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I don't believe a loving God would send people to hell.....

Maybe not hell, but Revelation 20:15 does say that anyone not found written in the Book of Life will be cast into the lake of fire. Doesn't sound like anyone is going to voluntarily be jumping into it.

If they're choosing to reject Jesus, they're choosing to go there. They are in effect "jumping in".
They may not believe it, they may not see it, but in the end, it doesn't matter. Everyone has a way out.
 
So you believe that hell as a place of torment does not exist for people?
That's correct. The Bible is replete with statements that the wicked will be destroyed. John said that God sent His Son that whosoever believes should not perish. Paul said the wages of sin is death. God said through Ezekiel, the soul that sins shall die. Read Psalm 37, David speaks of the destinies of the righteous and the wicked. Over and over through the Psalm we see the righteous will inherit the land (earth) and the wicked will be destroyed. This is all through the Bible. The idea of eternal torment comes from a false doctrine called "The Immortal Soul". It's argued that all souls are immortal and therefore they have to be somewhere after death. Obviously the wicked cannot be with God, so, they must be somewhere else. Since the Bible says the wicked will be cast into the Lake of Fire, it is concluded that the wicked will live eternally in the Lake of Fire, thus we have eternal torment. However, this doctrine of "The Immortal Soul" is not Biblical. Paul said that the Father alone has immortality. If the Father is the only one that has immortality, then man is not immortal.

13 I urge you in the sight of God who gives life to all things, and before Christ Jesus who witnessed the good confession before Pontius Pilate,
14 that you keep this commandment without spot, blameless until our Lord Jesus Christ's appearing,
15 which He will manifest in His own time, He who is the blessed and only Potentate, the King of kings and Lord of lords,
16 who alone has immortality, dwelling in unapproachable light, whom no man has seen or can see, to whom be honor and everlasting power. Amen. (1 Tim. 6:13-16 NKJ)


Here Paul says that the one no man has seen, nor can see, is the only one who has immortality. That's the Father. Further God tells Adam that he is dust.

In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return. (Gen. 3:19 KJV)


God also says that man is flesh.

And the LORD said, My spirit shall not always strive with man, for that he also is flesh: yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years. (Gen. 6:3 KJV)


We know that the flesh dies. Thus it is not immortal. However, Paul tells us that those who do good deeds are seeking immortality. If they are seeking it they obviously don't have it.

To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life: (Rom. 2:7 KJV)


There's a lot more I could go into. We could look at what a man is to see that he is flesh and not immortal. Another reason this idea of eternal torment continues to exist is because of a poor translation of the Hebrew word "olam" and the Greek word "aion". They are often translated as, forever, everlasting, or eternal. However, they don't mean eternal. They are wrongly translated.
 
That's correct. The Bible is replete with statements that the wicked will be destroyed. John said that God sent His Son that whosoever believes should not perish. Paul said the wages of sin is death. God said through Ezekiel, the soul that sins shall die. Read Psalm 37, David speaks of the destinies of the righteous and the wicked. Over and over through the Psalm we see the righteous will inherit the land (earth) and the wicked will be destroyed. This is all through the Bible. The idea of eternal torment comes from a false doctrine called "The Immortal Soul". It's argued that all souls are immortal and therefore they have to be somewhere after death. Obviously the wicked cannot be with God, so, they must be somewhere else. Since the Bible says the wicked will be cast into the Lake of Fire, it is concluded that the wicked will live eternally in the Lake of Fire, thus we have eternal torment. However, this doctrine of "The Immortal Soul" is not Biblical. Paul said that the Father alone has immortality. If the Father is the only one that has immortality, then man is not immortal.

13 I urge you in the sight of God who gives life to all things, and before Christ Jesus who witnessed the good confession before Pontius Pilate,
14 that you keep this commandment without spot, blameless until our Lord Jesus Christ's appearing,
15 which He will manifest in His own time, He who is the blessed and only Potentate, the King of kings and Lord of lords,
16 who alone has immortality, dwelling in unapproachable light, whom no man has seen or can see, to whom be honor and everlasting power. Amen. (1 Tim. 6:13-16 NKJ)


Here Paul says that the one no man has seen, nor can see, is the only one who has immortality. That's the Father. Further God tells Adam that he is dust.

In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return. (Gen. 3:19 KJV)

God also says that man is flesh.

And the LORD said, My spirit shall not always strive with man, for that he also is flesh: yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years. (Gen. 6:3 KJV)

We know that the flesh dies. Thus it is not immortal. However, Paul tells us that those who do good deeds are seeking immortality. If they are seeking it they obviously don't have it.

To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life: (Rom. 2:7 KJV)

There's a lot more I could go into. We could look at what a man is to see that he is flesh and not immortal. Another reason this idea of eternal torment continues to exist is because of a poor translation of the Hebrew word "olam" and the Greek word "aion". They are often translated as, forever, everlasting, or eternal. However, they don't mean eternal. They are wrongly translated.

Interesting.

What do you make of Jesus story of Lazarus and the Rich man in hell?
If you think that is symbolic and a metaphor, then what do you think the story is trying to communicate?

My understanding of the whole story is that how you life now matters and will determine your eternity.
“But Abraham replied, ‘Son, remember that in your lifetime you received your good things, while Lazarus received bad things, but now he is comforted here and you are in agony."
Luke 16:25

Please share your thoughts,

God Bless
 
I think it's wrong to use fear tactics to try and get people saved. Fear has been used to keep the masses in control in the past. The Bible doesn't teach that God sends people to the English concept of hell. The original languages don't contain the word hell. The Original languages use the words sheol or Hades, which are the grave. Everyone goes there. Tartarus is reserved for angels so that doesn't pertain to people. That leaves us with Gehenna. Gehenna is a valley outside of Jerusalem where God will burn the bodies of those who oppose Him. The Bible does not teach that God torments people or that He keeps them alive for the sole purpose of torturing them for eternity. That doctrine impugns God's character. It's a doctrine that drives people away from God.
Well we all should know that the word Hell or torment or what ever you want to call it with a "finite" brain, That can no where come near the thoughts of a "Infinite" incomprehensible being we call GOD. And we got the nerve to argue about it. Where ever the place is That Jesus has describe. Which is place even GOD dwells, There is one place you are going to be glad you are there. There is going to be another place you wish you wasn't there, and you wish you was somewhere else.

