Mid-tribulation

lecoop · Feb 13, 2012

rodd said:
All Israel saved? Have you not also read Romans 'but not all Israel are Israel'?
Only the true sons of Abraham are saved, of Jew and Gentile, remnents of both.

Daniel says he'll be successful up till the time of wrath, Revelation divides the last 7yrs, and the church is not spoken of after the first 42months. It says he persecutes the saints in that times util judgement is given in favor of the Saints.
The judgement is the translation or rapture, at the midpoint, that clears the way for Gods wrath!
Make sense?

Kevin that first paragraph was awesome, thanks.

Rodd, surely we can agree that there are Israelites living in the nation of Israel today, that still don't know that Jesus was their Messiah? Do we agree on this point? So what is to become of them?

"Daniel says he'll be successful up till the time of wrath"
Rodd, please show us the verse you are using for this belief.

"Revelation divides the last 7yrs"
Please show us WHERE in Revelation you see this division.

"the church is not spoken of after the first 42months"
Please show us WHERE you see the first 42 months, and why you believe that IS the first 42 months.

"It says he persecutes the saints in that times util judgement is given in favor of the Saints" Is this back to Daniel again?

"The judgement is the translation or rapture, at the midpoint, that clears the way for Gods wrath!
Make sense?" I only want to see the scriptures that you use to come to this conclusion. Sorry, so far it does not make sense.

Coop

Eric E Stahl · Feb 13, 2012

The first half of the tribulation

lecoop said:
Rodd, surely we can agree that there are Israelites living in the nation of Israel today, that still don't know that Jesus was their Messiah? Do we agree on this point? So what is to become of them?

"Daniel says he'll be successful up till the time of wrath"
Rodd, please show us the verse you are using for this belief.

"Revelation divides the last 7yrs"
Please show us WHERE in Revelation you see this division.

"the church is not spoken of after the first 42months"
Please show us WHERE you see the first 42 months, and why you believe that IS the first 42 months.

"It says he persecutes the saints in that times util judgement is given in favor of the Saints" Is this back to Daniel again?

"The judgement is the translation or rapture, at the midpoint, that clears the way for Gods wrath!
Make sense?" I only want to see the scriptures that you use to come to this conclusion. Sorry, so far it does not make sense.

Coop

Revelation 11:3,7-12 When the two witnesses are taken to heaven with-in one hour of the end of the second woe and 6th trumpet judgments completion, 1260 days will also be passed. That is the middle of the 7 years.

lecoop · Feb 13, 2012

kevinlb63 said:
Since this Kingdom wasn't established at the First Coming of Christ, it must be established at the Second Coming. God knew that the Jews would reject His Son; so He predetermined that Christ's shed Blood on Calvary would serve as an atonement for the sin of the world. This was God's plan all along--to come into the world and pay for the sins of all men (Jhn. 1:29; Rev. 13:8). So the First Coming was one of suffering and shame, but the Second Coming will be one of glory, honor, and praise (1 Pet. 1:10-12). The first time Jesus received a crown of thorns, but when He comes again He will have MANY crowns (Rev. 19:12). He was the "lamb of God" when He came the first time, but He will be the "lion of the tribe of Judah" the second time (Rev. 5:5). The First Coming gave Jesus Christ to the world, but the Second Coming will give the world to Jesus Christ! Just as David was chosen to be the king of Israel many years before he actually received the kingdom (1 Sam. 16), the Lord Jesus Christ has been chosen to take over the kingdoms of this world and rule as God's "KING OF KINGS" (Rev. 11:15; 19:16).
A "Christianity" without a Second Coming is a very selfish religion, for it robs Jesus Christ of all God's precious promises to Him. The teaching and preaching of the Second Coming is very essential, because it speaks of God's righteous King returning to this earth and taking what rightfully belongs to Him. Christians should be rejoicing! The Lord Jesus Christ, the Captain of your Salvation (if you're saved), will soon return to this earth and set things in order and YOU can be on the winning side!

Kevin, this is a good quote. I found where it was quoted from. I would only change one thing: A "kingdom" was certainly established, but it was a spiritual kingdom. It was the physical kingdom that was not established on earth at Jesus' first coming.

