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I don't believe a loving God would send people to hell.....

Shame on me sometimes mixing it up can be fun,, Alas @Br. Bear you are correct :)

watching you....


seriously, though, we can get unstuck if we allow things coming in to stir and take hold of the old self, and then get spitting foul out.
Those things that enter do not defile. We have a filter, let us use it...

bless them that curse you... and yet we can forget that we all need practice doing that.

So, even though other's may not realise, they have been a blessing to us, if we are able to bear the fruit that is fit for the King's Table.

I think the Apostle Paul wrote something about rejoicing in trials or tribulations... and so we should. They are opportunities for the Lord to be glorified in those who love Him.

So i encourage you (and all others) to keep the faith, which is more precious than gold that perishes. We do so here by doing as we have been instructed by the Prince of Peace... grace reciprocated and mercy too.


Bless you Sister ....><>
 
you know I have been reading this thread and watching it fairly close, and have thought to myself how impressed I was with the majority of the posters have such a good discussion, even though they had different views on scripture. Sad to say we do not see this much. so I applaud @Butch5 @B-A-C @Jesus_is_LORD for the way they conduct themselves. We can all learn from these mature christian on how to post with respect and love and patience especaily when we do not agree !!
 
you know I have been reading this thread and watching it fairly close, and have thought to myself how impressed I was with the majority of the posters have such a good discussion, even though they had different views on scripture. Sad to say we do not see this much. so I applaud @Butch5 @B-A-C @Jesus_is_LORD for the way they conduct themselves. We can all learn from these mature christian on how to post.
Thanks @Dave M
 
you know I have been reading this thread and watching it fairly close, and have thought to myself how impressed I was with the majority of the posters have such a good discussion, even though they had different views on scripture. Sad to say we do not see this much. so I applaud @Butch5 @B-A-C @Jesus_is_LORD for the way they conduct themselves. We can all learn from these mature christian on how to post with respect and love and patience especaily when we do not agree !!
Much thanks brother, glad that the Lord is using me as His servant.
 
Speaking of 1st Corinthians 15:50


50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.

51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,

52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.

54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

55 O death, where is thy sting? O grave, where is thy victory?

56 The sting of death is sin; and the strength of sin is the law.

Hi JIL,

He doesn't actually say, they are putting on immortal bodies. Earlier I mentioned in the post to @B-A-C about Paul talking in abstract concepts. I believe this is one of those times. I don't think Paul is talking about bodies here, but rather, a state of being. Our current state is corruption or decaying or perishing. The future state of believers will be that of incorruption or not decaying. I don't really think corruption is the best translation. I think decay is better as we see the two states contrasted here, the current state of decaying and a future state of not decaying. But, I would note verse 52. Paul says "we shall be changed". That seems to indicate to me that it is his current body that will be changed. The Greek word that is translated resurrection, literally means, to stand again. Prior to this Paul contrasted this with a spiritual body.

42 So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption:
43 It is sown in dishonour; it is raised in glory: it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power:
44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body. (1 Cor. 15:42-44 KJV)

We see the contrast of our current state and that of the future state. I think a lot people see the words spiritual body and think of a different body. However, the word spiritual is an adjective. It simply gives the qualities of the noun it is modifying, in this case body. I submit that it's not a different body, but rather, the present body which then has qualities of the spirit. This would line up with resurrection because the same body would, stand again.
 
Hi JIL,

He doesn't actually say, they are putting on immortal bodies. Earlier I mentioned in the post to @B-A-C about Paul talking in abstract concepts. I believe this is one of those times. I don't think Paul is talking about bodies here, but rather, a state of being. Our current state is corruption or decaying or perishing. The future state of believers will be that of incorruption or not decaying. I don't really think corruption is the best translation. I think decay is better as we see the two states contrasted here, the current state of decaying and a future state of not decaying. But, I would note verse 52. Paul says "we shall be changed". That seems to indicate to me that it is his current body that will be changed. The Greek word that is translated resurrection, literally means, to stand again. Prior to this Paul contrasted this with a spiritual body.