It never cease to amaze me, a finite corrupted creature called man with a limited brain, thinks that he is in The neighbor of GOD and Think he is just like him and give GOD orders and tell GOD how is Like. and knows HIs language. Pride in Man is so, in his relationship with GOD. His thoughts is no where near us. "Anthropomorphic" words. We are on a scale with GOD. TO OBEY. He never told us to figure him out. Or to explain what he means. That is Foulness and GOD knows it.
Hell is this hell is that, hades, hades this. Worldly as can be and we love it! Please, worldly as can be and calling it fellowshipping with GOD.

That is why The Scriptures Commands, Grow up into Maturity. Set you affections to things into the HEAVENS. And keep you mind there. We must Stop being "ANTI- Word of GOD" Anti- Jesus WORDS. Jesus talked more about HELL than He did About LOVE. He Proclaim He CAME to deliver us From "The WRATH of GOD". which is to come. To Save us From HIS FATHER. And his Father is not a "Tinker Bell".

And when He unleash that Wrath whom the FAther is going to send. We will know what a GOD is. And he is not going to be riding a "Pink Horse".

Many of us knows what a "Traitor" is, well maybe some of us don't. But let me give you a "picture" of a "Apostate" a christian who do not believe that GOD is going to rain down torment like The world have never seen and when the games begin, He or she switch teams. Because you Must be Believer in "THE WORD OF GOD". But When These games begin you cannot switch teams. The WORD says this:

"Therefore everyone who confesses Me before men, I will also confess him before My Father in heaven. ..But whoever denies Me before men, I will also deny him before My Father in heaven....Do not assume that I have come to bring peace to the earth; I have not come to bring peace, but a sword.…":eyes:

We better stop thinking like "Betty Crocker" and The "Pillsbury Doughboy" We better start thinking like: "Eyes Flaming Fire" Robe dipped in blood, and A Sword in HIs Mouth. "Thunder Rolling", LIGHTENING Flashing across the SKY, Even The Demons will be looking for place to hide.

You see a lot of Christians do not believe JESUS when HE said this: {They think it is a Biblical error]


American Standard Version
But I will warn you whom ye shall fear: Fear him, who after he hath killed hath power to cast into hell; yea, I say unto you, Fear him.

A person has to put out of their mind, Thinking they can convince us, that GOD has not A Terrible place of Punishment reserved for the wicked and who ever he wants to put there. And we know it is something outside of this created world. Because all creation, GOD will destroy. But That place of Torment that is reserve for souls too. Will never die out, it is like a "Eternal flame". God is not A JOKE. The devil will have more mercy on you than GOD, on many of occasions.:eyes:

Note: In my pursuit in "sanctification and Holiness" when i came into Christ, I prayed many days and Night , Teach me LORD , to Fear you and Your name. Please teach me the Fear of The LORD, Mold me shape me, that I am afraid, to turn to the left or the right. Put The fear of GOD in me! Because I know I will turn my back on you. If David did, If Solomon did it, Peter did it. and If Judas did it , i will too. KEEP ME! Put the fear of GOD In ME!

Now everybody else, may do what they want to do. The Bible, The "Beginning of Wisdom is Fearing GOD". And many has said to me. Well That means giving "reverence" to GOD. Well you give him reverence. I want Fear, I want to be so scared, I will not step on a Ant. Or even think about how good your wife look. I ain't going to hell!:eyes: I am going give all i got, come no where near that place. [I been close] I do not see how female christians do it, Divorce their husbands and get another. It is not worth the risks. I will take loneliness any day. Eternal Torment is not worth it or taking the risks.

And all those know it all christians who do not believe the Word of GOD. And A place of "Eternal Punishment" more power to you, but please, do not try to convince me or my family or others there is not such a place. And If you do, I consider you a "ENEMY of GOD"! and If it is a place design by GOD For "TORMENT" Heaven will rejoice at your entrance because you still will be manifesting The GLORY of GOD Through out Eternity. And your worms will not die out.

Some Theological Scholars has Said, The term is a Place of "TORMENT" and the words hell, hades, or what ever you want call it. Is more Terrifying that a Human mind can conceive for this place is not a place for bodies or minds it is a place for "SOULS" This place torments SOULS where they cannot rest. Although GOD is There but yet He is absent from their Soul and They are alone. "Tormented" for all their sins are killing them and they cannot die and they cannot rest. Over and over and over again. "Guilt" eating them away. Every lie every though, that never dies. No grace, no mercy. no hope, your SOUL is in Torment! and the torment, runs like running fire that cannot be Quench.

Do not be a fool and take the risks.

Turn form your sins, "Repent" turn around and go back the other way. do not take The Risks
 
Interesting.

What do you make of Jesus story of Lazarus and the Rich man in hell?


Please share your thoughts,

God Bless

Obviously that if you have a good life that you're going to have a bad one, and if you have a bad life that you're going to have a good one.
 
I think about when people say the phrase "I don't believe a loving God would send
people to hell"

I myself am unaware of even so much as a shred of sensible evidence proving
there's an afterlife let alone a fiery hell, nor do I know of someone certifiably
credible who has actually been there and back with a story to tell. The only
"evidence" that Christians have is their holy book, which itself has yet to be proven
100% true and reliable.

So then; Christians should not be upset when they encounter intelligent folks who
refuse to accept their religion's supernatural elements. I mean, just because there
was a historical Herod does not prove there is actually someone out there called
the Word; nor prove that this someone called the Word is responsible for the
existence of the cosmos with all of its forms of life, matter, and energy.

Faith is believin' what you know ain't so.
[ Mark Twain ]
_
 
Well we all should know that the word Hell or torment or what ever you want to call it with a "finite" brain, That can no where come near the thoughts of a "Infinite" incomprehensible being we call GOD. And we got the nerve to argue about it. Where ever the place is That Jesus has describe. Which is place even GOD dwells, There is one place you are going to be glad you are there. There is going to be another place you wish you wasn't there, and you wish you was somewhere else.

It never cease to amaze me, a finite corrupted creature called man with a limited brain, thinks that he is in The neighbor of GOD and Think he is just like him and give GOD orders and tell GOD how is Like. and knows HIs language. Pride in Man is so, in his relationship with GOD. His thoughts is no where near us. "Anthropomorphic" words. We are on a scale with GOD. TO OBEY. He never told us to figure him out. Or to explain what he means. That is Foulness and GOD knows it.
Hell is this hell is that, hades, hades this. Worldly as can be and we love it! Please, worldly as can be and calling it fellowshipping with GOD.

