What is hell?

[PloughBoy]

That's hyper calvinism you are preaching and it denies the Grace of God.

Calvin was a heretic, who created a theology that eliminates free will.

Let me show you what happens with you eliminate free will, and teach "predestined to be saved", that is Calvin's invention that came out of his demonic mind, instead of "pre destined to be conformed"...

Now, people that went to hell today, did so because they died a Christ Rejector. = never born again.
So, God holds them ACCOUNTABLE for never trusting in Christ. = Died and went to hell.
Now, how can God be good, true, perfect, if God causes you not to believe in Jesus, and then sends you to hell for not believing in Jesus.

See that INSANITY Theology?

That is JOHN CALVIN, insanity, and many are afflicted with it, and are as crazy as he is.... as his theology will make you a Denier of God's Grace, and REBEL against "the Gospel of Grace" and "the Gift of Salvation" .


John Calvin's theology, will warp your mind, as his was warped.

Oh i did not know you was than OLD that you knew him! Because i know you would not talk about a man that you didn't know, You ain't that big of a FOOL!
You would not dare spread "gossip and lies"! about a man.

"These six things doth the LORD hate: yea, seven ARE AN ABOMINATION UNTO him:
A proud look, a lying tongue, and hands that shed innocent blood,
An heart that deviseth wicked imaginations, feet that be swift in running to mischief,
A false witness that speaketh lies, and he that soweth discord among brethren."

John Calvin is my brother in Christ and I am Offended by your words the Blasphemy you speak about him, and I make this protest about your words be recorded in The Halls of JUSTICE in HEAVEN COURTS! as A witness against you very words . And on that day when your words will be presented Before The JUDGMENT seat of CHRIST or The THRONE of The LIVING GOD! For there I will STAND! Even if I have to Stand by myself!

And that is all I have to say about that, i will see you in the JUDGMENT be sure of that.

And Jesus does not lie!

New American Standard Bible
"But I tell you that for every careless word that people speak, they will give an account of it on the day of judgment."

 

[B-A-C]

Calvin was a heretic,

True enough.

TULIP - Calvinism Explained in Five Simple Points

The five points of Calvinism can be explained using the acronym TULIP. Understand the set of religious principles behind John Calvin's theology.

www.learnreligions.com

Of course Calvinists believe in OSAS,

 

[Bethel]

No that is written I've come to call the sinners not the righteous
Are you one of the false grace spreading peep like it is written that we are for warned about? I know them temples many go to preach that false grace I've witnessed it for myself
TWISTIE

Are you talking about Paul's Gospel of the Grace of God that Paul refers to as "my Gospel" 3x?

"all that call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved"

Jesus said....>"all that believe in me, i give unto you eternal life, and you shall never perish".


Are you talking about that Gospel, TWISTIE ?

 

[Bethel]

John Calvin is my brother in Christ

John Calvin is a dead heretic who died in 1564.
He was part of a group of self righteous heretics who had at least one person burned at the stake because they didn't agree with this group's Theology.
If you lived during that time and didnt agree with them, they would have burned you, fella.
Do you understand this?
Am i making contact with you so that you understand what im saying?

Listen..

Calvin will rot your mind with His theology. He'll ruin your understanding of the Cross of Christ.
He will have you believing that all the bad in the world that the DEVIL causes, is God's "pre ordained to happen", as if GOD causes rape, incest, child molesting, murder, sex slavery, prostitution, communism, dictatorships, hatred, bigotry.

Calvin's insane theology will cause you to lose the ability to think rationally about the word of God, or discern it ever again.
He will twist your mind.
You'll end up saying...>"Yes im a Calvinist", instead of saying Yes, im a CHRISTIAN.

Do you understand?

Calvin teaches that God does not allow some to be saved. That they are born to burn in the lake of fire., simply because they are BORN...... and GOD causes this to happen to them.
Thats insane. Its a demonic LIE., Yet that is what this insane heretic J. Calvin teaches.

Listen, God would be a psychopath if He caused you to not trust in Christ... and then blamed you for this and sent you to hell for being a Christ rejector.
Can you understand how CRAZY that is ? But that is exactly what John Calvin TEACHES, and he will infect you and warp your mind with his CRAZY theology, and you'll believe it and teach it...

 

[Twistie]

Are you talking about Paul's Gospel of the Grace of God that Paul refers to as "my Gospel" 3x?

"all that call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved"

Jesus said....>"all that believe in me, i give unto you eternal life, and you shall never perish".


Are you talking about that Gospel, TWISTIE ?

