am always completely aware of His presence in every step that I take. HE guides my ways and I have many many examples to demonstrate such leading. My greatest desire is to follow ONLY GOD. And I continually ask for Him to sever all ties I have with the world. The Bible says ask and you shall receive... well, I have asked, and the answer I received was just what I said last time.

God would NOT deceive me; God would NOT lie to me; He would NOT lead me to anything that was not true. I know in complete truth that there is nothing wrong with this music. That is the knowledge Lord has led me to, and again, God does NOT lie. So I respectfully cannot agree with you because that would be ignoring/doubting God. So I suppose I must agree to disagree with you on this one. As long as we follow truth and only truth we will not be led astray. That is exactly what I am doing, I am following and doing everything you said and everything the Bible says, so I must come to the conclusion that I am not being deceived. And if you believe I am, that is your own judgment (not the Lord's), and again, I only follow truth, and as long as you do too I suppose we are all doing just fine.

Ok Dear sister in Christ, Well I have said all i will say. I cant say GOd did or did not tell you, anything, just like i guess you could not tell me. I just truly hope that you continue to just depelt yourself of you, more and more. Its a process. but its cruical and needed. Jesus bless you.

 

[CherryFizzle]

I thought this would of been pretty obvious.
There is music that glorifies God and for worship that can bring on the Holy spirit, which is an amazing thing, but there is also music which is designed to invoke demonic activity.

Just like David played music that caused the demon to flee, there is music that attracts them as well. It is used in occult practices even today.

I don't see the Holy spirit having any involvement with Heavy metal music whatsoever. Infact, the very notion is digusting.
Its true that metal bands have terrible symbols and some are outright Satanic or blasphemous, but the actual musicality invokes demonic activity just as much. Why do you think the Heavy Metal industry is predominately Satanic!? Because that is what it attracts, and is used for.
I don't care if they are singing "I Love Jesus!". There are different ideologies of "Jesus" within different religions, even in the occult. It doesn't mean they are Christian at all. And even if they claim to be, I don't buy it. Because I have seen so many so-called "Christian" bands who go against the Word of God both in their imagery & lyrical content (discounting the musicality itself).
It is just the same as saying I can perform Satanic rituals, but if I praise Jesus while I do it, He will be happy with me. It is ridiculous!

There are also people that think they are serving the Lord, but do things that go against his Word. We're warned of it in scripture.

" Matthew 7:21 "Not everyone who says to Me, 'Lord, Lord,' shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven."


People need to remember that Lucifer was in charge of the music used in Heaven to praise God. That is his art, he knows it well. And if he knows how to praise God effectively with music, he certainly knows how to do the opposite. Its obvious he is going to use his best talent against God, and thus on us to bring us away.

You might personally like heavy metal, but that doesn't mean its right. Infact, the whole point is for it to be appealing to you (and it targets the youth very well), so you can be lead astray. People need to stop being so biased. Listen to them if you wish, but don't try to say it is right just because you do so.

 

[Jacob123]

I thought this would of been pretty obvious.
There is music that glorifies God and for worship that can bring on the Holy spirit, which is an amazing thing, but there is also music which is designed to invoke demonic activity.

Just like David played music that caused the demon to flee, there is music that attracts them as well. It is used in occult practices even today.

I don't see the Holy spirit having any involvement with Heavy metal music whatsoever. Infact, the very notion is digusting.
Its true that metal bands have terrible symbols and some are outright Satanic or blasphemous, but the actual musicality invokes demonic activity just as much. Why do you think the Heavy Metal industry is predominately Satanic!? Because that is what it attracts, and is used for.
I don't care if they are singing "I Love Jesus!". There are different ideologies of "Jesus" within different religions, even in the occult. It doesn't mean they are Christian at all. And even if they claim to be, I don't buy it. Because I have seen so many so-called "Christian" bands who go against the Word of God both in their imagery & lyrical content (discounting the musicality itself).
It is just the same as saying I can perform Satanic rituals, but if I praise Jesus while I do it, He will be happy with me. It is ridiculous!

There are also people that think they are serving the Lord, but do things that go against his Word. We're warned of it in scripture.

" Matthew 7:21 "Not everyone who says to Me, 'Lord, Lord,' shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven."