That is why The Scriptures Commands, Grow up into Maturity. Set you affections to things into the HEAVENS. And keep you mind there. We must Stop being "ANTI- Word of GOD" Anti- Jesus WORDS. Jesus talked more about HELL than He did About LOVE. He Proclaim He CAME to deliver us From "The WRATH of GOD". which is to come. To Save us From HIS FATHER. And his Father is not a "Tinker Bell".

And when He unleash that Wrath whom the FAther is going to send. We will know what a GOD is. And he is not going to be riding a "Pink Horse".

Many of us knows what a "Traitor" is, well maybe some of us don't. But let me give you a "picture" of a "Apostate" a christian who do not believe that GOD is going to rain down torment like The world have never seen and when the games begin, He or she switch teams. Because you Must be Believer in "THE WORD OF GOD". But When These games begin you cannot switch teams. The WORD says this:

"Therefore everyone who confesses Me before men, I will also confess him before My Father in heaven. ..But whoever denies Me before men, I will also deny him before My Father in heaven....Do not assume that I have come to bring peace to the earth; I have not come to bring peace, but a sword.…":eyes:

We better stop thinking like "Betty Crocker" and The "Pillsbury Doughboy" We better start thinking like: "Eyes Flaming Fire" Robe dipped in blood, and A Sword in HIs Mouth. "Thunder Rolling", LIGHTENING Flashing across the SKY, Even The Demons will be looking for place to hide.

You see a lot of Christians do not believe JESUS when HE said this: {They think it is a Biblical error]


American Standard Version
But I will warn you whom ye shall fear: Fear him, who after he hath killed hath power to cast into hell; yea, I say unto you, Fear him.

A person has to put out of their mind, Thinking they can convince us, that GOD has not A Terrible place of Punishment reserved for the wicked and who ever he wants to put there. And we know it is something outside of this created world. Because all creation, GOD will destroy. But That place of Torment that is reserve for souls too. Will never die out, it is like a "Eternal flame". God is not A JOKE. The devil will have more mercy on you than GOD, on many of occasions.:eyes:

Note: In my pursuit in "sanctification and Holiness" when i came into Christ, I prayed many days and Night , Teach me LORD , to Fear you and Your name. Please teach me the Fear of The LORD, Mold me shape me, that I am afraid, to turn to the left or the right. Put The fear of GOD in me! Because I know I will turn my back on you. If David did, If Solomon did it, Peter did it. and If Judas did it , i will too. KEEP ME! Put the fear of GOD In ME!

Now everybody else, may do what they want to do. The Bible, The "Beginning of Wisdom is Fearing GOD". And many has said to me. Well That means giving "reverence" to GOD. Well you give him reverence. I want Fear, I want to be so scared, I will not step on a Ant. Or even think about how good your wife look. I ain't going to hell!:eyes: I am going give all i got, come no where near that place. [I been close] I do not see how female christians do it, Divorce their husbands and get another. It is not worth the risks. I will take loneliness any day. Eternal Torment is not worth it or taking the risks.

And all those know it all christians who do not believe the Word of GOD. And A place of "Eternal Punishment" more power to you, but please, do not try to convince me or my family or others there is not such a place. And If you do, I consider you a "ENEMY of GOD"! and If it is a place design by GOD For "TORMENT" Heaven will rejoice at your entrance because you still will be manifesting The GLORY of GOD Through out Eternity. And your worms will not die out.

Some Theological Scholars has Said, The term is a Place of "TORMENT" and the words hell, hades, or what ever you want call it. Is more Terrifying that a Human mind can conceive for this place is not a place for bodies or minds it is a place for "SOULS" This place torments SOULS where they cannot rest. Although GOD is There but yet He is absent from their Soul and They are alone. "Tormented" for all their sins are killing them and they cannot die and they cannot rest. Over and over and over again. "Guilt" eating them away. Every lie every though, that never dies. No grace, no mercy. no hope, your SOUL is in Torment! and the torment, runs like running fire that cannot be Quench.

Do not be a fool and take the risks.

Turn form your sins, "Repent" turn around and go back the other way. do not take The Risks

It's interesting that you tell other how they are prideful claiming to know the Scriptures, yet you tell us that "Souls" will be tormented in hell. Do you think you're the only one who ever prayed for God to teach them? It's funny how those who disagree with you are "know it all" Christians. Firstly, no one is talking about understanding God. We are talking about understanding God's word to man. If God is going to write to man it's only common sense to think that man would be able to understand what is written to him. It doesn't really make sense for God to write something to man that only God can understand, does it? We can understand what God has given us if we use the proper methods. We've got two thousand years of baggage to sort through to find out what was original. Christians have been putting their spin on Scripture for about two thousand years.
 
Interesting.

What do you make of Jesus story of Lazarus and the Rich man in hell?
If you think that is symbolic and a metaphor, then what do you think the story is trying to communicate?

My understanding of the whole story is that how you life now matters and will determine your eternity.
“But Abraham replied, ‘Son, remember that in your lifetime you received your good things, while Lazarus received bad things, but now he is comforted here and you are in agony."
Luke 16:25

Please share your thoughts,

God Bless
Hi JIL,

Sure. I believe the story of Lazarus and the Rich Man is a parable. It's a parable about the coming destruction of the Priesthood in AD 70. Below is an overview that I wrote in another thread.