The first few verses of Revelation chapter twenty speak of this coming Kingdom being one thousand years long. Verse six says that the saints will reign with Christ for a thousand years. That is, we will reign with Him for a thousand literal years in a literal, physical, and visible earthly Kingdom, and then we will reign forever in the New Heavens and the New Earth (Rev. 5:10; 22:5; 11:15; chapters 21 and 22).

Good job with another quote! There are SO MANY that don't believe in the 1000 year reign of Christ.

Because Israel rejected Christ, God allowed the Romans to destroy Jerusalem in 70 A.D., and the Jews were dispersed among the Gentile nations of the world. Since then they have wondered from nation to nation suffering bitter persecution. However, in the late 1800's a remarkable thing started happening. In large numbers, the Jews began returning to Palestine, and in 1887 they made formal statements that they intended to REPOSSESS THEIR HOMELAND!
When World War I began in 1914, there were 80,000 Jews living in Palestine. England's Balfour Declaration of 1917 gave strong approval for the Jews to establish a national homeland, but England reneged due to Arab pressure. Nevertheless, 400,000 Jews had settled in the homeland by 1939.
Satan saw what was happening. He knew that the Lord was regathering the Jews for a reason, and he knew the reason: the Second Coming of Christ. So Satan raised up Adolph Hitler to murder six million of God's chosen people as an outright act of hate and revenge. This massive slaughter created enough sympathy for the Jews that the United Nations granted 5000 square miles of Palestinian land to them after World War II. Then in 1948 Israel became an independent nation for the first time in many centuries! The Arabs have fought viciously to destroy Israel, but with no success. God wants His people IN PALESTINE (Amos 9:14-15), because the Lord Jesus Christ is coming very soon. During the Six Day War of 1967, Israel even gained possession of the ancient temple sight, and plans are currently underway to rebuild the temple.[/quote]

Another good quote.

the jew have been coming back
for a long time there land is bringing forth fruit and there are jew being saved! and for a note' 144,000 is a small number. in the past 2000 years when christ himself said the time is at hand! over a hundered + one 100 million! jews and christians have been killed i guess LECOOP thinks that is not tribulations.

OF course that is "tribulation." But it has NEVER been "those days" of "Great tribulation" that Jesus spoke of, for those days are STILL in our future. Surely you believe this.

look all we need is christ and belive in him and confess he died for our sins. and keep his fathers law and we will be saved.

What does that mean? Yes, if we follow the Holy Spirit, walk by His spirit and not by our flesh, and NOT GET LUKEWARM, I can agree. But Kevin, what about the five foolish virgins that had the door shut behind them. They DID HAVE some oil. That tells me they WERE born again. But it also tells me they became lukewarm.

and to LECOOP at least i dont turn the Scriptures around to suit my needs hay!

I stand corrected. I can see that for some, that is an unpardonable sin. But really, Kevin, all I meant with that was PROPER English word order! There will be Great Tribulation, and it will be "THOSE DAYS." It won't last the full 42 months of the Antichrist's authority.

if i go out in the pre rapture that will be great.

Kevin, you CAN go out in the pretrib rapture. All you have to do is put your FAITH in it. But I understand you must first believe in it.

but the sdripture i have read so far does not say that

.

Perhaps that could be reworded: You don't understand the scriptures to say that.

Kevin, let me ask a few simple questions. I KNOW you have read 1 thes. 4:17. Please tell us when you think that verse will come to pass, and what other verses you use to come to your conclusion.

What do you make of 1 thes. 5? Just three verses after the classic rapture verse, Paul wrote of the "day of the Lord." Did he change the subject?

What do you think about the "sudden destruction? What is it? Why is it that those living in the Light do not suffer that sudden destruction?

to LECOOP just go and start a new tread and jet other people that belive like you ! why wast your time! just because you can not brainwash us dont mean you cant do it to someone else. i love my god and his son and that is all i need!!

Please, let's just be civil and nice to each other (we ARE brothers in Christ) and come to an understanding about these verses. Why do you think I am trying to brainwash you? Just because we disagree?

After all these posts, do you still believe that the tribulation Jesus spoke of in Matt. 24 has been ongoing for hundreds of years?