People need to remember that Lucifer was in charge of the music used in Heaven to praise God. That is his art, he knows it well. And if he knows how to praise God effectively with music, he certainly knows how to do the opposite. Its obvious he is going to use his best talent against God, and thus on us to bring us away.

You might personally like heavy metal, but that doesn't mean its right. Infact, the whole point is for it to be appealing to you (and it targets the youth very well), so you can be lead astray. People need to stop being so biased. Listen to them if you wish, but don't try to say it is right just because you do so.

Heavy metal is just a style of music,the lyrics in Christian metal can still be uplifting, just as uplifting as a worship song.

 

[CherryFizzle]

Heavy metal is just a style of music,the lyrics in Christian metal can still be uplifting, just as uplifting as a worship song.

Well of course Heavy metal is a style. And it is a style that uses particular musical forms. I'm not talking about the lyrics either. I'm talking about the music (without the lyrics). The imagery & lyrics are another story that is also relevant.

This music is physiologically antithetical to God, it produces a taste for subjective, feeling-inducing music that is inappropriate. It is in no way Godly. Putting your desire for the music genre before God is shameful.
So-called "Christian Heavy metal bands" are trying to fit God's message into a predominately occult genre, which dulls you spiritually. You cannot make compromises with God.


Music is well known for invoking emotions, changes in mental state and is a very powerful tool. And beyond that occultists use specific forms of music in certain rituals invoke demonic entities.
Music can be used to produce trance-like states in people, to provoke someone to anger, sadness, fear and joy. Don't say it doesn't impact you, because it is truly universal in its effects.
You might think the lyrics are "uplifting" but your mind is taking in the music and the messages that is sending much faster. And you cannot prevent that function of your brain.
A veeery simplified and raw example would be if you were listening to a happy cheery toned song connected to a video of people being murdered...your brain will automatically respond to the images causing trauma, even if you are unaware of it.

In the short term you get to "feeling good", apparently still worshiping God and getting the form of music your flesh wants you to have. In the long term, you are trying to make a compromise with God, which is impossible. You either serve Him or you don't.

And I don't by any means single out Heavy metal... there are many forms of music up for discussion!

 

[Fraction]

I thought this would of been pretty obvious.
There is music that glorifies God and for worship that can bring on the Holy spirit, which is an amazing thing, but there is also music which is designed to invoke demonic activity.

Just like David played music that caused the demon to flee, there is music that attracts them as well. It is used in occult practices even today.

I don't see the Holy spirit having any involvement with Heavy metal music whatsoever. Infact, the very notion is digusting.
Its true that metal bands have terrible symbols and some are outright Satanic or blasphemous, but the actual musicality invokes demonic activity just as much. Why do you think the Heavy Metal industry is predominately Satanic!? Because that is what it attracts, and is used for.
I don't care if they are singing "I Love Jesus!". There are different ideologies of "Jesus" within different religions, even in the occult. It doesn't mean they are Christian at all. And even if they claim to be, I don't buy it. Because I have seen so many so-called "Christian" bands who go against the Word of God both in their imagery & lyrical content (discounting the musicality itself).
It is just the same as saying I can perform Satanic rituals, but if I praise Jesus while I do it, He will be happy with me. It is ridiculous!

There are also people that think they are serving the Lord, but do things that go against his Word. We're warned of it in scripture.

" Matthew 7:21 "Not everyone who says to Me, 'Lord, Lord,' shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven."


People need to remember that Lucifer was in charge of the music used in Heaven to praise God. That is his art, he knows it well. And if he knows how to praise God effectively with music, he certainly knows how to do the opposite. Its obvious he is going to use his best talent against God, and thus on us to bring us away.

You might personally like heavy metal, but that doesn't mean its right. Infact, the whole point is for it to be appealing to you (and it targets the youth very well), so you can be lead astray. People need to stop being so biased. Listen to them if you wish, but don't try to say it is right just because you do so.

The first thing you need to realize is that there are not just two types when it comes to music. Its not simply ANGELIC or DEMONIC. I know there are bands and music artists out there that use certain symbols. You should do research, because not all of those symbols are demonic. Some in fact have two meanings possibly. For example, the band HIM uses a heartagram from a symbol. Its an altered pentagram, with a heart in it. A closed minded person, will immediately think that it is satanic and needs to be condemned. This is a made up symbol, that means the balance between love and hate (like a yin yang). You might not agree with the symbols, but does it mean that they are representing evil? This same band goes on to use refrences to heaven and hell, and using numbers like 666 in their songs. However if you read the lyrics, it is metaphorical. Their songs are strictly and solely about love. I myself, am not weakened by this music but strengthened. I pay no mind to the metaphors, but I do develop an increased sense of love and passion for others. Symbols, mean nothing. Metaphors, mean nothing.

