What does it mean to be saved?

[Sue D.]

Do you agree with Yeshua/Jesus that you must be Perfect as the Father?

No one on this earth is perfect as the Father. God is God. Mankind is mankind.

Because of the cross -- shed blood of Jesus Christ -- God sees us as righteous -- but that does Not equate to perfect / Holy as the Father.

 

[BunnyOnion]

Psa 69:28; May they be blotted out of the book of life And may they not be recorded with the righteous.

Rev_3:5; 'He who overcomes will thus be clothed in white garments; and I will not erase his name from the book of life, and I will confess his name before My Father and before His angels.

Exod 32:32; "But now, if You will, forgive their sin—and if not, please blot me out from Your book which You have written!"
Exod 32:33; The LORD said to Moses, "Whoever has sinned against Me, I will blot him out of My book.

Did God make a mistake letting Satan in heaven? Did God make a mistake putting Adam and Eve in the Garden? Did God make a mistake picking Judas as an apostle?
Did God make a mistake creating mankind, which he destroyed 99.99% of during the flood.
Giving people a chance to be saved is never a mistake.

Luke 10:20; "Nevertheless do not rejoice in this, that the spirits are subject to you, but rejoice that your names are recorded in heaven."

John 6:66; As a result of this many of His disciples withdrew and were not walking with Him anymore.
John 6:67; So Jesus said to the twelve, "You do not want to go away also, do you?"

Ezek 28:13; "You were in Eden, the garden of God; Every precious stone was your covering: The ruby, the topaz and the diamond; The beryl, the onyx and the jasper; The lapis lazuli, the turquoise and the emerald; And the gold, the workmanship of your settings and sockets, Was in you. On the day that you were created They were prepared.
Ezek 28:14; "You were the anointed cherub who covers, And I placed you there. You were on the holy mountain of God; You walked in the midst of the stones of fire.
Ezek 28:15; "You were blameless in your ways From the day you were created Until unrighteousness was found in you.
Ezek 28:16; "By the abundance of your trade You were internally filled with violence, And you sinned; Therefore I have cast you as profane From the mountain of God. And I have destroyed you, O covering cherub, From the midst of the stones of fire.

Luke 10:18; And He said to them, "I was watching Satan fall from heaven like lightning.

Rev 20:10; And the devil who deceived them was thrown into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are also; and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.

===============================================

Rom 11:19; You will say then, "Branches were broken off so that I might be grafted in."
Rom 11:20; Quite right, they were broken off for their unbelief, but you stand by your faith. Do not be conceited, but fear;
Rom 11:21; for if God did not spare the natural branches, He will not spare you, either.
Rom 11:22; Behold then the kindness and severity of God; to those who fell, severity, but to you, God's kindness, if you continue in His kindness; otherwise you also will be cut off.

None of those verses tell us the true Christian will be blotted out of The Lamb's Book of (Eternal) Life.

Revelation tells us there are many books at the judgement.

We are sealed for the day of our redemption. Ephesians 4. Jesus tells us he will lose none of us who are in him. John 6. Because God the Father gave us into his hand and Gof will lose none of us from his hand. John 10. Because our salvation is God's work not ours. Titus 3.

Eternal life comes from God through Christ. Eternal life is of and from God who is not a man that he should lie.

You might take that list if verses copied from whatever source, and go to a Bible site and read them in proper context. Sites with Bible commentary are immensely helpful for Bible study.

 

[BunnyOnion]

Good answer..

I would offer.. Two is a metaphor that seems to establish the witness of God . . . which is Greater than the witness of man . The unseen glory of faith .(Christ in us) our Emanuel .

Books were opened . Two books were written One the book of life, all that God decided to create from the first human to the last. And another book the lambs book of eternal never ending life .

Whosoever's name was not found written in the "Lambs book of life" their names was removed from the book of life .

In the end the book of life is a blank book like it never existed .

In the new heavens and earth the old things will not be remembered or ever come to mind. There will be no names missing.


Revelation 20:15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

Revelation 21:27 And there shall in no wise enter into it any thing that defileth, neither whatsoever worketh abomination, or maketh a lie: but they which are written in the Lamb's book of life

1Peter 1: 19 But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot:

20 Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you,


Revelation 13:8

I am not Calvinist however this explanation by John MacArthur has always seemed quite succinct in matters of the Book of Life.