42 So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption:
43 It is sown in dishonour; it is raised in glory: it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power:
44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body. (1 Cor. 15:42-44 KJV)

We see the contrast of our current state and that of the future state. I think a lot people see the words spiritual body and think of a different body. However, the word spiritual is an adjective. It simply gives the qualities of the noun it is modifying, in this case body. I submit that it's not a different body, but rather, the present body which then has qualities of the spirit. This would line up with resurrection because the same body would, stand again.

Even if it was the "same body" you are agreeing that it is in a new state, a state of perfection, correct?
 
Now we know that if the earthly tent we live in is dismantled, we have a building from God, an eternal house in heaven, not built by human hands. For in this tent we groan, longing to be clothed with our heavenly dwelling, because when we are clothed, we will not be found naked. So while we are in this tent, we groan under our burdens, because we do not wish to be unclothed but clothed, so that our mortality may be swallowed up by life. And God has prepared us for this very purpose and has given us the Spirit as a pledge of what is to come.

Therefore we are always confident, although we know that while we are at home in the body, we are away from the Lord. For we walk by faith, not by sight. We are confident, then, and would prefer to be away from the body and at home with the Lord. So we aspire to please Him, whether we are here in this body or away from it. For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, that each one may receive his due for the things done in the body, whether good or bad.

2Corinthians 5:1-10
 
Even if it was the "same body" you are agreeing that it is in a new state, a state of perfection, correct?
Hi JIL,

It is the same body, John said,

Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is. (1 Jn. 3:2 KJV)

We know when He was resurrected it was the same body. Jesus said to Thomas,

The other disciples therefore said unto him, We have seen the Lord. But he said unto them, Except I shall see in his hands the print of the nails, and put my finger into the print of the nails, and thrust my hand into his side, I will not believe.
26 And after eight days again his disciples were within, and Thomas with them: then came Jesus, the doors being shut, and stood in the midst, and said, Peace be unto you.
27 Then saith he to Thomas, Reach hither thy finger, and behold my hands; and reach hither thy hand, and thrust it into my side: and be not faithless, but believing. (Jn. 20:25-27 KJV)


Jesus had the nail holes and the hole in His side after He was resurrected. So, it was the same body.

I do agree that it is a different state. You asked about perfection. I don't want to go further than what the Bible says. John said, "it does not yet appear what we shall be".
 
Now we know that if the earthly tent we live in is dismantled, we have a building from God, an eternal house in heaven, not built by human hands. For in this tent we groan, longing to be clothed with our heavenly dwelling, because when we are clothed, we will not be found naked. So while we are in this tent, we groan under our burdens, because we do not wish to be unclothed but clothed, so that our mortality may be swallowed up by life. And God has prepared us for this very purpose and has given us the Spirit as a pledge of what is to come.

Therefore we are always confident, although we know that while we are at home in the body, we are away from the Lord. For we walk by faith, not by sight. We are confident, then, and would prefer to be away from the body and at home with the Lord. So we aspire to please Him, whether we are here in this body or away from it. For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, that each one may receive his due for the things done in the body, whether good or bad.

2Corinthians 5:1-10

It's funny, I was going to post this passage. This is a good example of Paul talking in concepts. He speaks of the present corrupt state of decay and the future state without decay.
 
It's funny, I was going to post this passage. This is a good example of Paul talking in concepts. He speaks of the present corrupt state of decay and the future state without decay.

I have to wonder here. Concepts of.. what? Current corrupt state of .. what? Future state without decay of ... what?
The word "body" is used 5 times in this passage. 1Cor 15
 
Hi JIL,

It is the same body, John said,

Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is. (1 Jn. 3:2 KJV)

We know when He was resurrected it was the same body. Jesus said to Thomas,

The other disciples therefore said unto him, We have seen the Lord. But he said unto them, Except I shall see in his hands the print of the nails, and put my finger into the print of the nails, and thrust my hand into his side, I will not believe.
26 And after eight days again his disciples were within, and Thomas with them: then came Jesus, the doors being shut, and stood in the midst, and said, Peace be unto you.
27 Then saith he to Thomas, Reach hither thy finger, and behold my hands; and reach hither thy hand, and thrust it into my side: and be not faithless, but believing. (Jn. 20:25-27 KJV)


Jesus had the nail holes and the hole in His side after He was resurrected. So, it was the same body.