No I'm talking about the false grace preaching many r following

Do u prevert His grace do you yell people no need to repent do u tell people ya ya can rape n murder n hurt n no worrie you got grace? Are you one of those who widen the road for the blind r you? R you Bethel you whom we r warned not to go to

do not seek Bethel, do not go to Gilgal, do not journey to Beersheba. For Gilgal will surely go into exile, and Bethel will be reduced to nothing. " Seek the LORD and live, or he will sweep through the house of Joseph like a fire; it will devour, and Bethel will have no one to quench it.


Twistie

 

[PloughBoy]

John Calvin is a dead heretic who died in 1564.
He was part of a group of self righteous heretics who had at least one person burned at the stake because they didn't agree with this group's Theology.
If you lived during that time and didnt agree with them, they would have burned you, fella.
Do you understand this?
Am i making contact with you so that you understand what im saying?

Listen..

Calvin will rot your mind with His theology. He'll ruin your understanding of the Cross of Christ.
He will have you believing that all the bad in the world that the DEVIL causes, is God's "pre ordained to happen", as if GOD causes rape, incest, child molesting, murder, sex slavery, prostitution, communism, dictatorships, hatred, bigotry.

Calvin's insane theology will cause you to lose the ability to think rationally about the word of God, or discern it ever again.
He will twist your mind.
You'll end up saying...>"Yes im a Calvinist", instead of saying Yes, im a CHRISTIAN.

Do you understand?

Calvin teaches that God does not allow some to be saved. That they are born to burn in the lake of fire., simply because they are BORN...... and GOD causes this to happen to them.
Thats insane. Its a demonic LIE., Yet that is what this insane heretic J. Calvin teaches.

Listen, God would be a psychopath if He caused you to not trust in Christ... and then blamed you for this and sent you to hell for being a Christ rejector.
Can you understand how CRAZY that is ? But that is exactly what John Calvin TEACHES, and he will infect you and warp your mind with his CRAZY theology, and you'll believe it and teach it...

Sorry you ain't qualified to address anything about John Calvin to me You ain't GOD and stop acting you are! You ain't nothing but a mortal man and you sure is not a "GOD"

and i am in agreement! with the Pslams at this point:
NASB 1977
May it never be! Rather, let God be found true, though every man be found a liar, as it is written, “THAT THOU MIGHTEST BE JUSTIFIED IN THY WORDS, AND MIGHTEST PREVAIL WHEN THOU ART JUDGED.”

I am not a fool, you are a man, corrupted to the core! And men love darkness rather than LIGHT" Like you are some Holy than thou! Please find a hole!

I am not the one. find a toy. It is getting to late in the day, for all of these "Want to BEES" acting like GOD sent them to replace JESUS and the PARAKLETOS! I am not the one!
Kemosabe

 

[Twistie]

No I'm talking about the false grace preaching many r following

Do u prevert His grace do you yell people no need to repent do u tell people ya ya can rape n murder n hurt n no worrie you got grace? Are you one of those who widen the road for the blind r you?

Sorry you ain't qualified to address anything about John Calvin to me You ain't GOD and stop acting you are! You ain't nothing but a mortal man and you sure is not a "GOD"

and i am in agreement! with the Pslams at this point:
NASB 1977
May it never be! Rather, let God be found true, though every man be found a liar, as it is written, “THAT THOU MIGHTEST BE JUSTIFIED IN THY WORDS, AND MIGHTEST PREVAIL WHEN THOU ART JUDGED.”

I am not a fool, you are a man, corrupted to the core! And men love darkness rather than LIGHT" Like you are some Holy than thou! Please find a hole!

I am not the one. find a toy. It is getting to late in the day, for all of these "Want to BEES" acting like GOD sent them to replace JESUS and the PARAKLETOS! I am not the one!
Kemosabe

Amen plough!

Hey plough this one thinks they know as much as YH just like eve wanted to b
Difference is eve was ignorant to evil at the time

Woooweee

I can't take these man taught people drive me batty

It's sad but they surely wear my patients thin another reason I stay away I'm learning to keep control over myself not allow other to affect me in no way

The sadness they cause is more then enough

Imma go pray for His children

Hope all is well plough!

Twistie

 

[Bethel]

No I'm talking about the false grace preaching many r following

Do u prevert His grace do you yell people no need to repent do u tell people ya ya can rape n murder n hurt n no worrie you got grace? Are you one of those who widen the road for the blind r you? R you Bethel you whom we r warned not to go to

Twistie

No one teaches that grace is a license to sin.
This is not actually taught. But there are heretics, who say........."there are those who teach, license to sin", yet, no one teaches this..
And if you ask these LIARS.........where is the youtube video, or the commentary, or the preacher, who is teaching that you can live like the devil because you are "under Grace"...these liars can't produce a video, or a commentary or a preacher or teacher who teaches what they say is "OSAS"... "license to sin".

