What is the difference between the Rapture and the Second Coming?

[Listening]

The rapture is the second coming
So i do not see the problem
Anyone who teaches they are two different things speaks to the world
Not to the church who know the truth.

First the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and then is our gathering together unto him; in that order.

The Man of Sin

1Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him, 2That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand. 3Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition; 4Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God. 5Remember ye not, that, when I was yet with you, I told you these things? 6And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time. 7For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way. 8And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming: 9Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders, 10And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved. 11And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: 12That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

Stand Firm

13But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth: 14Whereunto he called you by our gospel, to the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ. 15Therefore, brethren, stand fast, and hold the traditions which ye have been taught, whether by word, or our epistle.

16Now our Lord Jesus Christ himself, and God, even our Father, which hath loved us, and hath given us everlasting consolation and good hope through grace, 17Comfort your hearts, and stablish you in every good word and work.

 

[Bendito]

St John 6:40 And this is the will
of him that sent me, that EVERY ONE which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the LAST Day
John 6:44 No man can come to me, except the Farther which has sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the LAST DAY

Wow! Dig into this verse! He will raise us up, 'as kings and priests' on that last day!

 

[Bendito]

Matthew 13:24-30
24-- Another parable put he forth unto them, saying , The kingdom of heaven is likened unto a man which sowed good seed in his field
25-- But while men slept , his enemy came and sowed tares among the wheat, and went his way.
26-- But when the blade was sprung up, and brought forth fruit, then appeared the tares also.
27-- So the servants of the house-
holder came and said unto him, Sir, didst not thou sow good seed in thy field? from whence then hath it tares?
28-- He said unto them, An enemy hath done this. The servants said unto him, Wilt thou then that we go and gather them up?
29-- But he said, Nay; lest while ye gather up the tares, ye root up also the wheat with them.
30-- Let both grow together UNTIL
THE HARVEST: and in the time of the harvest I will say to the reapers, Gather ye together first the tares,and bund them in bundles to burn them: but gather the wheat into my barn.

Not sure Jesus would be pleased,
with many servants, trying to gather the wheat , before the
harvest, with a pre-trip rapture
He did say let them grow together till the harvest.

Could you please explain to an old man just what these verses have to do with the rapture? It sounds more like judgment.

 

[Listening]

Wow! Dig into this verse! He will raise us up, 'as kings and priests' on that last day!

Yes but why would there be need of priests then?
No more sin or death
Redemption of the bodies
The church in their bodies given glorified bodies
Why would you need Priests?
Jesus is our great high Priest for ever.
And there is the Priest hood of all believers.
But there is only one supreme high priest of the Universal which means heaven and earth church
And that is jesus.

 

[Listening]

Could you please explain to an old man just what these verses have to do with the rapture? It sounds more like judgment.

Why in this order?
Christ's second coming And then our gathering together unto him?
Why not rapture first then the coming of the Lord?
And why will that day And the gathering not happen until the Man of sin is revealed and then that coming of the Lord occurs ? When the gathering can occur as is stated quite clearly.

1Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering togetherunto him, 2

 

[Bendito]

The doctrine that all Old Covenant Israel will be saved some time in the future based upon their physical bloodline from Abraham, because Christ was unable to save all of Old Covenant Israel he came to save (Matthew 15: 24) the first time, and that God now has two, not one, group, does more damage to the Gospel than does the teaching of the pre-trib rapture. The pre-trib rapture is based upon a tradition of men, the word of man also, and not of God, but it does somewhat less damage to the Gospel. You see, saying that Christ did not fulfill his mission to save Old Covenant Israel is a kind of blasphemy against Christ. And saying that Old Covenant Israel now remains a people of God, and still the chosen people, fundamentally questions, compromises and reduces the remaking of Old Covenant Israel and the transition from the Old Covenant to the New Covenant (See Hebrews chapters 7, 8, 9 and especially 10 and 10: 9).

I understand what you are saying here, but you are wrong. Nothing will damage the gospel. NOTHING. It only damages the understanding on the part of some people. Its necessary to get into the Word for yourself and not to cruise the internet for the opinions of other people. The Word will back up the Word. Opinions are nothing but opinions and they vary from minute to minute as the wind shifts.