I do agree that it is a different state. You asked about perfection. I don't want to go further than what the Bible says. John said, "it does not yet appear what we shall be".

Yes our bodies will be recognizable like they were able to recognize Jesus.
I await that day when we will be free from these bodies of sin.
 
I have to wonder here. Concepts of.. what? Current corrupt state of .. what? Future state without decay of ... what?
The word "body" is used 5 times in this passage. 1Cor 15
Hi B-A-C,

The thought actually is a continuation from chapter 4.

10 Always bearing about in the body the dying of the Lord Jesus, that the life also of Jesus might be made manifest in our body.
11 For we which live are alway delivered unto death for Jesus' sake, that the life also of Jesus might be made manifest in our mortal flesh.
12 So then death worketh in us, but life in you.
13 We having the same spirit of faith, according as it is written, I believed, and therefore have I spoken; we also believe, and therefore speak;
14 Knowing that he which raised up the Lord Jesus shall raise up us also by Jesus, and shall present us with you.
15 For all things are for your sakes, that the abundant grace might through the thanksgiving of many redound to the glory of God.
16 For which cause we faint not; but though our outward man perish, yet the inward man is renewed day by day.
17 For our light affliction, which is but for a moment, worketh for us a far more exceeding and eternal weight of glory;
18 While we look not at the things which are seen, but at the things which are not seen: for the things which are seen are temporal; but the things which are not seen are eternal. (2 Cor. 4:10-18 KJV)

Paul contrasts that which is temporal with that which is eternal. Notice the context is the resurrection. This is the though going into chapter 5.

For we know that if our earthly house of this tabernacle were dissolved, we have a building of God, an house not made with hands, eternal in the heavens.
2 For in this we groan, earnestly desiring to be clothed upon with our house which is from heaven:
3 If so be that being clothed we shall not be found naked.
4 For we that are in this tabernacle do groan, being burdened: not for that we would be unclothed, but clothed upon, that mortality might be swallowed up of life.
5 Now he that hath wrought us for the selfsame thing is God, who also hath given unto us the earnest of the Spirit.
6 Therefore we are always confident, knowing that, whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the Lord:
7 (For we walk by faith, not by sight)
8 We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.
9 Wherefore we labour, that, whether present or absent, we may be accepted of him.
10 For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad. (2 Cor. 5:1-10 KJV)

You pointed out that the word body appears five times in this section. What's interesting though is that where we would expect the word "body" we don't find it. We would expect to find the word body in verses one and two. The earthly house of this tabernacle, many believe this to be the body, yet Paul doesn't used the word body. Also, the house made without hands, many consider this the body. It's interesting though that Paul doesn't use the word body for either of these. I believe that's because he's not talking about the body, but rather, our state of being. If we follow on with his argument we see he says we long earnestly to be clothed with the house from Heaven. We groan or long in our present state for that which is to come, the resurrection or resurrected state. Verse three is very important. He speaks of being clothed so as not to be found naked. This statement actually argues against the typical understanding of the passage. Many use this passage to say that people are alive after death. That was what the Greeks believed. Here Paul is arguing that he doesn't want to be found that way. Being clothed is a metaphor for the body. Paul is saying he doesn't want to be found without a body. He's refuting the Greek idea of a disembodied consciousness. Corinth was right next to Athens which was the center of Greek thought. The Greeks rejected the idea of Resurrection because they held to Plato's doctrine of the immortal soul. The goal for the Greek was to escape the body and ascend through the heavens to the fulness or ultimate god. They saw the body as a prison for the soul. So, for them, the idea of resurrection, being back in the body, was anathema. That's why when Paul started speaking to the Greeks in Athens about the Resurrection they mocked him.

And when they heard of the resurrection of the dead, some mocked: and others said, We will hear thee again of this matter. (Acts 17:32 KJV)

He continues in verse 4 talking about being burdened. He says not that we would be unclothed, but clothed upon. Again, clothed is a metaphor for the body. The Greek word that is translated clothed upon, literally means to put on over. It would be like putting on a coat over top of one's clothes. So, Paul is saying, unlike the Greeks, he doesn't want to be unclothed (without a body), he want's to be clothed upon. In other words he doesn't want to be without a body, he wants the future state to swallow up his present state. Look at the last part of the verse, "that mortality might be swallowed up of life". Notice those two concepts again, present state, mortality or that of decay vs. life or eternal life without decay.

