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Why do i not attend church?

:eek:

Ya need to ponder with YH

The Truth will always b the truth no matter how many believe a lie

Ponder with YH stop asking man He truly does speak to His children
Information is NOT transformation. Knowing the truth that God created male and female in his image is one thing, standing your ground and willing to lose your job, partner, reputation, even freedom for this truth is another matter.
 
Sure they met in homes, and catacombs, and on roadsides, seasides, and mountainsides….but Jesus also taught in the temple.
Paul, Barnabas, Timothy and others also taught in synagogues. The Apostle Paul also established at least 14 different ORGANIZED churches that he gave explicit instructions to in regards to organization and order.

You would deny this?
You may want to read my answer again
 
Sure they met in homes, and catacombs, and on roadsides, seasides, and mountainsides….but Jesus also taught in the temple.
Paul, Barnabas, Timothy and others also taught in synagogues. The Apostle Paul also established at least 14 different ORGANIZED churches that he gave explicit instructions to in regards to organization and order.

You would deny this?
Synagogue/church is where you naturally would go if you seek an audience that's familiar with your message and most likely to receive it. However, if this supposedly ideal audience is found unworthy, if they react with excuse and disrespect like the parable of the king's banquet, then what other options do you have? Probably the same thing the king did - also in the parable of the king's banquet. And there you have it.
 
Information is NOT transformation. Knowing the truth that God created male and female in his image is one thing, standing your ground and willing to lose your job, partner, reputation, even freedom for this truth is another matter.
Everything I have lost is dung as it is written I too feel the same I've lost those I held the closest to my heart... Will they Eva come back my way idk if it is in YHs will of not well I have made peace with that too...

At this point in my life I just watch what states I go in for I have lost my freedom in sum states but that's all part of my walk...

Twistie :broken_heart:
 
Eccles 4:9 Two are better than one, because they have a good reward for their toil.
10 For if they fall, one will lift up his fellow. But woe to him who is alone when he falls and has not another to lift him up!
11 Again, if two lie together, they keep warm, but how can one keep warm alone?
12 And though a man might prevail against one who is alone, two will withstand him—a threefold cord is not quickly broken.
 
Synagogue/church is where you naturally would go if you seek an audience that's familiar with your message and most likely to receive it. However, if this supposedly ideal audience is found unworthy, if they react with excuse and disrespect like the parable of the king's banquet, then what other options do you have? Probably the same thing the king did - also in the parable of the king's banquet. And there you have it.
Was the parable of the King's banquet about attending church in a building? Or was it about about accepting Jesus' invitation to come to Him?
And was the location of the banquet changed......or did he just disregard the invited guests who refused the invitation and brought in a new group of guests "off the streets" who would appreciate the offer? I guess I'm not really getting your analogy here to attending organized church gatherings, sorry.
 
You may want to read my answer again
I did. It made even less sense the second and third times I read it. Your claim was that the early church was "loosely organized." My response to you was describing the early church. Paul wrote his letters TO the early church.....like 1st century. Do his instructions imply "loose" organization?
 
Was the parable of the King's banquet about attending church in a building? Or was it about about accepting Jesus' invitation to come to Him?
And was the location of the banquet changed......or did he just disregard the invited guests who refused the invitation and brought in a new group of guests "off the streets" who would appreciate the offer? I guess I'm not really getting your analogy here to attending organized church gatherings, sorry.
That's not an analogy, but what apostle Paul had experienced in various synagogues. Paul always preached to the Jews first, when the gospel was rejected by the Jews, then to the Gentles. But this parable didn't stop there, it can be applied to today's carnal-minded Christians, the self-appointed "spiritual Israel" who thought they have replaced the original Israel and they're entitled to the kingdom. Since the p(l)andemic, church attedence has significantly dropped, these Laodiceans make all kinds of exucses to stay away, even though we're living in the end times and we need spiritual truth more than ever. If the pastor and clergy have gone woke, if they stop teaching the bible but instead affirming LGBT, then seek alternatives, find faithful brothers and sisters who still have a clear conscience and worship with them instead.
 