I would submit that the parable of Lazarus and the Rich Man is not about the afterlife at all, but rather it is a judgment against those to whom Jesus was speaking, the leadership of Israel. Why would one think this is a parable about an afterlife? If that 's the case, does it mean that the rich go to hell and the poor get saved? Jesus didn't say the rich man was wicked, He just said he was rich. Jesus didn't say that Lazarus was righteous, just that he was a poor. What is here that would indicate that this is what happens to the righteous and the wicked?
The details of the parable give us an indication of what it means. We're told that the Rich Man was clothed in purple and fine linen. What does that mean? We see that the Rich Man is a Jew. Why? We're told that the Rich Man had 5 brothers, why? Why is the beggar named Lazarus? What is "Abraham's bosom:"? All of these details are indications of what the parable is about. This parable is drawn from several Old Testament passages. For instance, the Rich Man is said to be suffering torment in flames in Hades. However, Jesus indicated that Gehenna is where the wicked will go. In the Scriptures Hades is usually translated the grave, not a place of torment. The grave is where the body goes. The Rich Man was in Hades, this indicates his body. We know that dead people can't speak so we should consider that this is a parable.
So, what do the details mean? In Jesus' day Israel didn't have a king, however, the priesthood unofficially served that role. Purple was the color of royalty and the priests wore fine linen, this indicates that the Rich Man represents the priesthood. We're also told that the Rich Man had 5 brothers. Levi had 5 brothers. Levi is the head of the Levites which was the tribe of the Priesthood. Why is the beggar named Lazarus? Lazarus is the Greek form of the Hebrew name Eleazar, which means, God Help. Who did God Help? Was it not Jesus? Wasn't the Father with Him and in Him. We're told that Lazarus was covered in sores. Jesus was covered in sores from the lashings. We're told that the dogs licked Lazarus' sores. In the Scriptures Gentiles are referred to as dogs by the Jews. So we have the Rich Man, the Jews, rejecting Lazarus while the dogs, the Gentiles, are accepting Him. Why is Lazarus in Abraham's bosom? Contrary to popular belief, Abraham's bosom is not a location somewhere in the Earth. Abraham's bosom is mentioned in another place in Scripture,
And Sarai said unto Abram, My wrong be upon thee: I have given my maid into thy bosom; and when she saw that she had conceived, I was despised in her eyes: the LORD judge between me and thee. (Gen. 16:5 KJV)
We see that being in Abraham's bosom means to be in an intimate relationship with Abraham. So, if Lazarus represents Jesus, what does it mean that He is in Abraham's bosom? It means that Abraham is embracing His long promised seed. The Jewish leadership thought that they were the seed of Abraham and heirs to the promises. While they were the physical seed of Abraham, they weren't the promised seed of Abraham. Jesus was the promised seed of Abraham. Paul tells us,
Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ. (Gal. 3:16 KJV)
So, in this parable we see the long awaited Seed of Abraham being embraced by Abraham, and the Jews, the physical seed, being cast off. They'er suffering in the flame. Since this is Hades and not Gehenna, what is the flame. We can see what it is from several Old Testament prophesies. In the Song of Moses, Moses wrote of what would happen to Israel in the latter days.
18 Of the Rock that begat thee thou art unmindful, and hast forgotten God that formed thee.
19 And when the LORD saw it, he abhorred them, because of the provoking of his sons, and of his daughters.1
20 And he said, I will hide my face from them, I will see what their end shall be: for they are a very froward generation, children in whom is no faith.
21 They have moved me to jealousy with that which is not God; they have provoked me to anger with their vanities: and I will move them to jealousy with those which are not a people; I will provoke them to anger with a foolish nation.
22 For a fire is kindled in mine anger, and shall burn unto the lowest hell, and shall consume the earth with her increase, and set on fire the foundations of the mountains.1
23 I will heap mischiefs upon them; I will spend mine arrows upon them.
24 They shall be burnt with hunger, and devoured with burning heat, and with bitter destruction: I will also send the teeth of beasts upon them, with the poison of serpents of the dust.1
25 The sword without, and terror within, shall destroy both the young man and the virgin, the suckling also with the man of gray hairs.1 (Deut. 32:18-25 KJV)
Paul quotes from this passage and applies it to his time so we know that's the time period. Notice verse 22. God says a fire is kindled in His anger and it will burn to the lowest Hades. This passage is about judgment in Christ's day. We know that that judgment came in A.D. 70. What we see here is that God's anger is the fire that burns in Hades. The Rich Man, the priesthood, is suffering God's anger in this parable. We have another prophesy of this same event. I'll post a few passages for the sake of space. It's best to read all of Isaiah 28 and 29 to get the full gist of this judgment.
Woe to the crown of pride, to the drunkards of Ephraim, whose glorious beauty is a fading flower, which are on the head of the fat valleys of them that are overcome with wine!1
2 Behold, the Lord hath a mighty and strong one, which as a tempest of hail and a destroying storm, as a flood of mighty waters overflowing, shall cast down to the earth with the hand.
3 The crown of pride, the drunkards of Ephraim, shall be trodden under feet:1 (Isa. 28:1-3 KJV)

14 Wherefore hear the word of the LORD, ye scornful men, that rule this people which is in Jerusalem.
15 Because ye have said, We have made a covenant with death, and with hell are we at agreement; when the overflowing scourge shall pass through, it shall not come unto us: for we have made lies our refuge, and under falsehood have we hid ourselves: (Isa. 28:14-15 KJV)
God says Israel will be trodden underfoot. In verse 14 we see that God is addressing the leadership of Israel. However, notice what Israel has said, they had made a covenant with death and are in agreement with Hades. This is their agreement with Rome. He goes on,
Woe to Ariel, to Ariel, the city where David dwelt! add ye year to year; let them kill sacrifices.1
2 Yet I will distress Ariel, and there shall be heaviness and sorrow: and it shall be unto me as Ariel.
3 And I will camp against thee round about, and will lay siege against thee with a mount, and I will raise forts against thee.
4 And thou shalt be brought down, and shalt speak out of the ground, and thy speech shall be low out of the dust, and thy voice shall be, as of one that hath a familiar spirit, out of the ground, and thy speech shall whisper out of the dust.1 (Isa. 29:1-4 KJV)
Notice here that God is going to lay siege against Ariel, Jerusalem. This is where the temple and the priesthood are. Remember, God said they were in a covenant with Hades. Hades is the grave. In verse 4 Gods says of the priesthood you shall be brought down, you shall speak out of the dust. The Rich Man who represents the priesthood was in Hades, the dust, speaking out of the ground. Notice also that God says their voice shall be one who has a familiar spirit. We can see this in the parable of Lazarus and the Rich Man.
I'm going to stop here as this post is getting long. There is a lot more I could say on this parable. I haven't even touched on Psalm 50 or the book of Malachi which also are mentioned in this parable. The point is that in this parable Jesus is weaving together several Old Testament prophesies that speak of the coming judgement of Israel. These priests who knew the Scriptures well should have seen this.

Here is another.

The parable of Lazarus and the Rich Man is also a judgment of the priesthood and their destruction. Who was Jesus talking to? The Pharisees. The Rich Man was a Jew. The priesthood was Jewish. The Rich Man had five brothers. Levi, the tribe of the priesthood, had five brothers. The Rich Man was dressed in purple and fine linen. The priesthood ruled over Israel as both king and priest and wore purple and fine linen. The Rich Man fared sumptuously. The priesthood fared sumptuously.