Coop

lecoop · Feb 13, 2012

Eric E Stahl said:
<style>  </style>
Only one third of Israel will survive the time of Jacob’s trouble. They will repent after they see the nuclear judgment of fire foretold in Ezekiel 39:1-8

Zechariah 13:7–9 KJV
8 And it shall come to pass, that in all the land, saith the Lord, two parts therein shall be cut off and die; but the third shall be left therein.
9 And I will bring the third part through the fire, and will refine them as silver is refined, and will try them as gold is tried: they shall call on my name, and I will hear them: I will say, It is my people: and they shall say, The Lord is my God.

Of the adults that survive the ratio of men to women will be 7 women to 1 man.

Isaiah 4:1-2
1 And in that day seven women shall take hold of one man, saying, We will eat our own bread, and wear our own apparel: only let us be called by thy name, to take away our reproach.
2 In that day shall the branch of the Lord be beautiful and glorious, and the fruit of the earth shall be excellent and comely for them that are escaped of Israel.

<style>  </style> By the way 50% of the population of earth will die in the first half of the tribulation, 25% in the seal judgments and 25% by the end of the 6th trumpet judgment. The 6th trumpet is completed with in one hour of the two witnesses going up to heaven after they have finished their 1260 day ministry Revelation 3, 7-12

Eric, I don't think you are reading a verse right. Where do you find the 50% killed? I find the 1/3 of all people killed at the 6th trumpet.

Please show us the scriptures for your idea of the 6th trumpet completed within one hour of the two witnesses.

Coop

Eric E Stahl · Feb 13, 2012

lecoop said:
Eric, I don't think you are reading a verse right. Where do you find the 50% killed? I find the 1/3 of all people killed at the 6th trumpet.

Please show us the scriptures for your idea of the 6th trumpet completed within one hour of the two witnesses.

Coop

Eric E Stahl · Feb 13, 2012

lecoop said:
Eric, I don't think you are reading a verse right. Where do you find the 50% killed? I find the 1/3 of all people killed at the 6th trumpet.

Please show us the scriptures for your idea of the 6th trumpet completed within one hour of the two witnesses.

Coop

lecoop · Feb 13, 2012

Eric E Stahl said:
<style>  </style>
100%-25% seal judgment Rev 6:8 = 75% alive at the end of seals.

(75% ) (33%)=25% die in the 6th trumpet Rev 9:18.Only 50% of the

people survive past the 6th trumpet judgment.

Rev 8:13 The last 3 trumpet judgments are so bad they are 3 woes. Rev 11:3,7-14 The second woe is the 6th trumpet judgment and it was finished within the hour that the two witnesses who have finished their 1260 days of witnessing are taken to heaven.

Rev 6:8
<sup class="versenum" id="en-KJV-30802">8</sup>And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death, and Hell followed with him. And power was given unto them over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with sword, and with hunger, and with death, and with the beasts of the earth.

Now, read that verse very carefully, then compare with this one:

Rev 9:
<sup class="versenum" id="en-KJV-30856">15</sup>And the four angels were loosed, which were prepared for an hour, and a day, and a month, and a year, for to slay the third part of men.
<sup class="versenum" id="en-KJV-30859">18</sup>By these three was the third part of men killed, by the fire, and by the smoke, and by the brimstone, which issued out of their mouths.

You see, in 6:8 there is really NO MENTION of how many are killed. What it DOES say, is that they are LIMITED in their theater of operations to 1/4 of the surface of the earth.

So we really have no idea how many are killed by these three horseman, all we know is that they are limited: they cannot work over the entire earth. Now, imagine the earth as an apple: take am apple and cut out one fourth. Look at that fourth. Now, imagine one fourth of the earth with ISRAEL at the very center of that quarter. OF COURSE the quarter they will be limited to will be where the church BEGINS. So what will that quarter include? It will include all of Europe and Africa. WHERE did the black plague hit? Of course Europe. WHERE has all the famines been in your lifetime? Of course Africa.

Now, WHICH horse rides alone, and which three rides together? You will find that in verse 8 above.

The next question is more difficult: WHEN? When do they ride? Actually, if we consider and understand the context of these seals, what comes before, we can know the timing.