As for christian bands and music, they put their love for Jesus Christ for thousands and maybe millions of people to see. They make it public and known. They describe how powerful their faith is, and how powerful faith is in general. In what way does this even begin to hint at something else? Loving a diffferent Jesus or God? When scriptures are quoted, the band admits it openly to the world unashamed, or even when it is open praise of the Lord?

The verse you quoted is about faith. Following the law won't get you into heaven, but having faith does.

Who cares if lucifer was in charge of music? If that made any difference at all, we would only be attacked through music. Which is obviously not the case. The obvious opinion that you claim to have throughout this post, is not obvious at all. It is just your opinion and your view.

Well of course Heavy metal is a style. And it is a style that uses particular musical forms. I'm not talking about the lyrics either. I'm talking about the music (without the lyrics). The imagery & lyrics are another story that is also relevant.

This music is physiologically antithetical to God, it produces a taste for subjective, feeling-inducing music that is inappropriate. It is in no way Godly. Putting your desire for the music genre before God is shameful.
So-called "Christian Heavy metal bands" are trying to fit God's message into a predominately occult genre, which dulls you spiritually. You cannot make compromises with God.


Music is well known for invoking emotions, changes in mental state and is a very powerful tool. And beyond that occultists use specific forms of music in certain rituals invoke demonic entities.
Music can be used to produce trance-like states in people, to provoke someone to anger, sadness, fear and joy. Don't say it doesn't impact you, because it is truly universal in its effects.
You might think the lyrics are "uplifting" but your mind is taking in the music and the messages that is sending much faster. And you cannot prevent that function of your brain.
A veeery simplified and raw example would be if you were listening to a happy cheery toned song connected to a video of people being murdered...your brain will automatically respond to the images causing trauma, even if you are unaware of it.

In the short term you get to "feeling good", apparently still worshiping God and getting the form of music your flesh wants you to have. In the long term, you are trying to make a compromise with God, which is impossible. You either serve Him or you don't.

And I don't by any means single out Heavy metal... there are many forms of music up for discussion!

I added this one of your posts in here as well, because its just your opinion as well. I also wanted to add this after:

Like many things in the world, music and tv mainly, they affect us if we allow them to affect us. Unless music has a specific point to bash jesus or to praise the devil, we can take it how we want it. Emotions are not bad, because emotions cause us to love. Some of them suck and arent good, but Love is an emotion. If music does not affect your faith in Jesus Christ, then it is doing no harm. If the video is bad, dont watch the video.

You are entitled to your own opinion. This is your opinion, and this is mine: Evil music is evil, not music as a whole.

 

[Brother Mike]

Music.......

CherryFizzle

You might think the lyrics are "uplifting" but your mind is taking in the music and the messages that is sending much faster. And you cannot prevent that function of your brain.

The bible does not say what is good or bad music.... as in style or genera of music. After reading this whole thread I see lots of "young" in the lord Christians give opinions, but we need scripture, not opinions...

Judging: Lets stick with SCRIPTURE. Know them by their fruit.
Band serve God? Produce fruit of Salvation in personal lives?
(You can eliminate a whole bunch of "Heavy Metal" (Christian??) bands here.
P.O.D for example who love to drink and smoke..

Jesus said you will know them by their fruit..... That is scripture to use and to judge if a band is really producing music for God.. this will also remove any doubt about symbols or lyric content... A Band that loves God will not pervert the Word, or use things to bring the bands integrity into question.

CherryFizzle



She got pretty close to our other scripture.. Sad, nobody here had yet to bring it up... We are looking for scriptures on music.. all the rest is just speculation, feelings and opinion...

1Co 14:7 And even things without life giving sound, whether pipe or harp, except they give a distinction in the sounds, how shall it be known what is piped or harped?


Sound:

Sound is mentioned in 115 verses of the bible... KJV... It must be important...