Was the parable of the King's banquet about attending church in a building? Or was it about about accepting Jesus' invitation to come to Him?
And was the location of the banquet changed......or did he just disregard the invited guests who refused the invitation and brought in a new group of guests "off the streets" who would appreciate the offer? I guess I'm not really getting your analogy here to attending organized church gatherings, sorry.
He tells us those Whom the table was prepared for rejected the invitation
We sup with YH everyday we have church everyday where to or more are gathered n talk n praise Him He is there
We invite the homeless n addicts to our home at times
We talk to the prostitutes the drunks the druggies the homeless we not only talk but we sit n sup with them too
We don't trust in man to plant good seeds for us
YH tells us what to do but most go to a building once a week for all to see instead
Sum follow YH sum follow traditions of man

Pure religion and undefiled before God and the Father is this, To visit the fatherless and widows in their affliction, and to keep himself unspotted from the world.



Twistie :broken_heart:
 
I did. It made even less sense the second and third times I read it. Your claim was that the early church was "loosely organized." My response to you was describing the early church. Paul wrote his letters TO the early church.....like 1st century. Do his instructions imply "loose" organization?
The modern churches are organized to the point of controling people...."You must believe this....You may not believe that...You must get permission to marry." and so on. Its legalism...control not based on the Word at all. It was not that way in the early church
 
He tells us those Whom the table was prepared for rejected the invitation
We sup with YH everyday we have church everyday where to or more are gathered n talk n praise Him He is there
We invite the homeless n addicts to our home at times
We talk to the prostitutes the drunks the druggies the homeless we not only talk but we sit n sup with them too
We don't trust in man to plant good seeds for us
YH tells us what to do but most go to a building once a week for all to see instead
Sum follow YH sum follow traditions of man

Pure religion and undefiled before God and the Father is this, To visit the fatherless and widows in their affliction, and to keep himself unspotted from the world.



Twistie :broken_heart:
Who is supposed to be planting seeds then if not men....people? What did Paul say about planting and watering? (1 Corinthians 3:6-8)
Paul said, "I planted....." Paul was a preacher. He was an Apostle. He was a called, anointed man of God, who planted organized churches and administered them. And yes, he also planted seeds. "Apollos watered....." Guess who Apollos was? Yep, another preacher/teacher who taught in organized churches.

I'm not saying you are wrong. in fact, you are absolutely correct that we as the Body of Christ are supposed to be ministering to the broken....to widows and orphans.! We are also supposed to be preaching gospel truth to the lost, baptizing them, leading them to Jesus and to salvation through Him. But if you think it ends there, you are truly short-changing God's Word. THE Church was also created TO WORSHIP, and as was organized as a gathering (place) for believers to come together to fellowship, to teach one another, and to learn. The Church was also created to be a "House of Prayer!" ( see Matthew 21:13; Isaiah 56:7; Jeremiah 7:11; Psalm 93:5, etc). The church was established as an organized gathering of believers to come together in unified prayer and supplication.
"Peter was therefore kept in prison, but constant prayer was offered to God for him by the church." (Acts 12:5)
"And He declared to them, “It is written: ‘My house will be called a house of prayer." (Matthew 21:13)

Also the Spiritual Gifts were given for ONLY one reason......to edify THE church......to build up the Body of believers. One of those gifts listed is the Gift of Administration (see Romans 12:8, 1 Timothy 5:17, and Hebrews 13:17) another is the Gift of Shepherding/Pastoring (see Ephesians 4:11-12, 1 Timothy 3:1-13, or 1 Peter 5:1-4) . How are these gifts supposed to work if not within an organized church???

You are taking one biblical command and some bad personal experiences with organized churches and using it to try and claim that ALL organized churches are bad. You are not arguing against me, you are arguing against what the Word of God says and teaches us about the church.
It was NEVER God's plan that there NOT be an organized church with church leaders who are called by God to work in specific areas of ministry and gifted to do so. In fact the opposite is true. If you cant see that, then I'm sorry. I mean no offense at all and I wish you well and many blessings, but this conversation seems to be becoming unfruitful. I will, therefore bow out of it.
 
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The modern churches are organized to the point of controling people...."You must believe this....You may not believe that...You must get permission to marry." and so on. Its legalism...control not based on the Word at all. It was not that way in the early church
Really? There were no "rules" or guidelines that believers were expected to follow/live by? No guidelines for marriage/divorce, church leadership......even back then?
No offense....truly....but are you reading from the same Bible that I'm reading from?
 