What about Lazarus? Lazarus is the Greek form of the Hebrew name Eleazar which means, God help. God helped Jesus. Lazarus had come to the Rich Man, a Jew. Jesus had come to the Jews. Lazarus was covered in sores. At the cross Jesus was covered in sores. The dogs licked Lazarus' sores. Lazarus was rejected by the Rich Man but accepted by the dogs. The Jews referred to the Gentiles as dogs. Jesus was rejected by the Jews but accepted by the Gentiles. Lazarus was carried away by angels. Jesus was carried away by angles. Lazarus was carried to his father Abraham. Jesus was carried to His father God. Lazarus was embraced by Abraham. Jesus was embraced by God. Lazarus was in Abraham's bosom. Is Abraham's bosom a place located down in the earth? There is nothing in Scripture to suggest any such thing. Abraham's bosom is mentioned elsewhere in Scripture though. Hagar was in Abraham's bosom, and she was alive, not dead.

And Sarai said unto Abram, My wrong be upon thee: I have given my maid into thy bosom; and when she saw that she had conceived, I was despised in her eyes: the LORD judge between me and thee. (Gen. 16:5 KJV)

Hagar was in an intimate relationship with Abram. From this we see that being in Abraham's bosom means to be in a close relationship with Abraham. Lazarus was in the bosom of his father. Jesus was in the bosom of His father.

No man hath seen God at any time; the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him. (Jn. 1:18 KJV)

The Rich Man wanted Abraham to send Lazarus to his brothers, that they would believe if one came from the dead. Abraham said no. He wouldn't send Lazarus back to the Jews. When Jesus resurrected He wouldn't show Himself to the Jews.
 
It's interesting that you tell other how they are prideful claiming to know the Scriptures, yet you tell us that "Souls" will be tormented in hell. Do you think you're the only one who ever prayed for God to teach them? It's funny how those who disagree with you are "know it all" Christians. Firstly, no one is talking about understanding God. We are talking about understanding God's word to man. If God is going to write to man it's only common sense to think that man would be able to understand what is written to him. It doesn't really make sense for God to write something to man that only God can understand, does it? We can understand what God has given us if we use the proper methods. We've got two thousand years of baggage to sort through to find out what was original. Christians have been putting their spin on Scripture for about two thousand years.
I think I used the personal "pronoun" "we" and everything i said is only what the scriptures has said, and I put it in "Layman" terms, so the common man can understand unto "salvation" and to the "Real Child of The Living GOD" for edification and the unregenerated has no idea the coded language is portraying but both ways it is so simple that a grade school child both fleshly and "heavenly" can understand it on their level. And the other ones that cannot understand it, because it was not meant for them to understand it. For the Bible confirms this Truth. And I will not go any deeper because you will be more offended in The Simplicity of Christ. The more i confirm, the more you will holler "Crucify him", "Crucify him" and give us "Barabbas" in "Stealth" form. For my enemy is not in Flesh form, But yours might be. But my enemy, is invisible to the naked eye, And his deception is "Perfect". And God my Father Planted Him Here for "Our" benefit, That a certain "we" maybe "Glorify" through out "Eternity" For my Words is never targeting The human being, But they are skilled, Sharpen, and trained By GOD "our" Father and not theirs, When the WORD of GOD says, "We" that we are a special group, when it says "us" it is a special "us", when it says "all" it is special "ALL" and that promise is a promise HE gave to HIS SON, There is a group you are going to"Redeem" them, for they will be your "brethren" for they will be just like you.

And Jesus The Son of GOD said, the maker of all Heaven, EARTH, stars, Moon, Seas, Oceans, Dogs, Fish, Sun, The Air, ANGELS, ALL ANGELS, and All the Creatures in Heaven, one of those angels name was "The Adversary" The perfect Deceiver.

And Jesus said, to "us" not to "all".
New American Standard Bible
Truly, truly I say to you, the one who believes in Me, the works that I do, he will do also; and greater works than these he will do; because I am going to the Father.

These words are foreign to the unskilled unregenerated and strange to the "Babe" in Christ. For they have not yet come to the age. Because of the unhealthy food that does not "Nourish" the "SOUL" but only feeds and make strong the "Sensual" and their "Biblical" conversation is nothing but words of The Religious fleshly appetite, and they have grown fat and over weight in their "Religious apathy" and they do not know the difference. And why is this has come to pass?

New King James Version
As for My people, children are their oppressors, And women rule over them. O My people! Those who lead you cause you to err, And destroy the way of your paths.”

And why did this happen and come to pass?
GOD said:
“I will give children to be their princes,
And babes shall rule over them.
The people will be oppressed,
Every one by another and every one by his neighbor;
The child will be insolent toward the elder,
And the base toward the honorable.”

And there is more to come, written in The BOOK that many cannot see neither they have the "Ability" to do so, because GOD the Father has blinded their eyes in seeing they see but do not understand. For the word of God has "proclaim" this TRUTH through the unveiling of "Jesus Christ" "our" LORD not their lord, "OURS".

Not my words, HIS WORD has Proclaim this TRUTH. A "Unknown Tongue" to many and only know by few.:pensive:

For He let His SUN shine on the wicked and Those who are "Justified in Christ". His "benevolent love' rains on all even the Beast in the field.

PS. A person can study the Bible all they want that does not mean anything, If it is in flesh and they are fleshly people and have not Been "Born of GOD", citizens Of The "HEAVENLY Kingdom" A Different kind of "Creature" meaning Not a earthly Creature, which Died before He Became a Brand new Creature. Just like a seed who have to die, before it becomes a plant. So that creature that was Born of His Mother died but the outside flesh which is a shell, the body. But that creature that now occupy's in that shell the Body is different than that creature that was in His Mother's womb. [how GOD does That, HE is GOD]

Sound like i am Talking to "Nicodemus". you must die 1st. and be "Born From ABOVE" this term is not a "Metaphor", This is Real. You are not the same creature, You died a real death. the problem is "we" are still in The BODY OF DEATH. TRAP, AND "We"ARE longing to be release. These biblical words means nothing to many, neither can they understand. that is why, other religious people always talk only about religious activities and social events, and programs and how to make the world better, and what we should do to make things better, because worldly creatures think worldly, in "Religious ways"

And this is where they abode, and it is impossible for them to dwell else where. And "we" must live with them and It is "impossible" for "us" to have Fellowship with them for "we" have nothing in common with them. even if we go to the same church, sing in the same choir, go to the same Bible classes, read out of the same Bible, and even pray with them, "We" have nothing in common with them. So says the "WORD of GOD". You have to be one of The "mature" Sons of GOD" to receive this Truth without any doubt. Solid Food is only for the Strong in Christ. that cannot be debated in Mind or strength. Nor toss about every wind and Doctrine. And the WORD of GOD dwells in "us" RICHLY. for the whole Word of GOD dwells in "our" SOUL! And not on the Pages of a BOOK but have been transferred in to your very SOUL written on the tables of Your Being. No compromise, No Quile, No deception, speak The Truth to his Brethern, Know The Truth, Live in The Truth. Walk in it.

