Evidence For A PreTribulation Rapture

[lecoop]

Luk 17:34 I tell you, two people will be in the same bed that night. One will be taken, and the other will be left behind.

Luk 17:35 Two woman will be grinding grain together. One will be taken, and the other will be left behind."
Luk 17:36 Two people will be in a field. One will be taken, and the other will be left behind.
Luk 17:37 Then they asked him, "Where, Lord, will this take place?" He told them, "Wherever there's a body, there the vultures will gather."

Num 6:24 May the LORD bless you and take care of you;
Num 6:25 May the LORD be kind and gracious to you;
Num 6:26 May the LORD look on you with favor and give you peace.

Amen​

I am not sure what your point was here.

I think these "one taken and one left" verses are speaking of the parable of the tares being performed.

Coop

 

[mattiyahu11]

How to Disprove the Pre-Tribulation rapture

How to Disprove the Pre-Tribulation rapture thoery?

In 3 easy Steps

Step 1: Go to the Famous "Rapture" verses in 1 Thessalonians 4:16-17
1Th 4:16 There will be the shout of command, the archangel's voice, the sound of God's trumpet, and the Lord himself will come down from heaven. Those who have died believing in Christ will rise to life first;
1Th 4:17 then we who are living at that time will be gathered up along with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will always be with the Lord.

Step 2:Read on to chapter 5 verse 1 & 2
1Th 5:1 There is no need to write you, friends, about the times and occasions when these things will happen.
1Th 5:2 For you yourselves know very well that the Day of the Lord will come as a thief comes at night.

The "Rapture" is also reffered to as the "Day of the Lord"

Step 3etermine when the Day of the Lord will occur...
Joe 2:31 The sun will be darkened, and the moon will turn red as blood before the great and terrible "day of the LORD" comes.

Isa 13:9 The day of the LORD is coming---that cruel day of his fierce anger and fury. The earth will be made a wilderness, and every sinner will be destroyed.
Isa 13:10 Every star and every constellation will stop shining, the sun will be dark when it rises, and the moon will give no light.

Messiah sets the timeline for the Day of the Lord & Rapture event by describing these same celestial events
...in Matthew 24:29

Mat 24:29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
Mat 24:30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
Mat 24:31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

1Th 4:16 There will be the shout of command, the archangel's voice, the sound of God's trumpet, and the Lord himself will come down from heaven. Those who have died believing in Christ will rise to life first;
1Th 4:17 then we who are living at that time will be gathered up along with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will always be with the Lord.

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Parallel:
Mat 24:30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in
heaven...

1Th 4:16 And the Lord himself will come down from heaven...

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Mat 24:31 And he shall send his angels...

1Th 4:16 shout of command, the archangel's voice...

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Mat 24:31 with a great sound of a trumpet...

1Th 4:16 the sound of God's trumpet...

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Mat 24:31 they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other...

1Th 4:17 then we who are living at that time will be gathered up along with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air...

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Credits to: Skydiver626...

 

[mattiyahu11]

I am not sure what your point was here.

I think these "one taken and one left" verses are speaking of the parable of the tares being performed.

Coop

Oh, Sorry...
That verse is usually use to the Pre-Tribulation Rapture Theory.

 

[MightyAngel1]

The PreTribulation Doctrine is not a Theory!

Pre-tribulation theory
The problem is no theory gives right answers. The whole pre-tribulation theory came into existence because of Jewish nature of Olivet disclosure. During the tribulation, the Jews are expected to observe Jewish law (like sabbath, etc.,). The observance of Jewish law is no more required (and they're even called "beggarly elements" by Paul in his epistles) in the dispensation of grace (for the body of Christ). THAT got Darby to come up with pre-tribulation theory.

Howdy Greatlybeloved!

No, Darby did not come up with the PreTribulation Rapture Doctrine. Instead, God did. God came up with the Pre-Tribulation Rapture Doctrine and gave this revelation to the Apostle Paul. Romans 16:25.