 

[Bendito]

Yes but why would there be need of priests then?
No more sin or death
Redemption of the bodies
The church in their bodies given glorified bodies
Why would you need Priests?
Jesus is our great high Priest for ever.
And there is the Priest hood of all believers.
But there is only one supreme high priest of the Universal which means heaven and earth church
And that is jesus.

You know from the Word that we are to rule with Him...Kings rule, priests minister....What and who will we be ruling? Dig for the answer. Its there and it's utterly fascinating!

 

[Listening]

Rule the nations and judge angels?

 

[Bendito]

Rule the nations and judge angels?

Interesting you should use this phrase 'rule the nations' That's for the man child. Who is that? Do you know?

But yes That is why the bride will be raised up as kings and priests.. The bride.

 

[Ceptor]

For anyone here still awaiting the pre-trib. You are living in the tribulation right now. The pope just recently stated plainly that Jesus dying on the cross was a failure. I believe the verbatim was "... the failure of the cross."

There are a host of numerous indicators. The worldwide agreement by nations of their desire for a one world currency. The leaders of nations that are at odds with each other, yet meeting and making agreements together. ( "Tense" peace ) The United States having troops in at least 1/3 of the worlds countries fighting over, of all things, natural resources. The recent "order" by the pope to catholics in Europe to "take in" muslims that are refugees. ( I agree with helping the least of these, but the pope is well known to praise the religion of islam. ) The refugees flooding Europe in itself is a testimony to the evil this world has come to, they are fleeing from just one of the horrid wars going on as I write this. The fighting over the holy land in Israel. The singular mission statement by Iran that they will not stop until Israel is wiped off the map. This is just a very select few signs.

My name is Daniel, so I have a preference in the Bible. In Daniel one of the most profound prohetic phrases describing the times in Revelation/Tribulation is "they shall think to change times and laws." (paraphrased) Right now in america there is a law passed to ENFORCE gay marriage. There are so many things that show we live in the Tribulation that I'd have to get my paperwork and sit down to write an article. (Which I will have many soon as I'm working on a website.)

To anyone who thinks Jesus is coming to get you before the tribulation, I ask you where the church that is described to be IN the tribulation to be tested by fire comes from? lol Not in an ugly manner I write this, but on a serious note. I don't want anyone to actually think "we'll be gone before anything bad happens" when your Christian brothers and sisters are being murdered worldwide ---for their faith---, the United Nations is starting a program called "Agenda 21" (google it) and to top it all off there are more wars, natural disasters and earthquakes going on in the past year alone to establish the fact.

I never like taking away the dream some still hold on to concerning this topic. But the truth is always hard to swallow in this world. And the Tribulation is no exception. As a matter of fact, it sets the standard for hard to swallow truth.

For arguments sake, as a general note: Everything the Bible teaches is substantiated from front to back, cover to cover. I have yet to find a subject God speaks on that isn't well documented all over the Holy Bible inside and out with plenty and plenty of references and point of views to validate what He ACTUALLY says and means. I believe this is for a reason. And the pre-tribulation idea has never been substantiated but with a select few verses that are vague in themselves at best.

Do I wish the pre-trib was the reality? Absolutely! But you have to wake up and realize what God is doing. We aren't here to live Heaven on earth, nor to be saved from the duties we have in the flesh before the waters begin to rise. We are here to accept God's will and bear our cross following in Jesus footsteps. That is to deny ourselves and to follow His will. Bearing the cross is doing His will. Preaching the Gospel to the poor and needy. Not waiting to be sucked from earth in the nick of time so we don't have to bear a cross and suffer the persecution that Jesus said we will suffer. The persecution that our brothers and sisters in Christ are suffering right now.

If you are waiting for Jesus, you may see Him coming soon. But it's not going to be a "pre-trib" rapture. He will be coming to end the evil and blasphemy, because we are living IN the book of revelation. You are living in prophecy right now.

 

[Listening]

Interesting you should use this phrase 'rule the nations' That's for the man child. Who is that? Do you know?

But yes That is why the bride will be raised up as kings and priests.. The bride.

