The church is being deceived to believe in a dual natured false Messiah and they do not know!

[Bill]

Ok, Bill I know it was going to be like that for you, For the “Doctrine of the Trinity “ is for “Theological thinking” that is why most think they know the “doctrine of the Trinity” and they don’t, neither can they explain it properly. Ok , the link that I gave you , I did figure you would stop maybe mid way. Be cause it is kinda brainy, but I am here to tell you, You can do it, it will come together, when you read the whole link!❤ Trust me. Do it! You will see. I , have read autobiographies, and works of these. “Athanasius, Augustine, ignatius, Hus, knox, Wycliffe, Luther Calvin, Irenaeus, tertullian, but when I got to “Thomas Aguinas” he made my HEAD HURT! I put him on the “ shelf “ and let him stay there for “20 years”!!!!! One day I look at him, something said “pick him up” I open that book and started reading, I was amaze I could understand him, over 700 pages I read him in 3 days! He truly was one of the must “Brilliant of Theological & Philosophical minds” of such times of the church fathers. And I don’t know nothing I’m just a mere ploughboy! He ran way from a rich home, about 13 years old to university to learn, his parents had to kidnap him back and lock him in a room, he would run away stow away going back, finally his mother knew she could not keep him from running away to the university, and stage a fake escape for him to escape back to school. The students at university, joke at him laugh at him scorn him. He was quite, reserved. He the most brilliant of all, claiming, that God has give the brilliants of minds, in theological and philosophical thinking, that we would defend the weak, and underprivileged from the smart and most highly intelligent minds of this World!!!!!
In saying all this “I beseech you “Bill “ in the name of Jesus! To go back and read the link “what is the doctrine of the Trinity” that I posted for you all the way to the end.❤ Love you brother, fully in Christ Jesus our Lord! Shalom!

Yes Thomas Aquinus is a tough read

If you ever get a chance . Go find the books called sunday sermons of the founding fathers . They have excellent insight . Plus its cool to read " scrolls " in book form that were handed down by the early Christians

 

[PloughBoy]

They do have A few nuggets !

 

[Bill]

Ok, Bill I know it was going to be like that for you, For the “Doctrine of the Trinity “ is for “Theological thinking” that is why most think they know the “doctrine of the Trinity” and they don’t, neither can they explain it properly. Ok , the link that I gave you , I did figure you would stop maybe mid way. Be cause it is kinda brainy, but I am here to tell you, You can do it, it will come together, when you read the whole link!❤ Trust me. Do it! You will see. I , have read autobiographies, and works of these. “Athanasius, Augustine, ignatius, Hus, knox, Wycliffe, Luther Calvin, Irenaeus, tertullian, but when I got to “Thomas Aguinas” he made my HEAD HURT! I put him on the “ shelf “ and let him stay there for “20 years”!!!!! One day I look at him, something said “pick him up” I open that book and started reading, I was amaze I could understand him, over 700 pages I read him in 3 days! He truly was one of the must “Brilliant of Theological & Philosophical minds” of such times of the church fathers. And I don’t know nothing I’m just a mere ploughboy! He ran way from a rich home, about 13 years old to university to learn, his parents had to kidnap him back and lock him in a room, he would run away stow away going back, finally his mother knew she could not keep him from running away to the university, and stage a fake escape for him to escape back to school. The students at university, joke at him laugh at him scorn him. He was quite, reserved. He the most brilliant of all, claiming, that God has give the brilliants of minds, in theological and philosophical thinking, that we would defend the weak, and underprivileged from the smart and most highly intelligent minds of this World!!!!!
In saying all this “I beseech you “Bill “ in the name of Jesus! To go back and read the link “what is the doctrine of the Trinity” that I posted for you all the way to the end.❤ Love you brother, fully in Christ Jesus our Lord! Shalom!

My friend . Please dont judge me so harshly . . Lol . Maybe not the right word.

I gave Samson a challenge . An understanding beyond where he is now. And i will give you the same

Jesus tells us to follow Him. To carry our cross and to be Holy for our Father in Heaven is Holy.

When Jesus carried the Cross, it wasnt His sins or burdens, but Scripture states He took the sin upon Himself and made them His. In turn He offered Himself to the Father.

The challenge i give you. To take the sins of others upon yourself , to carry thier cross , Just as Jesus, a selfless act. Carry those sins and offerthem up to the Lord.

Jesus calls us to be the sons and daughters of the Father. To " follow me " . To be the servant

 

[Bill]

They do have A few nuggets !

I really wish i could speak freely .

A month or so ago . I went to visit a friend . A Minister who knows me. The Lord allows me to confide in him the work i do. But even with him . I know there are limits.

Some friends of his were over , The organ player and a professor from a nearby seminary.

I sat there, and they wanted to talk about God and spiritual things . My friend said " the hat is off, talk about anything you want " i asked " are you sure" he said yes.

