No one goes to heaven!

[Rhema]

As are you.

Council of Jamnia - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

I'm not quite sure what a fictional council of Jews has to do with the canon of the New Testament.

And with regards to the Canon of the Church of the East, it was the only canon established by an Apostle.

The Roman Catholics don't see the Bible as Sola Scriptura. That was the invention of the man Martin Luther. So again, what's your point?

Ironically enough, I can't be accused of choosing my own canon, as I don't have one.

Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.​

(John 5:39 KJV)

Rhema

 

[Rhema]

Are you pretending you have not?

Answered above.

people suggesting there is a formula for tricking Yehovah into speaking to us in the audible form and I say poppycock!

No doubt.

... According to your faith be it unto you.​

(Matthew 9:29 KJV)

God has spoken seven words to me in 2 months short of eighty years... that is more than enough.

See above.

But I find that sentiment rather sad.

Rhema

 

[Christ4Ever]

I'm not quite sure what a fictional council of Jews has to do with the canon of the New Testament.

And with regards to the Canon of the Church of the East, it was the only canon established by an Apostle.

The Roman Catholics don't see the Bible as Sola Scriptura. That was the invention of the man Martin Luther. So again, what's your point?

Ironically enough, I can't be accused of choosing my own canon, as I don't have one.

Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.​

(John 5:39 KJV)

Rhema

I have previously addressed this issue, but you have yet to comment on the inconsistency I presented to you.
The timeline presents an irregularity in the canon you put forward as the only viable one; because the Apostle in question could not have been presented these writings to agree or disagree with them due to being written posthumously. Nevertheless, some of these writings were included in the canon of that church, which is held in high esteem and considered unparalleled authority as presented by you.

Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.(John 5:39 KJV)

The verse you quote is from the Book of John which was one of the books that was written between 85 - 90 AD, which is after the death of the Apostle whose approval would have been needed to accept this writing as being included in the canon of your church.

Special Note: Is it possible that the "Scriptures" being referred by Jesus were actually the ones we now consider the OT? The quote being used here comes from Jesus while still in the midst of His Earthly Ministry, and none of the NT Books had yet been written.

With the Love of Christ Jesus.
Nick
\o/
<><

 

[Curtis]

The dead are in their graves.
They do not go to heaven or anywhere as all thoughts perish.

Where did Jesus go after His death?

 

[Curtis]

It baffles me why so many trained ministers actually say that th dead know nothing but are in heaven but will be resurrected to be judged! Just baffles me how their minds work!

Have you ever tried to talk to a person whose spirit has left their body? Not much to talk about.
Mans's body is not the person but only the house or tent a spirit once lived in.

Jas 2:26 For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.

2Co 5:6 Therefore we are always confident, knowing that, whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the Lord:
2Co 5:7 (For we walk by faith, not by sight
2Co 5:8 We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.

 

[th1bill]

Answered above.


No doubt.

... According to your faith be it unto you.​

(Matthew 9:29 KJV)


See above.

But I find that sentiment rather sad.

Rhema

Your reaction is sad. Scripture teaches us to test all spirits and the test standard is the Holy Word recorded by Yehovah.

 

[Rhema]

I have previously addressed this issue, but you have yet to comment on the inconsistency I presented to you.

I do believe I had said that the timelines you've presented are mere guesses, and that most all of such scholarly work was done by unbelievers.

The verse you quote is from the Book of John which was one of the books that was written between 85 - 90 AD,

Proof ? I mean seriously. What are the background facts that actually pin down your time frame to the years 85-90 AD?

I can tell you right now that John didn't write the gospel to which name his was attached. So if they don't know who the author was, how do y'all know the years?

Then Peter, turning about, seeth the disciple whom Jesus loved following; which also leaned on his breast at supper, and said, Lord, which is he that betrayeth thee? Peter seeing him saith to Jesus, Lord, and what shall this man do? Jesus saith unto him, If I will that he tarry till I come, what is that to thee? follow thou me. Then went this saying abroad among the brethren, that that disciple should not die: yet Jesus said not unto him, He shall not die; but, If I will that he tarry till I come, what is that to thee? This is the disciple which testifieth of these things, and wrote these things: and we know that his testimony is true.​

(John 21:20-24 KJV)

The above should be enough to prove who the author truly was.

Special Note: Is it possible that the "Scriptures" being referred by Jesus were actually the ones we now consider the OT? The quote being used here comes from Jesus while still in the midst of His Earthly Ministry, and none of the NT Books had yet been written.

Absolutely.

Rhema

While I don't have the reference right at hand, most all of the NT quotes of the OT are nearly word for word from the Septuagint.

 

[Christ4Ever]

I have previously addressed this issue, but you have yet to comment on the inconsistency I presented to you.
The timeline presents an irregularity in the canon you put forward as the only viable one; because the Apostle in question could not have been presented these writings to agree or disagree with them due to being written posthumously. Nevertheless, some of these writings were included in the canon of that church, which is held in high esteem and considered unparalleled authority as presented by you.

I do believe I had said that the timelines you've presented are mere guesses, and that most all of such scholarly work was done by unbelievers.

Is this your answer to all the inconsistencies between the death of the Apostles Thomas which we know is 72AD, and his confirming of the writings written after his death that are included in the canon, you profess is correct?

With the Love of Christ Jesus.
Nick
\o/
<><

 

[B-A-C]

Ignore this at your own risk.