The modern churches are organized to the point of controling people...."You must believe this....You may not believe that...You must get permission to marry." and so on. Its legalism...control not based on the Word at all. It was not that way in the early church

I have attended over a dozen churches in my life, and none of them have these rules. Now there are certain things you must be believe in order to be saved. But even then, none of these churches refused
anyone even if they didn't agree 100%.

Still, I have to commend your honesty here. You don't want to join a church, because some churches have rules. Some people don't like rules, I get it.
 
That's not an analogy, but what apostle Paul had experienced in various synagogues. Paul always preached to the Jews first, when the gospel was rejected by the Jews, then to the Gentles. But this parable didn't stop there, it can be applied to today's carnal-minded Christians, the self-appointed "spiritual Israel" who thought they have replaced the original Israel and they're entitled to the kingdom. Since the p(l)andemic, church attedence has significantly dropped, these Laodiceans make all kinds of exucses to stay away, even though we're living in the end times and we need spiritual truth more than ever. If the pastor and clergy have gone woke, if they stop teaching the bible but instead affirming LGBT, then seek alternatives, find faithful brothers and sisters who still have a clear conscience and worship with them instead.
First off, The parable of the wedding feast is in the Gospels and was taught many years before the Apostle Paul was even converted.
Secondly, there was a much deeper reason for Paul preaching in synagogues than what you've eluded to. It wasn't about preference of one group over another. It was a targeted evangelistic strategy. Paul and Silas knew that among the Gentiles, those who were most hungry for God would be those hanging around the temples where at least the Word of God (OT scrolls) would be read daily and openly and taught.. Read the accounts in Acts 13, 14, 16, 17 and 18. In almost every instance where Paul preached in a synagogue, there were Gentiles present. You fish where the fish are hungry and biting. Simple as that.

I kind of see what you are getting at.....and what you say about many modern churches is spot-on......but I think you may be unintentionally "misinterpreting" that parable and using it to mean something it doesn't. No offense....Just saying.
 
Really? There were no "rules" or guidelines that believers were expected to follow/live by? No guidelines for marriage/divorce, church leadership......even back then?
No offense....truly....but are you reading from the same Bible that I'm reading from?
I did not say that...of course there were guidelines....But nobody controlled other Christians...Today its all about control, get the numbers and keep them under your control
 
I have attended over a dozen churches in my life, and none of them have these rules. Now there are certain things you must be believe in order to be saved. But even then, none of these churches refused
anyone even if they didn't agree 100%.

Still, I have to commend your honesty here. You don't want to join a church, because some churches have rules. Some people don't like rules, I get it.
LOL At my age I have learned to live by rules. I would not have lived this long if I had not. But I am not a proponent of people controlling other people. Nobody has that right. Even God is against controlling peoples thoughts and actions, that's why He gave us free will.
 
I did not say that...of course there were guidelines....But nobody controlled other Christians...Today its all about control, get the numbers and keep them under your control
I respectfully disagree. True Christianity has always been the opposite of individualism. It's about obedience and surrender. People in the Old Testament refused to heed, yield to, or surrender to the words and commands of the prophets. sent by God. How'd that work out for them? You think God has changed since then? Is He still the same God on the same throne? Is He still a God who requires submission and obedience?
Perhaps the TRUE church (body of believers) hasn't changed all that much....Maybe there are still some trying to hold on to truth and to stricter (worldly unpopular) Godly standards. Perhaps it's society that's changed and who by preponderance wants a church that coddles their feelings and that lets them live however they want to live with very few guidelines and restrictions.