I could see the questions in the professor, so i told him to ask anything. So he asked about how Time and Space effect the Angels. I told him Time and space dont affect the Angels as they were created before them.

Then other questions came. I didnt hold back , and it blew them away .

Lol i havent seen them sinse then. Except my Minister friend. He told me later, " i didnt know you were going to be so open "

Lol

 

[Sue D.]

Actually, Scripture doesn't really say How time affects the angelic world. We Do know that they Can come and go on this earth. -- especially in the Old Testament.

We Do know that there Are guardian angels who protect believers Now.

God created 'time' for all of Us. Mankind.

And some of the things you've shared here on Forum Are Strange indeed. And I can believe that it "blew them away".

Back in post #83 you commented about Jesus Christ taking everyone's sins upon Himself and dying with then, Very Correct -- but your last comment "in turn He offered Himself to the Father" -- well , God the Father had to take His eyes OFF the Son while He Did have all the sins upon Himself. Scripture tells us what happened in the world, the earth when that took place. Everything turned dark, earth shook, etc. And then everything was okay. And , again, proof that it was truly the Son of God who died on the cross that day.

No human being is / can/ take anyone elses' sins upon themselves and give them to God the Father. We can Pray for one another, and we Should. 'We' are Not Jesus Christ -- our sins are Ours to take to God Through Jesus Christ. He forgives when we ask for forgiveness.

Our 'cross' is our's alone. We go to God, ourselves, through Jesus Christ.

 

[Dave M]

Actually, Scripture doesn't really say How time affects the angelic world. We Do know that they Can come and go on this earth. -- especially in the Old Testament.

We Do know that there Are guardian angels who protect believers Now.

God created 'time' for all of Us. Mankind.

And some of the things you've shared here on Forum Are Strange indeed. And I can believe that it "blew them away".

Back in post #83 you commented about Jesus Christ taking everyone's sins upon Himself and dying with then, Very Correct -- but your last comment "in turn He offered Himself to the Father" -- well , God the Father had to take His eyes OFF the Son while He Did have all the sins upon Himself. Scripture tells us what happened in the world, the earth when that took place. Everything turned dark, earth shook, etc. And then everything was okay. And , again, proof that it was truly the Son of God who died on the cross that day.

No human being is / can/ take anyone elses' sins upon themselves anhem to God the Father. We can Pray for one another, and we Should. 'We' are Not Jesus Christ -- our sins are Ours to take to God Through Jesus Christ. He forgives when we ask for forgiveness.

Our 'cross' is our's alone. We go to God, ourselves, through Jesus Christ.

Amen sister thank you for good sound doctrine, that is why God gave us his word so we can discern !! Gods word over experience is what Gods word teaches !!

for we must be careful if a experience does not line up with scripture for it is written, that is why we must be in the word daily and the word must be part of us, we must be saturated with the word of God or else we will not be able to discern

2 Corinthians 11:14 And no wonder, for even Satan disguises himself as an angel of light.

 

[Bill]

Actually, Scripture doesn't really say How time affects the angelic world. We Do know that they Can come and go on this earth. -- especially in the Old Testament.

We Do know that there Are guardian angels who protect believers Now.

God created 'time' for all of Us. Mankind.

And some of the things you've shared here on Forum Are Strange indeed. And I can believe that it "blew them away".

Back in post #83 you commented about Jesus Christ taking everyone's sins upon Himself and dying with then, Very Correct -- but your last comment "in turn He offered Himself to the Father" -- well , God the Father had to take His eyes OFF the Son while He Did have all the sins upon Himself. Scripture tells us what happened in the world, the earth when that took place. Everything turned dark, earth shook, etc. And then everything was okay. And , again, proof that it was truly the Son of God who died on the cross that day.

No human being is / can/ take anyone elses' sins upon themselves and give them to God the Father. We can Pray for one another, and we Should. 'We' are Not Jesus Christ -- our sins are Ours to take to God Through Jesus Christ. He forgives when we ask for forgiveness.

Our 'cross' is our's alone. We go to God, ourselves, through Jesus Christ.

Jesus tells us to follow him.

Simon carried Jesus cross for a while . The scripture is more than just a physical book. As Jesus carries the sin of others, none of which are his own . Simon too carried that cross .

Its not by idle fancy we hear about Simon. There is purpose for everything in scripture.

As Jesus shows us the way . It is our act of selflessness . Being our brothers keeper, and loving your neighbor as yourself .

Jesus teaches that we should be as servants to others. And the greatest gift you can give is your life.

All of these things give validity to carry anothers cross . .

As i told those i gave it to. , this will challenge them.

 

[Samson2020]

Jesus tells us to follow him.

Simon carried Jesus cross for a while . The scripture is more than just a physical book. As Jesus carries the sin of others, none of which are his own . Simon too carried that cross .