Coop

lecoop · Feb 13, 2012

Eric E Stahl said:
<style>  </style>
100%-25% seal judgment Rev 6:8 = 75% alive at the end of seals.

(75% ) (33%)=25% die in the 6th trumpet Rev 9:18.Only 50% of the

people survive past the 6th trumpet judgment.

Rev 8:13 The last 3 trumpet judgments are so bad they are 3 woes. Rev 11:3,7-14 The second woe is the 6th trumpet judgment and it was finished within the hour that the two witnesses who have finished their 1260 days of witnessing are taken to heaven.

Rev 8
<sup class="versenum" id="en-KJV-30841">13</sup>And I beheld, and heard an angel flying through the midst of heaven, saying with a loud voice, Woe, woe, woe, to the inhabiters of the earth by reason of the other voices of the trumpet of the three angels, which are yet to sound!

I see no "hour" here.

Revelation 11:3

King James Version (KJV)

<sup class="versenum" id="en-KJV-30876">3</sup>And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.

Revelation 11:7-14

King James Version (KJV)

<sup class="versenum" id="en-KJV-30880">7</sup>And when they shall have finished their testimony, the beast that ascendeth out of the bottomless pit shall make war against them, and shall overcome them, and kill them.
<sup class="versenum" id="en-KJV-30881">8</sup>And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified.
<sup class="versenum" id="en-KJV-30882">9</sup>And they of the people and kindreds and tongues and nations shall see their dead bodies three days and an half, and shall not suffer their dead bodies to be put in graves.
<sup class="versenum" id="en-KJV-30883">10</sup>And they that dwell upon the earth shall rejoice over them, and make merry, and shall send gifts one to another; because these two prophets tormented them that dwelt on the earth.
<sup class="versenum" id="en-KJV-30884">11</sup>And after three days and an half the spirit of life from God entered into them, and they stood upon their feet; and great fear fell upon them which saw them.
<sup class="versenum" id="en-KJV-30885">12</sup>And they heard a great voice from heaven saying unto them, Come up hither. And they ascended up to heaven in a cloud; and their enemies beheld them.
<sup class="versenum" id="en-KJV-30886">13</sup>And the same hour was there a great earthquake, and the tenth part of the city fell, and in the earthquake were slain of men seven thousand: and the remnant were affrighted, and gave glory to the God of heaven.
<sup class="versenum" id="en-KJV-30887">14</sup>The second woe is past; and, behold, the third woe cometh quickly.

I don't see an "hour" here either.

I know this is a very difficult passage, and not each to understand chronology. But what you are saying is impossible if you stop and analyze it.

Take a close look at 12:6 and tell me WHEN. Where does 12:6 take place in relationship to the exact midpoint.

Coop

kevinlb63 · Feb 14, 2012

Revelation 1

<SUP id=en-KJV-30699 class=versenum>1</SUP>The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John: <SUP id=en-KJV-30700 class=versenum>2</SUP>Who bare record of the word of God, and of the testimony of Jesus Christ, and of all things that he saw. <SUP id=en-KJV-30701 class=versenum>3</SUP>Blessed is he that readeth, and they that hear the words of this prophecy, and keep those things which are written therein:{ for the time is at hand}. It does not say 2000 years later it will start.

and matthew 24:

<SUP id=en-KJV-23959 class=versenum>1</SUP>And Jesus went out, and departed from the temple: and his disciples came to him for to shew him the buildings of the temple. this happend 2000 years ago!!!
<SUP id=en-KJV-23960 class=versenum>2</SUP>And Jesus said unto them, See ye not all these things? verily I say unto you, There shall not be left here one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down. 70AD that happend!!!! very close to 2000 years ago!!!! the romans distroyed every thing there!!
<SUP id=en-KJV-23961 class=versenum>3</SUP>And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?
<SUP id=en-KJV-23962 class=versenum>4</SUP>And Jesus answered and said unto them, Take heed that no man deceive you.
<SUP id=en-KJV-23963 class=versenum>5</SUP>For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many.
<SUP id=en-KJV-23964 class=versenum>6</SUP>And ye shall hear of wars and rumours of wars: see that ye be not troubled: for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet.
<SUP id=en-KJV-23965 class=versenum>7</SUP>For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places.
<SUP id=en-KJV-23966 class=versenum>8</SUP>All these are the beginning of sorrows. <SUP id=en-KJV-23967 class=versenum>9</SUP>Then shall they deliver you up to be afflicted, and shall kill you!!!!!!!: and ye shall be hated of all nations for {my name's sake}. And these things started to happen about 2000 years ago!!! my Quote he was talking to them in the present and future to come and thay where talking to each other at a point in time! his disciples new he has going to give his life for all and wanted to know when these things would start. And he told them! and at the time of his death and resurection the time line would start! and so it did and it is still at hand !! and for 2000 years christians have died for his name sake. and it will be so untill he comes for his bride!!!!!!