Methinks you have it twisted my friend. If you think the early church was not organized, and did not have strict standards and guidelines with strong repercussions......well then you know very little of early church history and I'd encourage you to do some reading. You might find it quite interesting to discover just how lax the churches have become these days compared to those early days. In the early church, believers were commanded (not just encouraged) to fast and pray. Giving offering and tithes was looked upon then as righteous and expected......not just a casual suggestion. Giving to charity and to the poor and widows was a commandment.....not an option for attendees. Christian churches too often focus on the "God of Love" these days without giving much (if any) time teaching about the fact that God is Holy and commands that His followers also be holy. He is also a God who demands obedience and He is just......He gives mercy and grace, but promises judgement.
The Bible says “He will repay each one according to his works.” (Romans 2:6)
Wanna see a great example of what happened to people in the early New Testament church when they got out of line with God? Look no further than the story of Ananias and Sapphira in Acts 5:1-11. I'll paste it for you because I feel you will likely not go read it on your own:
1 Now a man named Ananias, together with his wife Sapphira, also sold a piece of property. 2 With his wife’s full knowledge he kept back part of the money for himself, but brought the rest and put it at the apostles’ feet.
3 Then Peter said, “Ananias, how is it that Satan has so filled your heart that you have lied to the Holy Spirit and have kept for yourself some of the money you received for the land? 4 Didn’t it belong to you before it was sold? And after it was sold, wasn’t the money at your disposal? What made you think of doing such a thing? You have not lied just to human beings but to God.”
5 When Ananias heard this, he fell down and died. And great fear seized all who heard what had happened. 6 Then some young men came forward, wrapped up his body, and carried him out and buried him.
7 About three hours later his wife came in, not knowing what had happened. 8 Peter asked her, “Tell me, is this the price you and Ananias got for the land?”
“Yes,” she said, “that is the price.”
9 Peter said to her, “How could you conspire to test the Spirit of the Lord? Listen! The feet of the men who buried your husband are at the door, and they will carry you out also.”
10 At that moment she fell down at his feet and died. Then the young men came in and, finding her dead, carried her out and buried her beside her husband.
11 Great fear seized the whole church and all who heard about these events.
 
Who is supposed to be planting seeds then if not men....people? What did Paul say about planting and watering? (1 Corinthians 3:6-8)
Paul said, "I planted....." Paul was a preacher. He was an Apostle. He was a called, anointed man of God, who planted organized churches and administered them. And yes, he also planted seeds. "Apollos watered....." Guess who Apollos was? Yep, another preacher/teacher who taught in organized churches.

I'm not saying you are wrong. in fact, you are absolutely correct that we as the Body of Christ are supposed to be ministering to the broken....to widows and orphans.! We are also supposed to be preaching gospel truth to the lost, baptizing them, leading them to Jesus and to salvation through Him. But if you think it ends there, you are truly short-changing God's Word. THE Church was also created TO WORSHIP, and as was organized as a gathering (place) for believers to come together to fellowship, to teach one another, and to learn. The Church was also created to be a "House of Prayer!" ( see Matthew 21:13; Isaiah 56:7; Jeremiah 7:11; Psalm 93:5, etc). The church was established as an organized gathering of believers to come together in unified prayer and supplication.
"Peter was therefore kept in prison, but constant prayer was offered to God for him by the church." (Acts 12:5)
"And He declared to them, “It is written: ‘My house will be called a house of prayer." (Matthew 21:13)

Also the Spiritual Gifts were given for ONLY one reason......to edify THE church......to build up the Body of believers. One of those gifts listed is the Gift of Administration (see Romans 12:8, 1 Timothy 5:17, and Hebrews 13:17) another is the Gift of Shepherding/Pastoring (see Ephesians 4:11-12, 1 Timothy 3:1-13, or 1 Peter 5:1-4) . How are these gifts supposed to work if not within an organized church???

You are taking one biblical command and some bad personal experiences with organized churches and using it to try and claim that ALL organized churches are bad. You are not arguing against me, you are arguing against what the Word of God says and teaches us about the church.
It was NEVER God's plan that there NOT be an organized church with church leaders who are called by God to work in specific areas of ministry and gifted to do so. In fact the opposite is true. If you cant see that, then I'm sorry. I mean no offense at all and I wish you well and many blessings, but this conversation seems to be becoming unfruitful. I will, therefore bow out of it.
So being in one place week in n week out is planting?

Naw we plant from the time our feet hit the floor in the am

We got temples all ova here feed peep cloth peep n sum may help u get in a place

That's doesn't mean the temple is of YH frfr

Demons are very polite


Twistie :broken_heart:
 
So being in one place week in n week out is planting?