So, TWISTLE, if you meet one of these liars who says this is being taught, be sure you let them know they are LYING and its a sin to lie....and they need to REPENT of their LYING.

 

[Twistie]

No one teaches that grace is a license to sin.
This is not actually taught. But there are heretics, who say........."there are those who teach, license to sin", yet, no one teaches this..
And if you ask these LIARS.........where is the youtube video, or the commentary, or the preacher, who is teaching that you can live like the devil because you are "under Grace"...these liars can't produce a video, or a commentary or a preacher or teacher who teaches what they say is "OSAS"... "license to sin".

So, TWISTLE, if you meet one of these liars who says this is being taught, be sure you let them know they are LYING and its a sin to lie.

No one lol I can see you must live a blind life

Very sad you need to spend time with YH n stop speaking things u know nothing about then.

Twistie

 

[PloughBoy]

No one lol I can see you must live a blind life

Very sad you need to spend time with YH n stop speaking things u know nothing about then.

Twistie

Twiste, i would leave this thread, they are not preaching or edifying "Jesus Christ" in no way what so ever, if they are not Edifying "Christ" and promoting His "Holiness and Sanctification" what then? And got the nerve to condemn John Calvin the man, and perceive him and label him as if he was a devil. There are greener pastures that is honoring your LORD. because you cannot honor him here. but only be involved in that which is displeasing to Your "LORD" he would not like you to keep company in this company at this time. This place here is for "WARRIORS" when it is time to move, and not be in a place, where Angels fear to tread.

Your brother in Christ, PloughBoy.

 

[Twistie]

Twiste, i would leave this thread, they are not preaching or edifying "Jesus Christ" in no way what so ever, if they are not Edifying "Christ" and promoting His "Holiness and Sanctification" what then? And got the nerve to condemn John Calvin the man, and perceive him and label him as if he was a devil. There are greener pastures that is honoring your LORD. because you cannot honor him here. but only be involved in that which is displeasing to Your "LORD" he would not like you to keep company in this company at this time. This place here is for "WARRIORS" when it is time to move, and not be in a place, where Angels fear to tread.

Your brother in Christ, PloughBoy.

Yea I agree ttyl Plough!

 

[Butch5]

I have learend that opposition to the concept of eternal torment, which leads to the disbelief in the existence of hell, is usually based on a quid pro quo or tit for tat mentality, that eternal punishment is unfair for limited life of sin. The catholic doctrine of purgatory is more acceptable because it's more compatible with this worldly mentality, that once a sinner completes his sentence in this purgatory prison, he can go free, but that's not biblical.

Neither is eternal torment.

The punishment in the Lake of Fire is eternal because God is eternal, and sin offends God, it cannot be tolerated in the presence of God. All who end up in there are worshipers of the Beast, so they have pledged allegiance to the Beast even though they might believe that it's the messiah, just like the Israelites worshipping the golden calf as Elohim that delivered them from Egypt. Therefore, they get to unite with the idol(s) they worship for eternity, meanwhile saints get to unite with God in New Jerusalem for eternity.

That's a logical fallacy. It's a non-sequitur, it doesn't follow. Just because God is eternal doesn't mean the punishment is.

So it begs the question, what is the motivation behind your denial of eternal fire? Is it because the Scripture really states otherwise? Or because it's hard to accept? You know when Yeshua preached about partaking his blood and his body, it was highly offensive and many of his followers went away, not because they didn't understand his words, but they understood it perfectly well and it OFFENDED them.

It's Scripture. It's because the Scriptures tell us that man is a flesh being, not a ghost. It's because the Bible says the wages of sin is death, not eternal torment. It's because, aionios is wrongly translated. It's because God doesn't promise eternal life to the wicked. It's because the Scriptures tell us that the wicked will perish. It's the Scriptures.

Years of study won't help in this, because oftentimes research is me-search, information is affirmation, the abundance of knowledge only strengthens what you already believe instead of changing it.

That's where you'd be wrong. I used to hold the typical view of hell, that it was a place of eternal torment. It was studying the Scriptures that showed me that that teaching was wrong.

Your post is interesting though in another aspect. I've been contemplating starting a thread titled, "Why don't Christians Believe the Bible"? Your post here contains the very reason why. I posted the entirety of Psalm 37. It's a Psalm that contrasts the fate of the righteous with the fate of the wicked. It repeatedly tells us that the righteous will inherit the land and the wicked will be, cut off, perish, vanish away, not be found anymore, wither away, etc. You didn't address that at all. Instead, you merely asserted that the punishment is eternal torment. That leads me to wonder, do people really believe the Bible? if so, how is it that one can ignore all of Psalm 37 and then assert that the punishment is eternal torment? As I said, the argument that the punishment is eternal because God is eternal is a logical fallacy. So, how is it that one can ignore the entire Psalm?