New American Standard Bible (1 John 2:)
3And hereby we know that we know him, if we keep his commandments. 4He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him; 5but whoso keepeth his word, in him verily hath the love of God been perfected. Hereby we know that we are in him: 6he that saith he abideth in him ought himself also to walk even as he walked.

[and when you walked the walk the Whole world will hate you just like the world hated him]

This is how we know that we are in Christ and matured. And not fakes. And the PlumLine is in HIS hands and not ours.:pensive: And if "we" have not read the whole Book and it dwells in us "Richly" it is Impossible for "Us" to know Him and who HE is. We might know the "Spirit" of GOD and still not Know The unveiling of The SON as LORD, and The Manifestation Of The FATHER. And The "Glorification of The Glory that is to come that is revealed in The SON of The LIVING GOD and proclaim In The "Glorification Language" taught to us by GOD "our" Father and not theirs but Our's. For we are the Precious Ones. and The World and The Religious rulers and The governments do no Know us, Neither can They, for we are Creatures who are Hidden In Christ. and yet to be revealed.


My True brothers and sisters in Christ, You are Different than the others, and do not let them deceive you, for you are in the care of The FATHER, and not the care of mortal men.

Read all of John 17 (KJV)Oxford, if possible pray-fully, and always confess your sins before you read the "Word of GOD" with "repentance' before you engage the WORD of GOD. ALWAYS! "Confess and Repent" Turn from your wicked ways, then pray before you approach "GOD's WORD." That you may enter The "Holies of Holies":pensive: And ask GOD to stamp His Word on to The memory Banks of Your mind. I guarantee He will honor your prayer, without you trying to remember HIS WORD in your flesh, like the world remember such things. You are different! the written word is LIVING it comes Alive from the pages of the BOOK! GOD is different than the people of the world and all of their methods is not like HIS.

Prayer for all Believers
(Jesus Prayed) John 17...read all of John 17. (KJV) the prayer that Jesus prayed for "us." and not for them. and that "all" means "us" and not them. All of us.

20Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word; 21That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.

22And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one: 23I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me. 24Father, I will that they also, whom thou hast given me, be with me where I am; that they may behold my glory, which thou hast given me: for thou lovedst me before the foundation of the world.

25O righteous Father, the world hath not known thee: but I have known thee, and these have known that thou hast sent me. 26And I have declared unto them thy name, and will declare it: that the love wherewith thou hast loved me may be in them, and I in them.

This is The Coming, that all generations and ALL will Find out who we are and The Glorification that we will "MANIFEST" TO ALL "CREATION" BOTH THE LIVING AND the dead and all that exits in Heaven. will be "Mesmerize" of Our appearance and who we are.:pensive: Even the least of us.
 
I would submit that the parable of Lazarus and the Rich Man is not about the afterlife at all

hey Butch

I find that hard to understand,

when the story starts out as they both dying

22 “The time came when the beggar died and the angels carried him to Abraham’s side. The rich man also died and was buried.

and then at the end of the story it talks about the after life

31 “He said to him, ‘If they do not listen to Moses and the Prophets, they will not be convinced even if someone rises from the dead.’


it seems to me that those two versus make it clear that Jesus was speaking of the afterlife.

I think if you asked 10 people to read this parable (that are not familiar with it) and ask them what it is talking about, that they would all say the afterlife, to me its that straightforward.
 
hey Butch

I find that hard to understand,

when the story starts out as they both dying

22 “The time came when the beggar died and the angels carried him to Abraham’s side. The rich man also died and was buried.

and then at the end of the story it talks about the after life

31 “He said to him, ‘If they do not listen to Moses and the Prophets, they will not be convinced even if someone rises from the dead.’

it seems to me that those two versus make it clear that Jesus was speaking of the afterlife.

I think if you asked 10 people to read this parable (that are not familiar with it) and ask them what it is talking about, that they would all say the afterlife, to me its that straightforward.
Hi Dave,

Let me ask you a question. If those 10 didn't believe in an after life, do you still think it would be straight forward? Remember, the Sadducees didn't believe in any kind of afterlife and the Pharisees only believed in the Resurrection. They didn't believe that man was a disembodied consciousness. So, how would they understand the parable? I think it's obvious they wouldn't take it literally. This is where the historical context comes into play. We have to take into account the beliefs of those being spoken to. Jesus spoke the parable to the Scribe s and Pharisees.
 
I think I used the personal "pronoun" "we" and everything i said is only what the scriptures has said, and I put it in "Layman" terms, so the common man can understand unto "salvation" and to the "Real Child of The Living GOD" for edification and the unregenerated has no idea the coded language is portraying but both ways it is so simple that a grade school child both fleshly and "heavenly" can understand it on their level. And the other ones that cannot understand it, because it was not meant for them to understand it. For the Bible confirms this Truth. And I will not go any deeper because you will be more offended in The Simplicity of Christ. The more i confirm, the more you will holler "Crucify him", "Crucify him" and give us "Barabbas" in "Stealth" form. For my enemy is not in Flesh form, But yours might be. But my enemy, is invisible to the naked eye, And his deception is "Perfect". And God my Father Planted Him Here for "Our" benefit, That a certain "we" maybe "Glorify" through out "Eternity" For my Words is never targeting The human being, But they are skilled, Sharpen, and trained By GOD "our" Father and not theirs, When the WORD of GOD says, "We" that we are a special group, when it says "us" it is a special "us", when it says "all" it is special "ALL" and that promise is a promise HE gave to HIS SON, There is a group you are going to"Redeem" them, for they will be your "brethren" for they will be just like you.