Sound can frighten.... (Lv 26:36) (Job 15:21) (Many other scriptures)

Sound can define the presence of the Lord.... (2Sa 5:24)

Sound can Alert to events......(Warning sound) (2Sa 15:10) (many others)

Sound can have Joy......... (1 Kings 1:40) (Psa 89:15) (few others)

Sound designed by God, in his power, not men..

1Ch 16:42 And with them Heman and Jeduthun with trumpets and cymbals for those that should make a sound, and with musical instruments of God. And the sons of Jeduthun were porters.

Sound can praise God.....(right kind of sound).. (2Ch 5:13)

Sound can be to God, in a meditation, or over (resounding) type sound.... (Psa 92:3) "Heb higgayon"

Sound (no lyrics) can be Praise to God... (Psa 150:3)

Sound, it's tone, the tones constructed together give a message.....

1Co 14:7 And even things without life giving sound, whether pipe or harp, except they give a distinction in the sounds, how shall it be known what is piped or harped?

The way sound is put together gives that sound a distinction that we can recognize....and the sound be know... Tone, and organization of those tones....

Compare Jeremy Camp's "Take my Life" to Alice and Chains "Grind"

Both are pretty heavy crunchy songs... but one has dark and twisted tones....

Spooky music in Horror movies is so effective from the cha cha cha of friday the 13 to Halloween and Michael Myers..... (Amazing, written by John Carpenter himself)

God invented sound... Satan has taken that sound and twisted it.... making it dark... giving it a satanic meaning..

Jesus Is Lord.

 

[Jacob123]

Well of course Heavy metal is a style. And it is a style that uses particular musical forms. I'm not talking about the lyrics either. I'm talking about the music (without the lyrics). The imagery & lyrics are another story that is also relevant.

This music is physiologically antithetical to God, it produces a taste for subjective, feeling-inducing music that is inappropriate. It is in no way Godly. Putting your desire for the music genre before God is shameful.
So-called "Christian Heavy metal bands" are trying to fit God's message into a predominately occult genre, which dulls you spiritually. You cannot make compromises with God.


Music is well known for invoking emotions, changes in mental state and is a very powerful tool. And beyond that occultists use specific forms of music in certain rituals invoke demonic entities.
Music can be used to produce trance-like states in people, to provoke someone to anger, sadness, fear and joy. Don't say it doesn't impact you, because it is truly universal in its effects.
You might think the lyrics are "uplifting" but your mind is taking in the music and the messages that is sending much faster. And you cannot prevent that function of your brain.
A veeery simplified and raw example would be if you were listening to a happy cheery toned song connected to a video of people being murdered...your brain will automatically respond to the images causing trauma, even if you are unaware of it.

In the short term you get to "feeling good", apparently still worshiping God and getting the form of music your flesh wants you to have. In the long term, you are trying to make a compromise with God, which is impossible. You either serve Him or you don't.

And I don't by any means single out Heavy metal... there are many forms of music up for discussion!

God never said that if I listen to heavy metal, I will go to hell.

From what you're saying, it seems like if you put the uplifting lyrics from a christian heavy metal song into a gospel or pop tone, then all of the sudden your good, but if you listen to Christian lyrics in a metal genre, then all of the sudden you're satanic.

It is not the music, genre or tone that makes it Christian, it is the lyrics.

 

[CherryFizzle]

God never said that if I listen to heavy metal, I will go to hell.

From what you're saying, it seems like if you put the uplifting lyrics from a christian heavy metal song into a gospel or pop tone, then all of the sudden your good, but if you listen to Christian lyrics in a metal genre, then all of the sudden you're satanic.

It is not the music, genre or tone that makes it Christian, it is the lyrics.

Don't try to take my words out of context. I never said you would "go to hell" either, I said it is wrong and therefore will cause you troubles in your walk. Though weaker people can be led away.
As stated its not the "genre" its the tones etc and combined with the lyrics and symbolism it is worse.
Don't try to defend something just because you like it. Defend God because He is more important than any form of music.

Brother Mike

Thank goodness you understand what I'm saying. I didn't post all the scriptures, but I base everything on scripture anyway, as a Christian I assumed thats what everyone else does and they would know what I'm basing it on, but now I can see it isn't so.