"Seven times in the New Testament, believers are identified as those whose names are written in the book of life (cf. 3:5; 17:8; 20:12, 15; 21:27; Phil 4:3). The book of life belonging to the Lamb, the Lord Jesus, is the registry in which God inscribed the names of those chosen for salvation before the foundation of the world. (This phrase is used as a synonym for eternity past in 17:8; Matt. 13:35; 25:34; Luke 11:50; Eph. 1:4; Heb. 9:26; 1 Pet. 1:20; cf. 2 Thess. 2:13; and 2 Tim. 1:9.) … Believers are doubly secure, because the book of life belongs to the Lamb who has been slain. Not only the decree of election, but also the atoning work of Christ seals the redemption of the elect forever.”
Source: Names Written BEFORE the Foundation of the World?

 

[BunnyOnion]

@BunnyOnion -- a lake of fire and brimstone -- image being in a bbq pit with the cover on. Hot coals all over the place in darkness. It's only meant for satan, the false prophet and the beast and to last forever. But people end up there because they don't accept God's way of staying Out of there.

God Does know who will and who won't accept Him.

Yes, he knew this before creation.
Luke 16

God predestined all things including making us fallible beings. We don't choose. God did.

 

[Sue D.]

Revelation 13:8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

Superficially Judaism, Christianity, and Islam are different. Essentially they are the same. When I say Christianity, it means Pop Christianity.

@Sue D., You are Roman Catholic Ant, while Freemasons/Knights Templar are Roman Catholic Giants.

Sorry that 'this' is way out of order.
But -- what is Pop Christianity -- Judaism, Christianity , Islam Are Very different.

 

[BunnyOnion]

Sorry that 'this' is way out of order.
But -- what is Pop Christianity -- Judaism, Christianity , Islam Are Very different.

"Pop Christianity"?
I too look forward to that answer.

 

[Elihoenai]

Suffering does not mean a person needs salvation. A lot of suffering is because a person accepts Jesus Christ as their Savior -- lots of people Die because they are not willing to give up their faith in Jesus Christ. Scripture tells us that there will be trials and tribulations in our lives Because we're living for Christ.

Jesus Christ was the Son of God -- He provided our salvation -- He didn't need it -- He's part of the trinity.

'We' / mankind Does need salvation.

Hebrews 4:15 For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin.

Do you agree that Suffering for a purpose means you are striving to obtain something? Do you agree that Yeshua/Jesus has Infirmities? If yes, does having Infirmities means that Salvation is needed?

 

[Elihoenai]

No one on this earth is perfect as the Father. God is God. Mankind is mankind.

Because of the cross -- shed blood of Jesus Christ -- God sees us as righteous -- but that does Not equate to perfect / Holy as the Father.

Matthew 5:48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

@Sue D., Are you saying that you disagree with Yeshua/Jesus about being Perfect as the Father?

 

[Elihoenai]

Sorry that 'this' is way out of order.
But -- what is Pop Christianity -- Judaism, Christianity , Islam Are Very different.

Hebrews 4:12-13

12 For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.

13 Neither is there any creature that is not manifest in his sight: but all things are naked and opened unto the eyes of him with whom we have to do.

Pop Christianity is Popular Mainstream Christianity (2.2 Billion Adherents). At their essence Pop Christianity, Judaism (Judaism of the Rabbis) and Islam are the same. What teaching do all three have in Common?

 

[Dave M]

I wonder what what Paul is concerned about being disqualified from??????


1 Corinthians 9:27
But I discipline my body and keep it under control, lest after preaching to others I myself should be disqualified.

most likely the reward that he is speaking of earlier in the chapter

1 Corinthians 9:17
For if I do this of my own will, I have a reward, but if not of my own will, I am still entrusted with a stewardship.


It does sound more like he is conerned about loosing the reward of running the race, more then loosing his salvation, he seems to be saying we can do works that just have no eternal bearing for us.

1 Corinthians 3:14-15
If the work that anyone has built on the foundation survives, he will receive a reward. If anyone's work is burned up, he will suffer loss, though he himself will be saved, but only as through fire.

 

[JerryfromMass]

I wonder what what Paul is concerned about being disqualified from??????


1 Corinthians 9:27
But I discipline my body and keep it under control, lest after preaching to others I myself should be disqualified.

most likely the reward that he is speaking of earlier in the chapter

1 Corinthians 9:17
For if I do this of my own will, I have a reward, but if not of my own will, I am still entrusted with a stewardship.


It does sound more like he is conerned about loosing the reward of running the race, more then loosing his salvation, he seems to be saying we can do works that just have no eternal bearing for us.

1 Corinthians 3:14-15
If the work that anyone has built on the foundation survives, he will receive a reward. If anyone's work is burned up, he will suffer loss, though he himself will be saved, but only as through fire.

Works done for the glory of God alone are those that survive the fire, they are precious stones, gold, and silver. Too often I see people I think are in Christ publicly boasting of all they do to help others in need (financially, physically, spiritually).