And Jesus The Son of GOD said, the maker of all Heaven, EARTH, stars, Moon, Seas, Oceans, Dogs, Fish, Sun, The Air, ANGELS, ALL ANGELS, and All the Creatures in Heaven, one of those angels name was "The Adversary" The perfect Deceiver.

And Jesus said, to "us" not to "all".
New American Standard Bible
Truly, truly I say to you, the one who believes in Me, the works that I do, he will do also; and greater works than these he will do; because I am going to the Father.

These words are foreign to the unskilled unregenerated and strange to the "Babe" in Christ. For they have not yet come to the age. Because of the unhealthy food that does not "Nourish" the "SOUL" but only feeds and make strong the "Sensual" and their "Biblical" conversation is nothing but words of The Religious fleshly appetite, and they have grown fat and over weight in their "Religious apathy" and they do not know the difference. And why is this has come to pass?

New King James Version
As for My people, children are their oppressors, And women rule over them. O My people! Those who lead you cause you to err, And destroy the way of your paths.”

And why did this happen and come to pass?
GOD said:
“I will give children to be their princes,
And babes shall rule over them.
The people will be oppressed,
Every one by another and every one by his neighbor;
The child will be insolent toward the elder,
And the base toward the honorable.”

And there is more to come, written in The BOOK that many cannot see neither they have the "Ability" to do so, because GOD the Father has blinded their eyes in seeing they see but do not understand. For the word of God has "proclaim" this TRUTH through the unveiling of "Jesus Christ" "our" LORD not their lord, "OURS".

Not my words, HIS WORD has Proclaim this TRUTH. A "Unknown Tongue" to many and only know by few.:pensive:

For He let His SUN shine on the wicked and Those who are "Justified in Christ". His "benevolent love' rains on all even the Beast in the field.

PS. A person can study the Bible all they want that does not mean anything, If it is in flesh and they are fleshly people and have not Been "Born of GOD", citizens Of The "HEAVENLY Kingdom" A Different kind of "Creature" meaning Not a earthly Creature, which Died before He Became a Brand new Creature. Just like a seed who have to die, before it becomes a plant. So that creature that was Born of His Mother died but the outside flesh which is a shell, the body. But that creature that now occupy's in that shell the Body is different than that creature that was in His Mother's womb. [how GOD does That, HE is GOD]

Sound like i am Talking to "Nicodemus". you must die 1st. and be "Born From ABOVE" this term is not a "Metaphor", This is Real. You are not the same creature, You died a real death. the problem is "we" are still in The BODY OF DEATH. TRAP, AND "We"ARE longing to be release. These biblical words means nothing to many, neither can they understand. that is why, other religious people always talk only about religious activities and social events, and programs and how to make the world better, and what we should do to make things better, because worldly creatures think worldly, in "Religious ways"

And this is where they abode, and it is impossible for them to dwell else where. And "we" must live with them and It is "impossible" for "us" to have Fellowship with them for "we" have nothing in common with them. even if we go to the same church, sing in the same choir, go to the same Bible classes, read out of the same Bible, and even pray with them, "We" have nothing in common with them. So says the "WORD of GOD". You have to be one of The "mature" Sons of GOD" to receive this Truth without any doubt. Solid Food is only for the Strong in Christ. that cannot be debated in Mind or strength. Nor toss about every wind and Doctrine. And the WORD of GOD dwells in "us" RICHLY. for the whole Word of GOD dwells in "our" SOUL! And not on the Pages of a BOOK but have been transferred in to your very SOUL written on the tables of Your Being. No compromise, No Quile, No deception, speak The Truth to his Brethern, Know The Truth, Live in The Truth. Walk in it.

New American Standard Bible (1 John 2:)
3And hereby we know that we know him, if we keep his commandments. 4He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him; 5but whoso keepeth his word, in him verily hath the love of God been perfected. Hereby we know that we are in him: 6he that saith he abideth in him ought himself also to walk even as he walked.

[and when you walked the walk the Whole world will hate you just like the world hated him]

This is how we know that we are in Christ and matured. And not fakes. And the PlumLine is in HIS hands and not ours.:pensive: And if "we" have not read the whole Book and it dwells in us "Richly" it is Impossible for "Us" to know Him and who HE is. We might know the "Spirit" of GOD and still not Know The unveiling of The SON as LORD, and The Manifestation Of The FATHER. And The "Glorification of The Glory that is to come that is revealed in The SON of The LIVING GOD and proclaim In The "Glorification Language" taught to us by GOD "our" Father and not theirs but Our's. For we are the Precious Ones. and The World and The Religious rulers and The governments do no Know us, Neither can They, for we are Creatures who are Hidden In Christ. and yet to be revealed.


My True brothers and sisters in Christ, You are Different than the others, and do not let them deceive you, for you are in the care of The FATHER, and not the care of mortal men.

Read all of John 17 (KJV)Oxford, if possible pray-fully, and always confess your sins before you read the "Word of GOD" with "repentance' before you engage the WORD of GOD. ALWAYS! "Confess and Repent" Turn from your wicked ways, then pray before you approach "GOD's WORD." That you may enter The "Holies of Holies":pensive: And ask GOD to stamp His Word on to The memory Banks of Your mind. I guarantee He will honor your prayer, without you trying to remember HIS WORD in your flesh, like the world remember such things. You are different! the written word is LIVING it comes Alive from the pages of the BOOK! GOD is different than the people of the world and all of their methods is not like HIS.

Prayer for all Believers
(Jesus Prayed) John 17...read all of John 17. (KJV) the prayer that Jesus prayed for "us." and not for them. and that "all" means "us" and not them. All of us.

20Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word; 21That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.

22And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one: 23I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me. 24Father, I will that they also, whom thou hast given me, be with me where I am; that they may behold my glory, which thou hast given me: for thou lovedst me before the foundation of the world.

25O righteous Father, the world hath not known thee: but I have known thee, and these have known that thou hast sent me. 26And I have declared unto them thy name, and will declare it: that the love wherewith thou hast loved me may be in them, and I in them.

This is The Coming, that all generations and ALL will Find out who we are and The Glorification that we will "MANIFEST" TO ALL "CREATION" BOTH THE LIVING AND the dead and all that exits in Heaven. will be "Mesmerize" of Our appearance and who we are.:pensive: Even the least of us.