Then in verse 6, after all that he said about these two states, he mentions the body. But again, Paul speaks in metaphors, what is the body a metaphor for? Throughout Paul's writings he speaks of the body of Christ. In verse 6 he said,

6 Therefore we are always confident, knowing that, whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the Lord:

Here Paul speaks of being at home in the body and absent from the Lord. This is a verse commonly used to claim that when people die they immediately go to be with the Lord. However, let's look at the Greek words here and see if the translators aren't nudging us is certain theological direction. I bolded the words home and absent. The Greek word translated home is "enemeo" . Here is the definition of that word.

endemeo {en-day-meh'-o}
Meaning: 1) to be among one's own people, dwell in one's own country, stay at home

The idea is to be among one's own people. The word translated absent, is "ekdemeo" "ek" means to come out of. So, it means to come out of one's own people.

ekdemeo {ek-day-meh'-o}
Meaning: 1) to go abroad 2) emigrate, depart 3) to be or live abroad.

So, the meaning of both words has to do with one's people. Who were Paul's people? The body of Christ. So, verse 6 can be read, while we are dwelling among our own people in the body (of Christ) we are abroad from or not dwelling with Christ. Both words have to do with one's people thus this suggests that the body here isn't the flesh body but rather the body of Christ, the church. While Paul is here with his people he is not with Christ.

Then in verse 9 where Paul talks about laboring so that whether present of absent we are found acceptable, The word present is the same word that is translated home in verse 6. Then in verse 10 he talks about appearing before the judgment seat to receive the things done in the body. Here body could mean either though I believe he means one receives for what they've done in the church, the body of Christ.

This is a brief overview. There is more nuance in the passage but the post would get really long.
 
We must remember, Put the Word of GOD in us , Let The Whole counsel of GOD Dwell in us, so when others speaks concerning The Word, it Primes The WORD that is in us and The WORD of GOD that is in us "Springs up out of us into ETERNAL LIFE and never dissipates.

You spoke it "Springs":
Our Earthly bodies are corrupted and decays and passes away, But what says The Holy Scriptures concerning The LORD's Fleshly body? This is a "Decree" and must come to pass.

But JESUS is a Different story.
(Acts 13)BSB
For when David had served God’s purpose in his own generation, he fell asleep. His body was buried with his fathers and saw decay. But the One whom God raised from the dead did not see decay."
Acts 2:27
because You will not abandon my soul to Hades, nor will You let Your Holy One see decay.

American Standard Version (Acts 13)
but he whom God raised up saw no corruption.
Aramaic Bible in Plain English(Acts 13)
But This One whom God raised did not see corruption.

Jesus Resurrected Body was not Glorified, It was resurrected and never saw decay or corruption. If it was "GLORIFIED" The Whole WORLD would had Been Destroyed, For The WORLD could not stand before The Manifestation of "THE GLORIFICATION of GOD" For the World would had to be Shield from His "GLORY". The Brightness of His Appearance.

Jesus Told her:
American Standard Version
Jesus saith to her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended unto the Father: but go unto my brethren, and say to them, I ascend unto my Father and your Father, and my God and your God.

His body never decayed, his body never saw corruption.
And these thoughts are "Beyond us":pensive: for the "Finite" Mind cannot comprehend "The Infinite". for it has Not The "ABILITY" to do so.

I like that.
 
If anyone thinks in human terms and terminology and do not think "Anthropomorphic" concerning the rims of GOD, If you think in earthy terms that arrives from the Brain, you never get there. because that boat cannot carry you there into the things of GOD.

Yes Religious people speaks concerning religion.

But there is something that the WORLD do no know that it exists:pensive: And no matter how hard we try to explain it, it cannot come to pass.

"We have not received the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, that we may understand what God has freely given us. And this is what we speak, not in words taught us by human wisdom, but in words taught by the Spirit, expressing spiritual truths in spiritual words. The natural man does not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God. For they are foolishness to him, and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually discerned.":pensive:

They can never know this Truth , and These WORDS we speak and read. Only GOD can make this happen.
 