rodd · Feb 14, 2012

lecoop said:
Rodd, surely we can agree that there are Israelites living in the nation of Israel today, that still don't know that Jesus was their Messiah? Do we agree on this point? So what is to become of them?

"Daniel says he'll be successful up till the time of wrath"
Rodd, please show us the verse you are using for this belief.

"Revelation divides the last 7yrs"
Please show us WHERE in Revelation you see this division.

"the church is not spoken of after the first 42months"
Please show us WHERE you see the first 42 months, and why you believe that IS the first 42 months.

"It says he persecutes the saints in that times util judgement is given in favor of the Saints" Is this back to Daniel again?

"The judgement is the translation or rapture, at the midpoint, that clears the way for Gods wrath!
Make sense?" I only want to see the scriptures that you use to come to this conclusion. Sorry, so far it does not make sense.

Coop

I'd say not only have they heard that Jesus was their Messiah, but they totally reject that claim outright.
They have no soft side towards Christianity, if you think they do you've been listening to to many tele-evangelists.
What's to become of the unbelieveing Jew, the same that goes for the unbelieveing Gentile!

Daniel verse, 11:36, He will be successful until the time of wrath is completed, so his goals will be achieved, but he will finally be defeated by Christ.
That's why if he's successful for the 7yrs of tribulation and he comes against the saints for 42 months the saints must be gone, because he determines to destroy Christians, there's a 42 mth gap.

Daniel 7:24, tells of the beginning of Antichrists' reign and activities, the saints become his target for 3.5years but he's successful for the full seven 7yrs, the midpoint would be Daniel 12:11.

Judgement in favor of the saints? Daniel 7:22. Time of rapture.

Eric E Stahl · Feb 14, 2012

lecoop said:
Rev 6:8
<sup class="versenum" id="en-KJV-30802">8</sup>And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death, and Hell followed with him. And power was given unto them over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with sword, and with hunger, and with death, and with the beasts of the earth.

Now, read that verse very carefully, then compare with this one:

Rev 9:
<sup class="versenum" id="en-KJV-30856">15</sup>And the four angels were loosed, which were prepared for an hour, and a day, and a month, and a year, for to slay the third part of men.
<sup class="versenum" id="en-KJV-30859">18</sup>By these three was the third part of men killed, by the fire, and by the smoke, and by the brimstone, which issued out of their mouths.

You see, in 6:8 there is really NO MENTION of how many are killed. What it DOES say, is that they are LIMITED in their theater of operations to 1/4 of the surface of the earth.

So we really have no idea how many are killed by these three horseman, all we know is that they are limited: they cannot work over the entire earth. Now, imagine the earth as an apple: take am apple and cut out one fourth. Look at that fourth. Now, imagine one fourth of the earth with ISRAEL at the very center of that quarter. OF COURSE the quarter they will be limited to will be where the church BEGINS. So what will that quarter include? It will include all of Europe and Africa. WHERE did the black plague hit? Of course Europe. WHERE has all the famines been in your lifetime? Of course Africa.

Now, WHICH horse rides alone, and which three rides together? You will find that in verse 8 above.

The next question is more difficult: WHEN? When do they ride? Actually, if we consider and understand the context of these seals, what comes before, we can know the timing.