Its not by idle fancy we hear about Simon. There is purpose for everything in scripture.

As Jesus shows us the way . It is our act of selflessness . Being our brothers keeper, and loving your neighbor as yourself .

Jesus teaches that we should be as servants to others. And the greatest gift you can give is your life.

All of these things give validity to carry anothers cross . .

As i told those i gave it to. , this will challenge them.

Not really much of a challenge BILL. Because if I were to carry someone elses cross they wouldn't be able to carry their own. Then the verse which tells
us Matt 16:24 "Then Jesus said unto his disciples, If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me." If I or you were to carry anothers cross they couldn't be his disciple." Now why would I want to keep them from following Jesus? Sounds like your suggesting I and Ploughboy do just that.

I think that shows us your intent- subvert, and divert, and in the end just plain outsmarting yourself. Took me a little longer than it should have to figure out that diversion was your goal, even though I briefly mentioned it a time or two.

 

[Sue D.]

We each have our personal crosses -- we are to bring our petitions / needs to God through Jesus Christ.

Following God can be a real challenge. We are to be Willing to place our lives in God's hands.

The Only time Jesus Christ bore our sins was on the cross. He became the mediator between mankind and God.

We are responsible for our own sinning.

I'm thinking that Simon was Told to carry the cross because they didn't think Jesus was strong enough to carry his own physical cross. By that time, He'd already been beaten beyond recognition. Was very weak.

Not everything you're portraying as being Scriptural Is.

 

[Curtis]

Jesus's "cross" is our cross!

Gal 2:20 I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.

 

[Samson2020]

Jesus's "cross" is our cross!

Gal 2:20 I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.

For God so loved the world that he gave his ONLY BEGOTTEN SON.......... One cannot be their own Father. Greater Love hath no man than to lay down his life for his friends. Thats us, his friends. God gave us his Son as a sacrifice for our sins because he loved us. And his Son Jesus was of like mind in that he gave his life in return for ours.

 

[Curtis]

For God so loved the world that he gave his ONLY BEGOTTEN SON.......... One cannot be their own Father. Greater Love hath no man than to lay down his life for his friends. Thats us, his friends. God gave us his Son as a sacrifice for our sins because he loved us. And his Son Jesus was of like mind in that he gave his life in return for ours.

Where did Jesus come from? How was he begotten of the Father? Jesus came from "inside" of His Father as the Word of God that took on a flesh body. Words come from the Father's mouth which is how he sends his Son (Word of God who is God!)

Joh_6:38 For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me.

The "will" of the Father is contained within every Word the Father speaks which is the Word of God (Jesus Christ)

It is "easy' to believe that Jesus died for you, but it is another thing to believe that you died with him on his cross, which is why the scriptures says.....

Gal 2:20 I have been crucified with Christ. It is no longer I who live, but Christ who lives in me. And the life I now live in the flesh I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave himself for me.

Col 3:2 Set your affection on things above, not on things on the earth.
Col 3:3 For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God.

Col 2:20 Wherefore if ye be dead with Christ from the rudiments of the world, why, as though living in the world, are ye subject to ordinances,

2Ti 2:11 It is a faithful saying: For if we be dead with him, we shall also live with him:

Where God's "elect" died" is the same place Jesus died, on his cross! (which is our cross)

All of humanity was "inside" Adam when he sinned, and brought death to this world. All of God's Church was inside Christ when he died on the cross we to died, and when Jesus was risen from the dead he brought all of his Church to life!

 

[Sue D.]

Begotten -- one of a kind.

 

[Samson2020]

To Curtis,

My first question would be in your definition of WORD. How can we prove that the WORD of God was not just simply the PLAN of God that was fulfilled by JESUS in the flesh? And where do we get the idea that Jesus was God simply because he was called the WORD of God? If God sends his word then it accomplishes that to which he sent it. Yes? So in sending his word it had a goal to accomplish and Jesus did just that accomplish salvation for mankind. Yes? But that does not make the WORD of God a GOD. If that were the case then there would be a multitude of GODS as God has said many many times "HEAR YE THE WORD OF THE LORD" or "THUS SAITH THE LORD", My words are not me just like your words are not you but they came from us. The same can be said of God, his words are not him, but they came from him.
So whether we say the Word or the PLAN was made flesh it means the same thing. God sent his Son into the world. This is what Jesus tells us. yes?
And since the Bible tells us that he had to be made like unto his brethren (us), if he were GOD in the flesh that part was not accomplished.






.

 

[Samson2020]

Where did Jesus come from? How was he begotten of the Father? Jesus came from "inside" of His Father as the Word of God that took on a flesh body. Words come from the Father's mouth which is how he sends his Son (Word of God who is God!)

Joh_6:38 For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me.