One time at service the preacher and seven others took to the podium and told the congregation all they had done to deliver gifts to children whose mom or dad was serving time in prison, all to a standing ovation from the congregation. My stomach churned. At best, this was wood hay and stubble. At worse, they have no reward in heaven for they have received their reward from men.

 

[Sue D.]

Hebrews 4:12-13

12 For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.

13 Neither is there any creature that is not manifest in his sight: but all things are naked and opened unto the eyes of him with whom we have to do.

Pop Christianity is Popular Mainstream Christianity (2.2 Billion Adherents). At their essence Pop Christianity, Judaism (Judaism of the Rabbis) and Islam are the same. What teaching do all three have in Common?

They have Nothing in common.

 

[Elihoenai]

They have Nothing in common.

1 Corinthians 12:1 Now concerning spiritual gifts, brethren, I would not have you ignorant.

@Sue D., Are you prepared to accept the possibility that you could be lacking Spiritual Gift to see their commonality?

 

[Sue D.]

@Elihoenai -- there is but one commonality between Christianity , Judaism and Islam? Abraham is the only thing they all have in common. The Abrahamic Covenant -- all the way to great and great-great grandchildren being protected by God. Abraham and Sarah's child -- by custom of that -- Ishmael through Hagar and Isaac was their own child of Promised of God.

Both Judaism and Christianity have their origins in Genesis.

The descedants of Ishmael became Muslims / settled in Mecca. Isaac in / near Jerusalem became Jews and Christians.

Abraham was a believer / follower of God.

One is God's Word // the other is the Quran.

The Quran Does contain some references to Abraham of the Old Testament because of the Abrahamic Covenant. Which can make it Seem like God's Word -- but the two are totally different.

Islam vows to take over the world -- by force if necessary. Born again believers become martyrs because they refuse to deny Christ when challenged.

If Anything -- the spiritual gift of discernment is telling me that Islam Is NOT God's Word.

And there are Many spiritual gifts given to born again believers -- they are given to help build up the local church. The gift of discernment aids in telling a person what is truly God's Word and what isn't when a person is around various other belief systems. The Holy Spirit will help us recognize faulty doctrine.

Islamic teachings were developed totally differently than God's Word.

And we have John 14:6 --Jesus Christ is tell us that "I am the way, the truth and the life, no man comes to the Father, but by Me." Jesus Christ.

And "Allah" is never once mentioned in God's Word.

 

[Elihoenai]

@Elihoenai -- there is but one commonality between Christianity , Judaism and Islam? Abraham is the only thing they all have in common. The Abrahamic Covenant -- all the way to great and great-great grandchildren being protected by God. Abraham and Sarah's child -- by custom of that -- Ishmael through Hagar and Isaac was their own child of Promised of God.

Both Judaism and Christianity have their origins in Genesis.

The descedants of Ishmael became Muslims / settled in Mecca. Isaac in / near Jerusalem became Jews and Christians.

Abraham was a believer / follower of God.

One is God's Word // the other is the Quran.

The Quran Does contain some references to Abraham of the Old Testament because of the Abrahamic Covenant. Which can make it Seem like God's Word -- but the two are totally different.

Islam vows to take over the world -- by force if necessary. Born again believers become martyrs because they refuse to deny Christ when challenged.

If Anything -- the spiritual gift of discernment is telling me that Islam Is NOT God's Word.

And there are Many spiritual gifts given to born again believers -- they are given to help build up the local church. The gift of discernment aids in telling a person what is truly God's Word and what isn't when a person is around various other belief systems. The Holy Spirit will help us recognize faulty doctrine.

Islamic teachings were developed totally differently than God's Word.

And we have John 14:6 --Jesus Christ is tell us that "I am the way, the truth and the life, no man comes to the Father, but by Me." Jesus Christ.

And "Allah" is never once mentioned in God's Word.

Are you able to describe the Essence of Pop Christianity, Judaism and Islam?

 

[Sue D.]

I was just Googling that - - the Essence Of -- is building bridges between Jews, Muslims, Christians and others.

The only 'bridge' is a persons acknowledging Jesus Christ as being the Son of God and accepting the salvation made possible through the shed blood of Jesus Christ on the cross of calvary -- and That allows a person to have a personal relationship with God. That is what He wants. His desire is for all to come to the saving knowledge of the Lord Jesus Christ. The cross is the bridge between 'us' and God. The cross that Jesus Christ died on -- was taken down from and buried and then rose again bodily on the 3rd day.

From what you've shared 'here' as well as on 'conversations' -- not sure What you actually believe. You brought up the Free Masonry which in and of itself is good. It's character building. Very organized -- but apparently leaves God / Bible out of the equation. And then you brought up the Satanic Freemason/ Knights Templar Vatican Soldiers. That's quite a combination.