Coop

kevinlb63 · Feb 14, 2012

bible time line

bible time line This is for lecoop!!!!!!
The Bible was written over a period of 1400 to 1800 years by more than 40 different authors. The Bible is a
compilation of 66 separate books, divided into two primary divisions: the {Old Testament }(containing 39 books)
and the {New Testament} (containing 27 books).
It is believed that all of the books of the Bible were written under inspiration of the Holy Spirit.
The first five books of the Old Testament (known as the Pentateuch or Torah) was written by Moses during the forty
years that the children of Israel wandered in the wilderness (1450 - 1410 B.C.). The twelve historical books of the Old
Testament continue to record the history of the people of Israel under the leadership of Joshua, through the period of
the Judges and the reign of the kings of Israel. The books of Ezra, Nehemiah, and Esther record the history of Israel
following its period of captivity under Babylonian rule.
The historical books span the history of Israel from 1050 - 465 B.C.
The books of Job, the Psalms, the Proverbs, Ecclesiastes, and the Song of Solomon are considered the poetical
books of the Old Testament. Scholars have been unable to determine with any specificity when Job was written.
Based upon the manners and customs recorded in the text, many believe that the book was written during the time of
the Patriarchs of the faith. The individual Psalms, comprising the entire collection,
were written from the days of Israel's Exodus to its restoration after the Babylonian captivity.
Many of the Psalms were written by King David during his reign over Israel.

The entire book! the Old Testament! was compiled between 1000 - 300 B.C.
King David's son, Solomon is credited with writing Proverbs, Ecclesiastes, and Song of Solomon, during his reign
(971 - 931 B.C.).The seventeen Prophetical books of the major and minor prophets span Israel's history from 700 -
450 B.C. For 400 years after the writing of the Book of Malachi, the Lord was silent and the Old Testament was closed.

the New Testament (containing 27 books).
It is generally agreed that the Book of Mark was the first Gospel written and that it was written between A.D. 50 and 75.
Of the four Gospel's, John's is considered to have been the last one written, around A.D. 85. The Book of Acts,
a historical account of the establishment of the early Christian church,
is believed to have been written by one of the Apostle Paul's associates,
around A.D. 62 (near the end of Paul's imprisonment in Rome).
The Pauline Epistles (the Apostle Paul's letters to the early church) were authored between A.D. 50 - 67.
The author of Hebrews is unknown, but the book is commonly thought to have been written around A.D. 70.
The epistles of the other Apostles were written between A.D. 48 - 90.
The Book of the Revelation of Jesus Christ is believed to have been penned by the Apostle John between A.D.70 - 95.

Lecoop i am not at all impressed with your wisdom and i am not mad
or ill. I will just lay it out for you like a child so you can understand!
the bible has been compiled over 1800 + years or so. the
new Testament (containing 27 books). started to be compiled around 70 a.d. this means that thay have been people for almost 2000 years reading the Prophecies of the old and new Testament
for over a thousand years plus. including matthew so when you say and
Quote!!to me from Lecoop!! After all these posts, do you still believe that the tribulation Jesus spoke of in Matt. 24 has been ongoing for hundreds of years?
i will pretend you did not say that or ask that!!! because it is Lunacy! would you tell someone right after christ died and his Prophecies were comeing to pass right before there eyes. Even as thay where being killed for his names sake! because thay loved him! well he tould them it would happen. and it did and it is still comeing on us! and it will! be complete soon. so the answer is yes i do think that the things in matthew 24: have been happening for over a thousand years!! and that is wisdom by reading the word of god! because he said the time is at hand and that is what what he ment!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Eric E Stahl · Feb 14, 2012

lecoop said:
Rev 8
<sup class="versenum" id="en-KJV-30841">13</sup>And I beheld, and heard an angel flying through the midst of heaven, saying with a loud voice, Woe, woe, woe, to the inhabiters of the earth by reason of the other voices of the trumpet of the three angels, which are yet to sound!

I see no "hour" here.

Revelation 11:3

King James Version (KJV)

<sup class="versenum" id="en-KJV-30876">3</sup>And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.