The Revelation of the Rapture of the Glorious Church of Jesus Christ that closes the Church Age, Romans 11:25 and Acts 15:17, was kept Secret until God revealed this powerful Truth to the Apostle Paul. Galatians 1:11-12.

Greatlybeloved--So the basic pre-trib argument is this: If we (the body of Christ) are not to observe Jewish law, and in Mat 24, when the Lord talks about sabbath/temple, etc., during tribulation, then the body of Christ must have been gone by then. Up to this, it is a valid argument. However based on this, they cooked up a whole theory which is full of assumptions. No where are we told that the body of Christ will not go through tribulation (PS: don't confuse "wrath to come" with tribulation, it is the "day of the Lord", NOT tribulation). No where are we told that the "restrainer" means Holy Spirit, no where are we told that the tribulation would be SEVEN years (although Daniel's 70th week is 7 years), and absence of the word "church" in Revelation after chapter 3 does not guarantee that the church is no more in the tribulation. Infact, there are verses in Rev 1 and 2 that some of the 7 churches indeed to through tribulation. And no where do we read that the "rapture" is a SECRET event (they show "like a thief" verses, but if you ask about tribulation during that period, then they say it is "second coming" and not "rapture").

No, The Rapture is not a secret event. Especially, Since God planned this event to happen before the Tribulation period begins.

Greatlybeloved--And on top of it, pre-tribbers woven a nice story where the fourth kingdom in Nebuchadnezzar's dream is ROMAN empire!!! Where did they get that from!? And they say Antichrist would come from REVIVED roman empire, I'd like to see where it is written.

According to Daniel 2:36-40, The Fourth Kingdom in this passage is The Roman Kingdom. No, The Antichrist comes from the 8th Kingdom which is the Revived Grecian Empire. Revelation 17:9-11.

The Revised Roman Empire is the 7th Kingdom of Revelation 17:9-11. The Revised Roman Empire begins in Revelation 6:2 under the man of sin of 2 Thessalonians 2:3. The Revived Grecian Empire begins in Revelation 13:1 under the anti-Christ of 2 Thessalonians 2:4.

God Bless You!

Dr. Mike

 

[MightyAngel1]

How to Disprove the Pre-Tribulation rapture thoery?

In 3 easy Steps

Step 1: Go to the Famous "Rapture" verses in 1 Thessalonians 4:16-17
1Th 4:16 There will be the shout of command, the archangel's voice, the sound of God's trumpet, and the Lord himself will come down from heaven. Those who have died believing in Christ will rise to life first;
1Th 4:17 then we who are living at that time will be gathered up along with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will always be with the Lord.

Step 2:Read on to chapter 5 verse 1 & 2
1Th 5:1 There is no need to write you, friends, about the times and occasions when these things will happen.
1Th 5:2 For you yourselves know very well that the Day of the Lord will come as a thief comes at night.

The "Rapture" is also reffered to as the "Day of the Lord"

Howdy mattiyahu11!

No, The Rapture is not referred as the Day of the Lord in Scripture. The Apostle Paul is very specific in his address to the Church of Thessalonica.

The Rapture event as taught by the Apostle Paul is referred to in Scripture as the Day of Christ. 2 Thessalonians 2:2.

2 Thessalonians 2:1-2--

1. NOW WE beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,
2. That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.

Therefore, You have the following days according to End Time Bible Prophecy...

1) The Day of Christ--is a Day of Light
2) The Day of the Lord--is a Day of Darkness

Scripture reference is 1 Thessalonians 5:1-9.

God Bless You!

Dr. Mike

 

[faithworks]

do not agree, we will go through tribluations, but He will carry us through. As it states in Psalm 91.. There are so many verses to back this up.. I do not get in debates about it though.....

I just believe we should live everyday as our last and live it sold out for Him............ And be ready for whatever He brings....

Shalom,
debbi rennier

 

[MightyAngel1]

do not agree,

Howdy Faithworks!