 

[Butch5]

It's still separation they have nothing Good from YH neva eva again

Where do we find that definition in the Bible?

 

[Jonathan_Gale]

It's Scripture. It's because the Scriptures tell us that man is a flesh being, not a ghost. It's because the Bible says the wages of sin is death, not eternal torment. It's because, aionios is wrongly translated. It's because God doesn't promise eternal life to the wicked. It's because the Scriptures tell us that the wicked will perish. It's the Scriptures.

Scripture states SECOND DEATH, Rev. 20:14, and FIRST RESURRECTION, Rev. 20:5. There's no second resurrection from the Lake of Fire. This is where the concept of eternal torment is based on, what's wrong about it is the confusion over the word "hell".

 

[Butch5]

Scripture states SECOND DEATH, Rev. 20:14, and FIRST RESURRECTION, Rev. 20:5. There's no second resurrection from the Lake of Fire. This is where the concept of eternal torment is based on, what's wrong about it is the confusion over the word "hell".

It's actually based on the pagan concept of an immortal soul. The only way someone could suffer eternally is if they lived eternally. There is no such promise for the wicked, thus they cannot suffer eternally.

 

[Jonathan_Gale]

It's actually based on the pagan concept of an immortal soul. The only way someone could suffer eternally is if they lived eternally. There is no such promise for the wicked, thus they cannot suffer eternally.

No, it's based on Rev. 20, and you're denying it. If it's not eternal, show me where's the saving grace for those end up in the Lake of Fire as their names are not found in the Book of Life. The truth is, there's none, only the white throne judgement. If you believe in the bible, why ignoring Rev. 20?

 

[Jonathan_Gale]

I tell you, in that night there shall be two men in one bed; the one shall be taken, and the other shall be left.

And the LORD shall utter his voice before his army: for his camp is very great: for he is strong that executeth his word: for the day of the LORD is great and very terrible; and who can abide it?”

I tell you, ma'am, read the context. The Olivet Discourse is mostly about the siege of Jerusalem in 70AD. Disciples specifically asked when will this catastrophic event happen that will not leave even one stone upon another, and the Lord gave them the answer.

 

[Butch5]

No, it's based on Rev. 20, and you're denying it. If it's not eternal, show me where's the saving grace for those end up in the Lake of Fire as their names are not found in the Book of Life. The truth is, there's none, only the white throne judgement. If you believe in the bible, why ignoring Rev. 20?

Yes, it is based on the immortal soul doctrine. If people don't live forever, they can't suffer forever. That's just plain logical. The Lake of Fire , aka, Gehenna, is not eternal either. Jeremiah prophesied that it would one day be made holy to the Lord.

 

[Jonathan_Gale]

Yes, it is based on the immortal soul doctrine. If people don't live forever, they can't suffer forever. That's just plain logical. The Lake of Fire , aka, Gehenna, is not eternal either. Jeremiah prophesied that it would one day be made holy to the Lord.

You're just promoting unbiblical teaching of annihilationism based on your misunderstanding of Psalm 37. At the end, he who is filthy will be filthy still, he who is righteous will be righteous still, (Rev. 22:11) there's no returning back anymore at that point, which is the same as eternity. What Jeremiah prophesied was about God's redemption of Israel through Yeshua and the New Covenant.

 

[Butch5]

You're just promoting unbiblical teaching of annihilationism based on your misunderstanding of Psalm 37. At the end, he who is filthy will be filthy still, he who is righteous will be righteous still, (Rev. 22:11) there's no returning back anymore at that point, which is the same as eternity. What Jeremiah prophesied was about God's redemption of Israel through Yeshua and the New Covenant.

What's unbiblical is eternal torment. Please explain how I'm misunderstanding Psalm 37.


18 The LORD knoweth the days of the upright:
And their inheritance shall be for ever.
19 They shall not be ashamed in the evil time:
And in the days of famine they shall be satisfied.

20 But the wicked shall perish,


The Holy Bible: King James Version, Electronic Edition of the 1900 Authorized Version. (Bellingham, WA: Logos Research Systems, Inc., 2009), Ps 37:18–20.

Please explain to me how I'm misunderstanding, "But the wicked shall perish". What other way can it be understood than the wicked shall perish?

Or, we have John's words.

16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

The Holy Bible: King James Version, Electronic Edition of the 1900 Authorized Version. (Bellingham, WA: Logos Research Systems, Inc., 2009), Jn 3:16.

How else can we understand, "should not perish"? Notice John's words. He didn't say that God sent His Son so that those who believe would not suffer eternal torment. Again, just like Psalm 37, the contrast is belief or perish.