Revelation 11:7-14

King James Version (KJV)

<sup class="versenum" id="en-KJV-30880">7</sup>And when they shall have finished their testimony, the beast that ascendeth out of the bottomless pit shall make war against them, and shall overcome them, and kill them.
<sup class="versenum" id="en-KJV-30881">8</sup>And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified.
<sup class="versenum" id="en-KJV-30882">9</sup>And they of the people and kindreds and tongues and nations shall see their dead bodies three days and an half, and shall not suffer their dead bodies to be put in graves.
<sup class="versenum" id="en-KJV-30883">10</sup>And they that dwell upon the earth shall rejoice over them, and make merry, and shall send gifts one to another; because these two prophets tormented them that dwelt on the earth.
<sup class="versenum" id="en-KJV-30884">11</sup>And after three days and an half the spirit of life from God entered into them, and they stood upon their feet; and great fear fell upon them which saw them.
<sup class="versenum" id="en-KJV-30885">12</sup>And they heard a great voice from heaven saying unto them, Come up hither. And they ascended up to heaven in a cloud; and their enemies beheld them.
<sup class="versenum" id="en-KJV-30886">13</sup>And the same hour was there a great earthquake, and the tenth part of the city fell, and in the earthquake were slain of men seven thousand: and the remnant were affrighted, and gave glory to the God of heaven.
<sup class="versenum" id="en-KJV-30887">14</sup>The second woe is past; and, behold, the third woe cometh quickly.

I don't see an "hour" here either.

I know this is a very difficult passage, and not each to understand chronology. But what you are saying is impossible if you stop and analyze it.

Take a close look at 12:6 and tell me WHEN. Where does 12:6 take place in relationship to the exact midpoint.

Coop

David777 · Feb 14, 2012

Hello all.

Have been enjoying the battle over the interpretation of different chapters in Revelations.

I have a question for anyone who may think they understand the book of Revelations.

Who is the woman below and why do you think so,

Revelations 12:1-2

Now a great sign appeared in heaven: a woman clothed with the sun, with the moon under
her feet, and on her head a garland of twelve stars. Then being with child, she cried out in
labor and in pain to give birth.

Eric E Stahl · Feb 14, 2012

David777 said:
Have been enjoying the battle over the interpretation of different chapters in Revelations.

I have a question for anyone who may think they understand the book of Revelations.

Who is the woman below and why do you think so,

Revelations 12:1-2

Now a great sign appeared in heaven: a woman clothed with the sun, with the moon under
her feet, and on her head a garland of twelve stars. Then being with child, she cried out in
labor and in pain to give birth.

David777 · Feb 14, 2012

Thanks Eric.

Anyone else think they may know who the woman represents.

kevinlb63 · Feb 14, 2012

it is mary and she is with child {jesus} and herod is the dragon who wants to kill him
and all of this is about the nation of israel to come!

kevinlb63 · Feb 14, 2012

<SUP>1</SUP>And there appeared a great wonder in heaven; a woman/{ mary }clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet, and upon her head a crown of twelve stars:

<SUP id=en-KJV-30894 class=versenum>2</SUP>And she being with child /{christ}cried, travailing in birth, and pained to be delivered.
<SUP id=en-KJV-30895 class=versenum>3</SUP>And there appeared another wonder in heaven; and behold a great red dragon/ {herod/ of rome!!! possessed by satan}, having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads.
<SUP id=en-KJV-30896 class=versenum>4</SUP>And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered, for to devour her child/ {christ} as soon as it was born. <SUP id=en-KJV-30897 class=versenum>5</SUP>And she brought forth a man child,{christ} who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God,our Savior and to his throne.

kevinlb63 · Feb 14, 2012

revelation 12:1-5 MARY AND HEROD AND ISREAL
1 And there appeared a great wonder in heaven; a woman/{ mary }clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet,

and upon her head a crown of twelve stars: {isreal}
2 And she being with child /{christ}cried, travailing in birth, and pained to be delivered.

3 And there appeared another wonder in heaven; and behold a great red dragon/ {herod/ of rome!!! possessed by satan},

having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads.{rome!}
4 And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth:
{and satan tail took a third of the angels with him to the earth} ABOVE VERSE^

and the dragon {HEROD/ROME!} stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered,
for to devour her child/ {christ} as soon as it was born.
5 And she brought forth a man child,{christ} who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God
,our Savior and to his throne.

David777 · Feb 14, 2012

Thanks.

Thank you Kevin, an interesting reply.

Anyone else care to offer a description of who the woman is in Revelations 12.

Very curious to see how different the interpretations are.

Welcome!

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