That is your choice.

FW--we will go through tribluations,

And tribulations worketh patience. I agree. But, We, The Christian Church WILL NOT go through Jacob's trouble. Daniel 9:27. Why? We are not called in Jacob.

The Tribulation period is all about 3 groups of people...

1) The Seed of Isaac multiplied as the stars of the Heaven.
2) The Seed of Jacob multiplied as the dust of the earth.
3) The Heathen.

As you can clearly see, The Seed of Abraham multiplied as the stars of the heaven are not even listed. You will not find them because they are not there.

FW--but He will carry us through.

And, Jesus Christ will never fail doing this either.

FW--As it states in Psalm 91.. There are so many verses to back this up..

One point is for sure...Jesus Christ never promised us a rose garden while serving Him her on this earth. But, When in our patience, we possess our souls, Luke 21:19, the rewards are literally out of this world in Heaven.

FW--I do not get in debates about it though.....

That is your choice.

FW--I just believe we should live everyday as our last and live it sold out for Him............ And be ready for whatever He brings....

Yes, We should live our lives everyday for Jesus Christ. But, He does not bring anything evil against us. We do that ourselves by the choices that we make.

Because, So many times, A Christian will walk in the flesh during the day rather than walking in the Spirit like they are supposed to do.

God Bless You!

Dr. Mike

 

[spirit1st]

The GREAT tribulation is MY FATHER GODS wrath on this world! I know for a fact satan does not have power over us! We have power over him and anyone he uses!

Mar 16:17 And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;
Mar 16:18 They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.

Mat 16:18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

Mat 16:19 And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.

Mat 18:18 Verily I say unto you, Whatsoever ye shall bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever ye shall loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.

The Most Powerful beings on earth is GODS Holy Children!
They have GODS Own power within them!
and the means to use it ! In the mighty name of JESUS CHRIST!


I will agree , most of us , do not know ,just how powerful we are in the LORD!
But ,i also know i have cast satan himself out and I am NO more than the least of GODS children!

anti -christ is just a mere man , satan gains control over ! Many on earth are taken over by demons

That does not make him ,more powerful than the Holy Ghost who dwells in us!

God has given each of HIS children , power over the demons , All of them!
The true church has NOT changed from its beginning!
satans the loser , he already lost! does not matter how man dummies allow him him to live though them!
I been attacked so many times! he lost each time!

GOD has DECLARED us More than Conquerors , it CANNOT BE CHANGED!
We are HIS Kings and Priests Forever more!

It a done deal ! It CANNOT be changed!
Some of US might fail at times! He makes us go though the same type junk again, Until we over come it!
And WE WILL!
satan knows it ! Still he tries to keep us from knowing the truth!
The truth sets us Free!
the demons fear us, they know we can over come them and cast them out!
They can only deceive , trick those who do not know the truth!
listen, We see what happened when the church got together and prayed God send the angels to free HIS people!

I believe in pre -wrath! God CANNOT bring HIS wrath upon His own body or church or family! Not going to happen!

WE going to suffer in this world! But the suffering Not going to come from our Father GOD!

He tells us Not to bring wrath upon our children , Why would He then bring His wrath upon us!
Listen we do not have to fear anything!
I do not even fear MY LORD JESUS!
I LOVE HIM so much , I hate too hurt HIM by sinning! I try my best to never sin!
But I do at times i guess!
Still if I do I repent quickly!
Because I hate it!
I sometimes speak ,when I should shut up!

Isa 53:5 But he was wounded for our transgressions, he was bruised for our iniquities: the chastisement of our peace was upon him; and with his stripes we are healed.

1Jn 2:13 I write unto you, fathers, because ye have known him that is from the beginning. I write unto you, young men, because ye have overcome the wicked one. I write unto you, little children, because ye have known the Father.

Eph 1:3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ:


Eph 6:12 For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.