Agreed. P.O.D as a "Christian band" is a joke. They have occult symbols, e.g the triquetra, which is the ancient Celtic symbol meant to embody the sacred number 3, as the 3 phases of the goddess (maiden, mother, crone) and the 3 elements of nature. It was also adopted in th Gnostic faith and is used openly in the "new age" religion for their inter-woven/locked 6's which is 666. Aleister Crowley also used it as the symbol 666 in his teachings, and thus it is popular in the occult world under different forms of Satanism, witchcraft etc.

They also promote Rastafari(ism) which is more than just an African feel good movement involving chilling with some weed. Rastafari believe the Messiah is Haile Selassie, the last emperor of Ethiopia and a reincarnation of God. They also believe the "White people's God is from the Devil". They believe Africa is the "Promised land" and is Zion. So when they are singing about Zion...its Africa they are talking about. The name Rastafari (which they preferre, disliking the "ism") Literially means Head/Duke Tafari which was Haile Selassie's pre-regnal Amharic name. I can get more in depth on how they are Rastafari and what that religion actually believe, which is anti-Christian, if you want me to.
Also note that Wuv and Sonny were brought up by their Rastafari Uncle.

Fraction

You need to really re-evaluate what you just said. You are making excuses to justify the bands you like. I used to love so many bands, and I can admit there are bands I still like now that I refuse to listen to anymore because I know they are wrong. I don't defend them just because they appeal to me, because I would be a biased hypocrite and God knows it.

NEVER defend the number 666. It is Satan's number. It tells you in the Bible, and you are not to accept it at all. Do you honestly think the band members don't know that? Of course they do.

I liked HIM, and I spouted the same hypocritical stuff when I was like 14 years old. The band H.I.M's symbol is called the Heartagram. Its a Heart shape within a pentagram. Therefore still a pentagram, just like you get inverted pentagrams and other decorated types. You have fallen for the trap...
"Well its got a heart in it, so now its not a pentagram".
And if you try to say its like the yin yang, well that is still occult based! As the yin yang refers to the divine feminine and Masculine energy combined which stems from pagan religions and ancient occult practices of the goddess and the male counterfeit "god". It is also the bases of sex-magick. The masonic checkerboard means the same thing, as do the downward pointed triangle combined with the upward pointed triangle. There are other occult symbols aswell, and all these symbols are very important within the occult!

Symbols are not meaningless! Those in the occult use them to invoke demonic activity in and out of rituals. They are used to attach demons to people and places. They give them a right to be there. So if you accept them you are giving them the right to be there, and as a Christian it is a joke to even defend it.

Remember: Ephesians 5:11

I don't expect many people to like what I say, but people don't tend to like the truth. I'm actually disappointed with most Christians today because they are doing what they "feel" is okay instead of listening to God and His word, which is what you are meant to do in the first place. :\

 

[Brother Mike]

The Sound...

Jacob123

I also was hard pressed to find CherryFizzle condemn anyone to Hell for Heavy Metal... You just made that up, with a false accusation... Please be more mature in future post...

Scripture:The scripture does not say how many beats per min until its a satanic song... Does not say if heavy distortion or "Crunch" make it evil or not.The bible does talk about sound, and the way sound is put together.

except they give a distinction in the sounds, how shall it be known

The bible also talks about anything that is not of faith is sin..........

Anything you have to defend or make an excuse for, or fool yourself into thinking it's right.............. IS SIN!!!!

People, you know right away in your heart if it's right or not....

Excuses:
CherryFizzle: quoted.........

You need to really re-evaluate what you just said. You are making excuses to justify the bands you like.

Rom 14:23 And he that doubteth is damned if he eat, because he eateth not of faith: for whatsoever is not of faith is sin.

"Well, it is a skull and cross bone fish... but the fish means Jesus"
"They are not evil.. they mentioned Jesus 3 times in 4 albums"

The Worse deception you can do, is to yourself.. to ignore what is in your heart the minute you pick up Music to listen to.....

Do you not know that your conscience can be seared?? and The Holy Spirit stop dealing with you on something that is destructive once you have convinced yourself it's good??

Even people that just "live together" if your saved, at least one knows that it's not good to just shack up.... They lie to one other and others.. "But I love them.. and God understands"......... No, you were commanded to Marry them... and the marriage bed be undefiled... that is What God said... Go to God with vows... and sanctify the partnership with Him............ then make it legal unto man with a marriage certificate.

I am reading post and defense of things that tell me clearly people here really do know in their heart what was right the first time they heard the Music.....

Take heed...

Jesus Is Lord.