I wasn't offended by what you said. I just thought it was funny that you were talking about "Know it all Christians" and then proceeded to tell us what the Scriptures say. You said you just took Scripture and gave it in laymen's terms. Honestly, I find it extremely hard to follow your posts. In my opinion, you're not putting it in laymen's terms. I could be wrong, but it seems to me that you use a lot of flowery language. You said,

"A person can study the Bible all they want that does not mean anything, If it is in flesh and they are fleshly people and have not Been "Born of GOD", citizens Of The "HEAVENLY Kingdom" A Different kind of "Creature" meaning Not a earthly Creature, which Died before He Became a Brand new Creature. Just like a seed who have to die, before it becomes a plant. So that creature that was Born of His Mother died but the outside flesh which is a shell, the body. But that creature that now occupy's in that shell the Body is different than that creature that was in His Mother's womb."

If a person studies the Bible and comes away with beliefs that the Bible doesn't teach, does that mean they are fleshly or are they genuinely born again, but simply misunderstand?
 
You said you just took Scripture and gave it in laymen's terms. Honestly, I find it extremely hard to follow your posts. In my opinion, you're not putting it in laymen's terms. I could be wrong, but it seems to me that you use a lot of flowery language.

You beat me to it. I was just about to write the same thing.
 
I wasn't offended by what you said. I just thought it was funny that you were talking about "Know it all Christians" and then proceeded to tell us what the Scriptures say. You said you just took Scripture and gave it in laymen's terms. Honestly, I find it extremely hard to follow your posts. In my opinion, you're not putting it in laymen's terms. I could be wrong, but it seems to me that you use a lot of flowery language. You said,

"A person can study the Bible all they want that does not mean anything, If it is in flesh and they are fleshly people and have not Been "Born of GOD", citizens Of The "HEAVENLY Kingdom" A Different kind of "Creature" meaning Not a earthly Creature, which Died before He Became a Brand new Creature. Just like a seed who have to die, before it becomes a plant. So that creature that was Born of His Mother died but the outside flesh which is a shell, the body. But that creature that now occupy's in that shell the Body is different than that creature that was in His Mother's womb."

If a person studies the Bible and comes away with beliefs that the Bible doesn't teach, does that mean they are fleshly or are they genuinely born again, but simply misunderstand?
I know i cannot explain all of these things to you, For it is impossible for me to even try too. I would only sound like a fool and a Barbarian to you. Becoming A foolish person that have no sense. For the Word of GOD teaches some of us this and not all. None of these words are mine, But these words is to my best ability to convey this Truth. Which is not The Language of this WORLD. I cannot make any sense to you. But if i talk of worldly things you can understand me plainly. baseball, institutional churches, bible classes, pastors, ministries, politics, raising children, Black lives matter, the educational systems, lightening, storms, Hunger, deaths, covid-19, Vaccines, LBGTQ's communities, and those things that are worldly will make plenty of sense even if we disagree with one another. But those things which is in The heavenly heights we have no fellowship for it is impossible to do so ,because GOD has So "Ordain" for it to be. And not by my choice. But By The Decree of "The ALMIGHTY GOD". And i am nothing as if i was a worm concerning HIS Degrees. :pensive: He is The Potter and i am nothing as if a piece of Clay being molded in his hand not for the things of this world, Which will pass away and not exist or remembered any more.

For as me, "I do not have a "freewill" like many do. I been bought Purchase out of the "bondages of SIN" a mere slave unto unrighteousness, Purchase By His Blood into Another "Slavery" making HIM my LORD and MASTER. into another "bondage" until "That Coronation DAY" when many will receive "full SonShip"
And "GLORIFIED" A "Glorification" that will be manifested Throughout All "ETERNITY" that has no end. shining more than the moment before . Brightest as shinning brighter than The SUN, All of the Stars. Forever and ever and never grow dim. But will "MESMERIZE" WHAT EVER COMES TO BE THROUGHOUT "ETERNITY".
I care nothing about baseball, i do not care about politics or politicians, basketball i have no interest, schools i have no interest, teachers i have no interest, vaccine i have no interest, Institutional Churches i have no interest. But my brothers and sisters who are in Christ and not by name but position. who have Been "Born of the Heavenly Birth" and not by words of confessions. And I lone for many, that "Jesus Christ" would return quickly and deliver them from their pains and suffering from the enemy, and I know HE is the only one that can relieve their pains and HE promise He would return to do this. His return is "The Promise" That was spoken of in the Book Genesis and have not come to pass.

So yes i am different, my desires are different, my heart is different, My longing is different, So my language is different. even the whole world when he walk the EARTH, the people did not understand HIS LANGUAGE, neither did they understood the words spoke. They did not understand this LOVE He spoke of, For this was not like The Love they knew. And they no longer walk with him. "what strange language He speaks" "for no man has ever spoke like him" and They Crucified Him, because of the Words HE spoke. And the sermons he proclaim.

I used to speak your language up to the age of 26. we would have had many words in common. I know your language, i been there, i know the religious of this World, I know christian worldly terminology. I been there and done that i know those who speaks the language of the religious World. I engage with them everyday. From the time i was Child. And the numbers is among the Billions. And every now and then you may meet a "Pilgrim" a wayward traveler. Heading for "The Celestial City":pensive:

Whoever GOD wants to come to Him will come. The choice is GOD not a man. God is "Supreme" but many wants the "SUPREMACY" that only GOD has. and no one has the power to take it from his hands. and the whole world is going to bow to this TRUTH! He is the one who saves some and not all, And it is by GRACE and a man has nothing to do with his salvation. And every Knee is going to bow to that TRUTH. That you had nothing to do with your salvation.
All will BOW to that TRUTH. Every KNEE. Remember I told you.

So let us not argue about it now, But when that day comes, it is going to be known who proclaim lies and who proclaim Truth! This is the Day of Judgment and not the day of Grace and mercy. So let us examine ourselves. whether or not we speak Truth instead of what our wicked hearts feel. And we know our hearts are wicked because the old testament and the new has proclaim this. Our hearts are Flesh. And all wickedness flows from it. And we do not have to look this up, we know it is the TRUTH for The very Written "WORD OF GOD" Is written upon our SOUL that New SPIRIT "Born of GOD" written on the Tables of Our Being. that cannot be taken away and always will be with us throughout "Eternity".
 
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