You should read the book of revelations the letter to the churches about overcoming.

 

[Bendito]

You should read the book of revelations the letter to the churches about overcoming.

Explain.....

 

[Listening]

Explain.....

Message to the Church in Thyatira

(Acts 16:11-15)



18And unto the angel of the church in Thyatira write; These things saith the Son of God, who hath his eyes like unto a flame of fire, and his feet are like fine brass;

19I know thy works, and charity, and service, and faith, and thy patience, and thy works; and the last to be more than the first. 20Notwithstanding I have a few things against thee, because thou sufferest that woman Jezebel, which calleth herself a prophetess, to teach and to seduce my servants to commit fornication, and to eat things sacrificed unto idols. 21And I gave her space to repent of her fornication; and she repented not. 22Behold, I will cast her into a bed, and them that commit adultery with her into great tribulation, except they repent of their deeds. 23And I will kill her children with death; and all the churches shall know that I am he which searcheth the reins and hearts: and I will give unto every one of you according to your works. 24But unto you I say, and unto the rest in Thyatira, as many as have not this doctrine, and which have not known the depths of Satan, as they speak; I will put upon you none other burden. 25But that which ye have already hold fast till I come. 26And he that overcometh, and keepeth my works unto the end, to him will I give power over the nations: 27And he shall rule them with a rod of iron; as the vessels of a potter shall they be broken to shivers: even as I received of my Father. 28And I will give him the morning star. 29He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches.

 

[Bendito]

Message to the Church in Thyatira

(Acts 16:11-15)



18And unto the angel of the church in Thyatira write; These things saith the Son of God, who hath his eyes like unto a flame of fire, and his feet are like fine brass;

19I know thy works, and charity, and service, and faith, and thy patience, and thy works; and the last to be more than the first. 20Notwithstanding I have a few things against thee, because thou sufferest that woman Jezebel, which calleth herself a prophetess, to teach and to seduce my servants to commit fornication, and to eat things sacrificed unto idols. 21And I gave her space to repent of her fornication; and she repented not. 22Behold, I will cast her into a bed, and them that commit adultery with her into great tribulation, except they repent of their deeds. 23And I will kill her children with death; and all the churches shall know that I am he which searcheth the reins and hearts: and I will give unto every one of you according to your works. 24But unto you I say, and unto the rest in Thyatira, as many as have not this doctrine, and which have not known the depths of Satan, as they speak; I will put upon you none other burden. 25But that which ye have already hold fast till I come. 26And he that overcometh, and keepeth my works unto the end, to him will I give power over the nations: 27And he shall rule them with a rod of iron; as the vessels of a potter shall they be broken to shivers: even as I received of my Father. 28And I will give him the morning star. 29He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches.

Ok This is good Word. Now my friend....Make your point. Please

 

[Listening]

You were unaware it said those who overcome shall rule the nations

 

[Bendito]

You were unaware it said those who overcome shall rule the nations

LoL. I was aware. Those that overcome are part of the bride who rules with Jesus

 

[Listening]

You were unaware it said those who overcome shall rule the nations

LoL. I was aware. Those that overcome are part of the bride who rules with Jesus

Oh good.

 

[Bendito]

You were unaware it said those who overcome shall rule the nations


Oh good.

Oh Yes....In case you didn't know? The word nation comes out a Goyim in Hebrew. Unbelievers if you will. He will rule those that disbelieve with a rod of iron. and He brings them into judgment

 

[Listening]

Oh Yes....In case you didn't know? The word nation comes out a Goyim in Hebrew. Unbelievers if you will. He will rule those that disbelieve with a rod of iron. and He brings them into judgment

Funny you should say that i just posted on the morning star of the reformation
Who did just that, ruled over the gentiles and brought them to judgement
Popes being the gentiles... john Wycliffe

 

[Listening]

Why in this order?
Christ's second coming And then our gathering together unto him?
Why not rapture first then the coming of the Lord?
And why will that day And the gathering not happen until the Man of sin is revealed and then that coming of the Lord occurs ? When the gathering can occur as is stated quite clearly.

1Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering togetherunto him, 2

You still have not answered my question above