WE are the winners ,Because HE Already Won for us!
How would it LOOK to all of heaven [New Jerusalem] if HE allows satan and that bunch of dummies , destroy HIS Body ?
After All? HE already Won and has declared us Winners!

The devils DO NOT have Power over our lives!
they can only try to trick people and use people to kill those who DO not understand the GREAT Power within them!
We Do not live by sight! WE live by Faith! Faith that GODS LIVING WORDS are 100% truth!
We tell the demons too GO in the mighty name of JESUS CHRIST and too take there dumb thoughts with them! They CANNOT refuse ! they must GO!
GOD Created all things BY Faith and LOVE!
Love gives us the correct reasons for wanting whatever we want and need!
We Do all things ,as unto HIM and For His glory and honor! Then we see the healed and miracles in our lives and others!
WE are Just accepting , What HE already did by Faith and for His glory!
GOD bless everyone here that loves our LORD JESUS! in the might name of JESUS CHRIST ! And I pray the LORD reveals even more truth and a greater understanding ! Thank You FATHER GOD!

 

[MightyAngel1]

The GREAT tribulation is MY FATHER GODS wrath on this world!

Howdy Spirit1st!

The entire 7 year period is God's wrath on this world. There are 4 wraths spoken of in the Book of Revelation. In the Greek, This is what we find...

1) The Wrath of Arnion--Revelation 6:16
2) The Wrath of Dioblos--Revelation 12:12
3) The Wrath of Theos--Revelation 16:1
4) The Wrath of Pantokrator--Revelation 19:15

In plain English...

1) The Wrath of the Lamb--Revelation 6:16
2) The Wrath of the devil--Revelation 12:12
3) The Wrath of God--Revelation 16:1
4) The Wrath of Almighty God--Revelation 19:15

Spirit1st--I know for a fact satan does not have power over us! We have power over him and anyone he uses!

Yes, We have power over satan. But, What happens here? Would you like to explain?

Revelation 13:7 And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.

You said quote "I know for a fact that satan does not have power over us!"

I agree. But, Looking at Revelation 13:7, The Saints are overcome by the Antichrist and get their butts kicked. On top of that, Many Saints die here because they were overcome by the Antichrist.

And, Jesus said, I will build my Church and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. Matthew 16:18.

So, The question that I have is simply this. In Revelation 13:7, Is this The Church of Jesus Christ being overcome by the Antichrist and getting their butts kicked?

Spirit1st--The Most Powerful beings on earth is GODS Holy Children! They have GODS Own power within them!
and the means to use it ! In the mighty name of JESUS CHRIST!

Yep, I agree. But, regarding Revelation 13:7, Something went seriously wrong. Wouldn't you agree?

God Bless You!

Dr. Mike

 

[spirit1st]

Revelations ends at the end of chapter 11 !
We see judgment day


then begins again telling the same story , But in a different way!
God Always confirms Everything more than once!
Rev 11:15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.

Rev 11:18 And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.
Rev 20:12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.
Rev 20:13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.
Rev 20:14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
Rev 20:15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.



Rev 13:7 And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.
I believe these are the called and must give up there lives for the LORD!

Because ? WE already know satan cannot win over the true church!

Of the scriptures Do not fit together ? Then we must have it wrong!

GOD DOES NOT give power To the devil to overcome HIS body!
Rev 13:7 And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them
Mat 16:18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.
Rom 8:37 Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us.
Mar 16:17 And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils;

1Jn 4:4 Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.


satan fears us!

1Co 6:2 Do ye not know that the saints shall judge the world? and if the world shall be judged by you, are ye unworthy to judge the smallest matters?
1Co 6:3 Know ye not that we shall judge angels? how much more things that pertain to this life?

Joh 14:12 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father.

WE Can walk in the very same Power as our LORD did! Because HE came also to be the perfect example for everyone of GODS CHILDREN!
That is one of the main reasons . HE came as a baby! Having been taught by the Holy Ghost as we should be!