Rev 22:18 I testify to everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: if anyone adds to them, God will add to him the plagues which are written in this book;
Rev 22:19 and if anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God will take away his part from the tree of life and from the holy city, which are written in this book.

 

[th1bill]

Proof ? I mean seriously. What are the background facts that actually pin down your time frame to the years 85-90 AD?

I can tell you right now that John didn't write the gospel to which name his was attached. So if they don't know who the author was, how do y'all know the years?


Then Peter, turning about, seeth the disciple whom Jesus loved following; which also leaned on his breast at supper, and said, Lord, which is he that betrayeth thee? Peter seeing him saith to Jesus, Lord, and what shall this man do? Jesus saith unto him, If I will that he tarry till I come, what is that to thee? follow thou me. Then went this saying abroad among the brethren, that that disciple should not die: yet Jesus said not unto him, He shall not die; but, If I will that he tarry till I come, what is that to thee? This is the disciple which testifieth of these things, and wrote these things: and we know that his testimony is true.
(John 21:20-24 KJV)

The above should be enough to prove who the author truly was.

This has naught to do with authoring the letter John is credited with transcribing. The Author is Yashuah.

 

[Rhema]

Is this your answer to all the inconsistencies between the death of the Apostles Thomas which we know is 72AD, and his confirming of the writings written after his death that are included in the canon, you profess is correct?

I noticed that you provide zero evidence about dating. Zilch. Nada. I happen to know some of the criteria upon which these dates are based, specifically the notion of failed prophecy, so ...

What are the background facts that actually pin down your time frame to the years 85-90 AD?

Rhema

 

[Twistie]

Heavens not a place

 

[Rhema]

Ignore this at your own risk.

As late as 325 AD, half of the Bishops at Nicaea thought the book to be rubbish. It was Not in the canon at that time. Period.

So of course God needs to put in a guilt-trip-curse to show it was scripture, right? That particular sophomoric comment is one of the reasons to reject the book out of hand.

Can A Pre-Christian Version of the Book of Revelation Be Recovered? – TaborBlog

jamestabor.com

It's a fool's errand to study the Bible without knowing the historical and religious context of the world at large.

Has anyone here actually read any Jewish Apocalyptic literature?

Rhema

 

[Rhema]

Is this your answer to all the inconsistencies between the death of the Apostles Thomas which we know is 72AD, and his confirming of the writings....

In the link provided, Dr. James Tabor (with whom I do Not agree with 100%) gives a date for Revelation.

it appears that one can fairly easily recover a pre-Christian version of this text (Revelation), more or less, with very little change to the underlying text itself. What this would then allow is a re-reading of the book as a whole, with its references to the “Beast,” the “False Prophet,” and “Babylon” in a pre-70 CE setting. Scholars have most often applied the basic setting of the book to the reigns of the Roman emperors Nero (54-66 CE) and Domitian, with several stages of redaction in the period from 68 to 100 CE.​

LINK

My initial point was that Revelation was rejected by the Apostle Thomas, or more specific that the canon was closed at the Apostle's Death.

Whether the initial text of Revelation, written without the Christian veneer before 66 AD, was rejected, or whether the book never reached India at all is a bit irrelevant to the larger question about the canonicity of Revelation.

As if God needed 400 years to make up his mind.

Rhema

 

[Christ4Ever]

I noticed that you provide zero evidence about dating. Zilch. Nada. I happen to know some of the criteria upon which these dates are based, specifically the notion of failed prophecy, so ...

What are the background facts that actually pin down your time frame to the years 85-90 AD?

Rhema

Why do you avoid answering the question?

With the Love of Christ Jesus.
Nick
\o/
<><

 

[Christ4Ever]

This has naught to do with authoring the letter John is credited with transcribing. The Author is Yashuah.

Dear Brother,
I know. Yet, this Member Rhema has set a criterion of the Apostle Thomas approval, in order to be considered canon. Which makes anything written after this Apostle's death unacceptable as canon. Yet, secular and religious paleographists have determined certain books/letters with dates that are after the death of the Apostle Thomas in 72AD, and yet are included in his church's canon.

Should be simple enough for him to answer, don't you think?

With the Love of Christ Jesus.
YBIC
Nick
\o/
<><

 

[Rhema]

The Author is Yashuah.

As many believed to be true with the Epistle of Barnabas.

 

[Rhema]

Why do you avoid answering the question?

I answered it twice Nick. Why do you avoid posting any proof about your dating system?

Rhema
(Do I need to post the entry numbers?)

 

[Rhema]

Rhema has set a criterion of the Apostle Thomas approval

(Heavy Sigh.)

I had stated that this was the position of the Church of the East. I myself ascribe to no such criterion.

You had brought up dating schemes as a way of discrediting the Church of the East, and you asserted dates for the Gospel named John, to which I posted sufficient scripture to show that John was not even the author of that Gospel.

How much of your Faith is based upon CATHOLIC tradition? (You know it's a lot, you know.)

Rhema

 

[Christ4Ever]

I answered it twice Nick. Why do you avoid posting any proof about your dating system?

Rhema
(Do I need to post the entry numbers?)

Actually, you have not, as much as you'd like to say you have.
Unless you are saying that none of the books/letters in the Canon accepted by you and the Church of the East are dated after the death of the Apostle Thomas. Is that what you are saying?

With the Love of Christ Jesus.
Nick
\o/
<><