Naw we plant from the time our feet hit the floor in the am

We got temples all ova here feed peep cloth peep n sum may help u get in a place

That's doesn't mean the temple is of YH frfr

Demons are very polite


Twistie :broken_heart:
No u take one line n think man should b paid to repeat words

We r not the same

U follow traditions n that's fine if that's what ya like to do

I follow YH n listen to Him

I Hear YH loud n clear

Question is do u??

I'm ending this covo cause we ain't gonna see eye to eye


Twistie :broken_heart:
 
I respectfully disagree. True Christianity has always been the opposite of individualism. It's about obedience and surrender. People in the Old Testament refused to heed, yield to, or surrender to the words and commands of the prophets. sent by God. How'd that work out for them? You think God has changed since then? Is He still the same God on the same throne? Is He still a God who requires submission and obedience?
Perhaps the TRUE church (body of believers) hasn't changed all that much....Maybe there are still some trying to hold on to truth and to stricter (worldly unpopular) Godly standards. Perhaps it's society that's changed and who by preponderance wants a church that coddles their feelings and that lets them live however they want to live with very few guidelines and restrictions.

Methinks you have it twisted my friend. If you think the early church was not organized, and did not have strict standards and guidelines with strong repercussions......well then you know very little of early church history and I'd encourage you to do some reading. You might find it quite interesting to discover just how lax the churches have become these days compared to those early days. In the early church, believers were commanded (not just encouraged) to fast and pray. Giving offering and tithes was looked upon then as righteous and expected......not just a casual suggestion. Giving to charity and to the poor and widows was a commandment.....not an option for attendees. Christian churches too often focus on the "God of Love" these days without giving much (if any) time teaching about the fact that God is Holy and commands that His followers also be holy. He is also a God who demands obedience and He is just......He gives mercy and grace, but promises judgement.
The Bible says “He will repay each one according to his works.” (Romans 2:6)
Wanna see a great example of what happened to people in the early New Testament church when they got out of line with God? Look no further than the story of Ananias and Sapphira in Acts 5:1-11. I'll paste it for you because I feel you will likely not go read it on your own:
1 Now a man named Ananias, together with his wife Sapphira, also sold a piece of property. 2 With his wife’s full knowledge he kept back part of the money for himself, but brought the rest and put it at the apostles’ feet.
3 Then Peter said, “Ananias, how is it that Satan has so filled your heart that you have lied to the Holy Spirit and have kept for yourself some of the money you received for the land? 4 Didn’t it belong to you before it was sold? And after it was sold, wasn’t the money at your disposal? What made you think of doing such a thing? You have not lied just to human beings but to God.”
5 When Ananias heard this, he fell down and died. And great fear seized all who heard what had happened. 6 Then some young men came forward, wrapped up his body, and carried him out and buried him.
7 About three hours later his wife came in, not knowing what had happened. 8 Peter asked her, “Tell me, is this the price you and Ananias got for the land?”
“Yes,” she said, “that is the price.”
9 Peter said to her, “How could you conspire to test the Spirit of the Lord? Listen! The feet of the men who buried your husband are at the door, and they will carry you out also.”
10 At that moment she fell down at his feet and died. Then the young men came in and, finding her dead, carried her out and buried her beside her husband.
11 Great fear seized the whole church and all who heard about these events.
Of course its about individualism. Its about our obedience to God...to His Word....Not about our obedience to other people
I did not say that the early church was not organized....I said it was loosely organized. That's a very different thing. Organized so people knew where to find what...Organized so people knew where to give....Organized so people knew what was going on in the Christian community, but nobody controlled anybody. So.....I am not talking about people being controlled by God....or about people obeying God. I am talking about the pastor and his demon board controlling people. For example....I took my family camping years ago, in Washington State...When we returned the pastor stopped over to my house...He berated me for not being in church the last Sunday. I told him we had gone camping and had even had a 'service' together. He replied that "Ok...Well it's not me going to hell" What?! What does hell have to do with a born again Christian family....or is he just trying to scare me and force me to attend church at his command? He was trying to control me...nothing more. Show me one verse that shows God wants His people to be controlled...to be a subservient part of the herd
 
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