The "will" of the Father is contained within every Word the Father speaks which is the Word of God (Jesus Christ)

It is "easy' to believe that Jesus died for you, but it is another thing to believe that you died with him on his cross, which is why the scriptures says.....

Gal 2:20 I have been crucified with Christ. It is no longer I who live, but Christ who lives in me. And the life I now live in the flesh I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave himself for me.

Col 3:2 Set your affection on things above, not on things on the earth.
Col 3:3 For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God.

Col 2:20 Wherefore if ye be dead with Christ from the rudiments of the world, why, as though living in the world, are ye subject to ordinances,

2Ti 2:11 It is a faithful saying: For if we be dead with him, we shall also live with him:

Where God's "elect" died" is the same place Jesus died, on his cross! (which is our cross)

All of humanity was "inside" Adam when he sinned, and brought death to this world. All of God's Church was inside Christ when he died on the cross we to died, and when Jesus was risen from the dead he brought all of his Church to life!

Easier to answer if I pull you post down. Jesus came from the Father and so did you and me and every living Adamite that ever existed. Without the spirit the body is dead? Where did all those spirits come from? GOD, same place that Jesus came from.
Begotten of the Father by the Holy Spirit hovering over Mary and simply placing human male genetic material in one of her eggs. That will make a human body. Cool part is that God not having a carnal mind (can't be at odds with himself) couldn't pass a carnal mind to his child which explains why Jesus was so zealous for his Father and was incapable of sin. He was never separated from his Father from the word go until he took upon himself the sin of the world.

 

[Sue D.]

Okay if I also respond?! John 1:1 "In the beginning was the Word and the Word was With God and the Word Was God. "

How does a person Prove that the Word ...... And then you get into a lot of ........ -- God has given us His written Word.

The Word is referring to Jesus Christ.

Jesus Christ was part of the Godhead.

You and I and everyone Else are mankind.

God became man in the form of Jesus as Mary's son in the Gospels. Jesus being Jesus Christ the Son of God.

It's getting late -- will be back tomorrow afternoon.

 

[Samson2020]

Your doctrine would require 2 Gods during the period of the Mosaic law, young Jesus GOD and the GOD himself, and we have been told many many times by God that there is no other God besides me "I know of none."
The whole point to this is that if Jesus were GOD in the flesh why was it necessary for him to be "perfected by the things he suffered". As God he should have been perfect already???? To go a bit further, if he was just a man that became a NEW creature through HOLY GHOST baptism (which if he were GOD that wouldn't have been necessary), that went on to become a GOD as GOD declares him to be a GOD right? Then this is also your goal and obtainable for he paved the WAY. What I'm saying is that if you cannot see what he was and what he became then you could never have the faith to obtain what he got. And as everything is obtained by Faith with our Father those who couldn't possibly imagine this outcome could have no faith in it, therefore left out. But with trinity there can be no goal set that high because you would need to start off as a GOD.

 

[Samson2020]

And one last thing. Why was he never called IMMANUEL in the NEW TESTAMENT writing, with the exception of reprint of OLD testament scripture? And I'm speaking mainly to his entire earthly life. It was always JESUS said or JESUS did or JESUS was etc...etc....
IMMANUEL- GOD with us is fulfilled when we read the verse 2 Co 5:19 "That to wit GOD was IN CHRIST, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the WORD of reconciliation." Would it make more sense if we replaced the word word with plan?
.......and hath committed unto us the PLAN of reconciliation. Or how about ............and hath committed unto us the WAY of reconciliation. After all Jesus did say he was The WAY THE TRUTH AND THE LIFE. But for the life of me I never remember him calling himself the WORD. Food for thought

 

[Curtis]

Easier to answer if I pull you post down. Jesus came from the Father and so did you and me and every living Adamite that ever existed.

There is just "one", "only begotten Son of God!" not many only Sons of God. Jesus is the "Word of God" alone, he is NOT the words of God contained in scripture!

2Ti 1:8 Be not thou therefore ashamed of the testimony of our Lord, nor of me his prisoner: but be thou partaker of the afflictions of the gospel according to the power of God;
2Ti 1:9 Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,
2Ti 1:10 But is now made manifest by the appearing of our Saviour Jesus Christ, who hath abolished death, and hath brought life and immortality to light through the gospel:

The Gospel message which contains the "words of God" (which is what Jesus spoke) is what brought life, and immortality to light to his Church through the Gospel!

 

[Samson2020]

Then where did your spirit come from? As that was what I said your Spirit came from God. And I agree that your human body and mine were begotten of our earthly fathers and mothers. But your spirit that causes your body to be alive came from GOD. And we still havn't gotten past the fact that he had to made like unto his brethren, he had to be human to experience the life we lived, if he were God he would already have known that. Why did he need to be perfected by the things he suffered if he was GOD already he should have been perfect but the BIBLE tells us otherwise. Doesn't say he sinned it just says he was perfected by the things he suffered.