Verse three is very important. He speaks of being clothed so as not to be found naked. This statement actually argues against the typical understanding of the passage. Many use this passage to say that people are alive after death. That was what the Greeks believed. Here Paul is arguing that he doesn't want to be found that way. Being clothed is a metaphor for the body. Paul is saying he doesn't want to be found without a body. He's refuting the Greek idea of a disembodied consciousness. Corinth was right next to Athens which was the center of Greek thought. The Greeks rejected the idea of Resurrection because they held to Plato's doctrine of the immortal soul. The goal for the Greek was to escape the body and ascend through the heavens to the fulness or ultimate god. They saw the body as a prison for the soul. So, for them, the idea of resurrection, being back in the body, was anathema

Greetings,

I have quoted some of Butch5's post because i wanted to point out that what is being presented DOES have roots in what was the reality back then in Corinth. [and other areas - most of the then known world]

Today we might hear a sermon that includes things that we relate to really well because 'everyone knows' about the place or people or custom being referred to. Back then, the Greek way of thinking and understanding was deeply influenced by what was the going 'religious' thought.
Perhaps research a bit on this subject. The Oracles of Delphi, for example, the influence of the Pythia (Plato was only one influenced by such), The Greek gods and mythology, what was acceptable and encouraged regarding gender and practices we frown upon, and yes, the state of the 'soul' and the 'dead' and the 'here-after'.

This was the stuff the early Church was up against, besides the Jews who refused Jesus as Messiah. There is actually a lot of reference to these "Greek ways' to be seen in the pages of the New Testament. To deliberately ignore that or to scoff at it because referrence to any of that does not line up with our traditional understanding of what we read (more usually, what we have learned) in the New Testament, does not help in understanding contexts and the importance of what is written in a lot of places in the New Testament.
We are familiar with using a little 'history' when we study about Old Testament things, so it is OK to use a little "history', to help study New Testament.
It actually helps a lot.

What Butch5 is presenting doesn't lessen the meaning of what is written but understanding a biy about thse things can help, to see something that really was and is a challenge to the world's thinking.

I am not endorsing any or all of anyone's submissions here, but wanting to help clear the path a bit so a better appreciation of what you are all discussing can be had.

As i said, do a little research. I don't expect anyone to suddenly 'convert' to a new way of reasoning but if you get honest about the historical context, you will also find it is safe and does in fact give a much broader outlook on what we as Christian have and still do contend with and why Christian have been untolerated so much. The same was true for the Prophets. They contested the ways and cultural 'norm' of their day and were killed because of it.

Think about it for a minute. The message, in places like Corinthians, isn't simply telling a story about what happens to Christian when they die. It is 'teaching' the converts and reminding them of the New Way in contrast to their old way. It is also a very bold statement against the way of the world back then. It is not until you learn a bit about it, that you really appreciate the impact that Christianity had on people and why it was said that they were turning the world upside down.

Thanks for reading.

Jesus is Lord


Bless you ....><>
 
As i said, do a little research. I don't expect anyone to suddenly 'convert' to a new way of reasoning but if you get honest about the historical context, you will also find it is safe and does in fact give a much broader outlook on what we as Christian have and still do contend with and why Christian have been untolerated so much. The same was true for the Prophets. They contested the ways and cultural 'norm' of their day and were killed because of it.

Think about it for a minute. The message, in places like Corinthians, isn't simply telling a story about what happens to Christian when they die. It is 'teaching' the converts and reminding them of the New Way in contrast to their old way. It is also a very bold statement against the way of the world back then. It is not until you learn a bit about it, that you really appreciate the impact that Christianity had on people and why it was said that they were turning the world upside down.

A few thoughts here.

1. Somehow this thread has drifted from God sending people to hell, to do people even exist after physical death, to what kind of body do they have.
I can see how this would be a natural progression in some cases.