The Vatican is the 'home' of the RCC which is very non-Biblical in their beliefs.

And apparently -- to you -- Islam isn't really all that bad.

People Do come from all backgrounds / beliefs to accept Jesus Christ as their personal Savior. But not all roads / beliefs are okay For salvation.

John 14:6 Jesus Christ is telling us that "I am the way , the truth, and the life, no man comes to the Father but by/ through Me." That is Jesus Christ.

A person can spend their life doing all kind of good, humanitarian works and still end up in hell for ever.

And a born again believer will Want to do good things For God. But it's not to attain or sustain a person's salvation.

And it's Also true -- people Should see Christ in our lives. Our lives Should exhibit at least Some of the fruit Of the indwelling of the Holy Spirit in our lives. The 'love, joy, peace, long-suffering, gentleness, goodness, etc. in our lives -- if those are Not in our lives , Then 'we' need to show concern for that person. Share your concern in a loving way. People Do need loving, concerned people in their lives.

 

[Elihoenai]

I was just Googling that - - the Essence Of -- is building bridges between Jews, Muslims, Christians and others.

The only 'bridge' is a persons acknowledging Jesus Christ as being the Son of God and accepting the salvation made possible through the shed blood of Jesus Christ on the cross of calvary -- and That allows a person to have a personal relationship with God. That is what He wants. His desire is for all to come to the saving knowledge of the Lord Jesus Christ. The cross is the bridge between 'us' and God. The cross that Jesus Christ died on -- was taken down from and buried and then rose again bodily on the 3rd day.

From what you've shared 'here' as well as on 'conversations' -- not sure What you actually believe. You brought up the Free Masonry which in and of itself is good. It's character building. Very organized -- but apparently leaves God / Bible out of the equation. And then you brought up the Satanic Freemason/ Knights Templar Vatican Soldiers. That's quite a combination.

The Vatican is the 'home' of the RCC which is very non-Biblical in their beliefs.

And apparently -- to you -- Islam isn't really all that bad.

People Do come from all backgrounds / beliefs to accept Jesus Christ as their personal Savior. But not all roads / beliefs are okay For salvation.

John 14:6 Jesus Christ is telling us that "I am the way , the truth, and the life, no man comes to the Father but by/ through Me." That is Jesus Christ.

A person can spend their life doing all kind of good, humanitarian works and still end up in hell for ever.

And a born again believer will Want to do good things For God. But it's not to attain or sustain a person's salvation.

And it's Also true -- people Should see Christ in our lives. Our lives Should exhibit at least Some of the fruit Of the indwelling of the Holy Spirit in our lives. The 'love, joy, peace, long-suffering, gentleness, goodness, etc. in our lives -- if those are Not in our lives , Then 'we' need to show concern for that person. Share your concern in a loving way. People Do need loving, concerned people in their lives.

Matthew 19:17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.

Did you know that the Devil/Satan pretends to be Yeshua Messiah/Jesus Christ?

When I use the term "Essence" I mean the underlying Nature of something. Do you think Pop Christianity is Real Christianity? What is the Nature of the Jewish Talmud (Rabbinic Judaism)? What is the Nature of Islam as described by the Hadiths?

Do you believe everything you read? The Freemasons/Knights Templars tell you what they want you to hear and they totally control global media.

The Freemasons/Knights Templars have confused you. You cannot do any good without God/Elohim. Everything else is a Satanic lie to conceal unspeakable Evil.

Did you know that the Knights Templar changed their name to Freemason? The Freemasons are Knights Templars and that's why I write Freemason/Knights Templar. The Knights Templar are soldiers of the Vatican. You must know the history of the Roman Catholic Church Crusades and Inquisitions undertaken by their Knights Templar Soldiers.

I forgot to inform you in conversation, "Free Masonry" that you are using should be one word "Freemasonry".

 

[Waggles]

The Freemasons/Knights Templars have confused you. You cannot do any good without God/Elohim. Everything else is a Satanic lie to conceal unspeakable Evil.

So what is the alternative? What is the true church of God?

 

[Sue D.]

@Elihoenai -- I don't plan to be back in 'conversation' area.

 

[Elihoenai]

So what is the alternative? What is the true church of God?

Revelation 13:8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

Matthew 16:18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.


That's a great and all-important question. Elohim/God has given the Roman Catholic Church Dominion and Power over all that dwell on the Earth. The Power of the deception is so great that, apparently, hundreds of millions of RCC members don't even know they are members and call themselves Protestant.

The Alternative and the True Church of Elohim/God:

The True Church of Elohim/God is the one that the Gates of Hell has not prevailed against. Do you know of such a Church?