2. I might even be willing to say the spirit can't exist without a body for the sake of argument. But even if this was true, we eventually get new bodies, so we don't cease to exist.
This is how the concept of soul sleep works, you are never "absent" from the body, you're just asleep in a dead (decaying) body. This is somewhat problematic if you take this too literally,
what about people disintegrated by an atomic bomb, or thrown into a volcano, or something where the body completely annihilated? Some argue that your body still exists even
then, it's now in the form of carbon/ash/plasma or whatever, but the molecules that made up your body are still around.
But if this is the case, you are eventually resurrected and given a new body on "the last day".

3. There is a prevailing thought in Christianity that when you die, your spirit immediately goes back to heaven.
A lot of this comes from 2Cor 5:6-10; This seems to say we will eventually be absent from the body (at the very least our current body)

4. If we get back to the core of @Butch5 theology. He believes in annihilation-ism. He apparently believes no one really goes to hell, at least not for very long because they will be annihilated.
This is how the thread started, - a loving God wouldn't send people to hell.
This sometimes bleeds over to his believes about the saints, (this seems to be a moving target, that changes from time to time) but often it seems he believes the saints will eventually be annihilated as well.
Although some posts seem to say he believes the saints may live forever. But if they do, they will have a body. For me personally, I'm less concerned about having a physical body than my spirit/consciousness
living eternally. If it's in a body great, if not, I'm OK with that too.

5. There are literally dozens of scriptures about the after life, the resurrection, the New Jerusalem, hades, the lake of fire, new bodies, our spirit, and where certain types of people eventually end up.
(Some people do end up in hell). So OK, maybe it's OK to understand where someone is coming from to a point, but eventually the Bible takes precedence, and we have to believe what it says.
Not just in one or two cherry picked verses, but the over-all theme of all the scripture pertaining to this subject.
 
Matt 8:28; When He came to the other side into the country of the Gadarenes, two men who were demon-possessed met Him as they were coming out of the tombs. They were so extremely violent that no one could pass by that way.
Matt 8:29; And they cried out, saying, “What business do we have with each other, Son of God? Have You come here to torment us before the time?”
Matt 8:30; Now there was a herd of many swine feeding at a distance from them.
Matt 8:31; The demons began to entreat Him, saying, “If You are going to cast us out, send us into the herd of swine.”
Matt 8:32; And He said to them, “Go!” And they came out and went into the swine, and the whole herd rushed down the steep bank into the sea and perished in the waters.

So what does this passage have to do with God sending people to hell? ... Very little! :)

But it does have to do with body-less spirits, the whole concept of demons for example... are spirits without a body.
They don't have their own bodies, so they inhabit other bodies. In this case two men. But it says here there were some pigs "at a distance".
How far is a distance? I don't know, but lets say 100 yards or so. How did the demons in these two men cover the distance to the pigs?
There are other similar scriptures, but the point is... apparently the were body-less for at least a second or two, or however long it
took for them to transfer to the new bodies. But even then, the pigs perished in the water. So either these demons inhabit a dead body,
or they leave that body and go look for something else. The point being, spirits don't have to have a body.

And what about Angels? Apparently some of them can materialize, and even physically touch people. ( Gen 19:10; ) but do they have physical bodies?
 
.
Yes our bodies will be recognizable like they were able to recognize Jesus.

Jesus' friends and associates were able to recognize him during the forty days
following his resurrection, but I wonder if they would've been able to tell it was him
after his ascension, transformation, and glorification.
_
 
but I wonder if they would've been able to tell it was him
after his ascension, transformation, and glorification.

Good question, but they did recognize Elijah and Moses.

Matt 17:3; And behold, Moses and Elijah appeared to them, talking with Him.
Matt 17:4; Peter said to Jesus, “Lord, it is good for us to be here; if You wish, I will make three tabernacles here, one for You, and one for Moses, and one for Elijah.”

Acts 1:11; They also said, “Men of Galilee, why do you stand looking into the sky? This Jesus, who has been taken up from you into heaven, will come in just the same way as you have watched Him go into heaven.”
Jesus had flesh and bones when He ascended, if He is returning the same way, wouldn't He still have flesh and bones?

Rev 1:7; Behold, He is coming with the clouds, and every eye will see Him, even those who pierced Him; and all the tribes of the earth will mourn over Him. So it is to be. Amen.

When Jesus returns, it seems everyone will see Him and know who He is.
 
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