Really HE said we could do greater works! I have not!
But i have done LOTS in HIS mighty name though the Power of the HOLY GHOST

Our HOME is NEW JERUSALEM!
We are HIS family ,household, kings and Priests!
He lives though us here!

listen, If we walk and live though our Spirit man! WE are very powerful in our LORD!
And we will see the signs and wonders in our lives and others!


Mar 2:20 But the days will come, when the bridegroom shall be taken away from them, and then shall they fast in those days.

 

[MightyAngel1]

Revelations ends at the end of chapter 11 !
We see judgment day

Howdy Spirit1st!

No, Revelations does not end at the end of Chapter 11. In my Bible, I have 22 Chapters in the Book of Revelation. Not 11 Chapters. If you only have 11 Chapters in the Book of Revelation, I would suggest you get yourself another Bible.

Revelation 11:14 The second woe is past: and, behold, the third woe cometh quickly.

I have a question for you. What is the Third Woe? The Third Woe occurs after Chapter 11 ends.

Spirit1st--Rev 13:7 And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.
I believe these are the called and must give up there lives for the LORD!

Ok, So you believe that Jesus came that some might have death and death more abundantly?

I just cannot seem to find that Scripture in my Bible.

But, I can find John 10:10b I am come that they might have life, and that they might have it more abundantly.

Spirit1st--Because ? WE already know satan cannot win over the true church!

Well, Satan will sure win over the saints in Revelation 13:7. So, This group of believers in Jesus Christ must not be the Glorious Church of Jesus Christ, Right? See Ephesians 5:27.

So, Who are these saints?

Spirit1st--Of the scriptures Do not fit together ? Then we must have it wrong!

I would say so. Somebody's interpretation here is not right if they are teaching the Glorious Church of Jesus Christ is shown in Revelation 13:7.

I would say that is a very big OOOOOOPPPPPPSSSSS!!!!!

Somebody does not understand the Seed Covenant of Abraham in the Book of Genesis. This Covenant gives us the answers we need to understand Revelation 13:7.

Spirit1st--GOD DOES NOT give power To the devil to overcome HIS body!

Rev 13:7 And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them

Well, Something is going to happen here. Because, As you can see, These believers will get their butts kicked and the devil will be laughing at God.

Hmmmmm...Something is just not jiving here with the words of Jesus Christ below...

Mat 16:18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

Hmmm! I wonder what is not jiving here? Do you have an explanation, Spirit1st?

Spirit1st--satan fears us!

When we walk in the spirit, Oh yes, I agree. But, Looking at Revelation 13:7, Satan does not fear those believers in Jesus Christ. Satan will kick their butts with NO FEAR.

Here is a question for you. Who gives Satan the power to make war against the Saints in Revelation 13:7?

You see, Satan cannot do anything against a believer in Jesus Christ unless God allows it. See the Book of Job!

So, Who are these believers in Jesus Christ in Revelation 13:7?

Let me help you with the answer with the Seed Covenant of Abraham in the New Testament.

1) The Seed of Abraham multiplied as the stars of the heaven.
2) The Seed of Isaac multiplied as the stars of the heaven.
3) The Seed of Jacob multiplied as the dust of the earth.

The answer to my question above lies in the choices above. And, There is only 1 correct answer.

God Bless You!

Dr. Mike

 

[spirit1st]

You do the same things many do ? You try to stand on one scripture , dumping those other i gave you!

Your saying , for Odd REASON GODS turning HIS church over to satan?

Do you understand what your saying?

Rev 13:7 And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them:

Now with your thinking? MY LORDS going to let satan have his evil way with His church [Body]
Think it about it? That make any sense ?


Rev 13:8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

Many will be saved during the great tribulation!
Salvation does not end just because we leave here!
Many will see ,that they missed out and must live though this evil time on earth!
Many who does not know the scriptures well and how to battle these demons!

Hos 4:6 My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge

satan nothing , just a liar and deceiver.


Rev 10:6 And sware by him that liveth for ever and ever, who created heaven, and the things that therein are, and the earth, and the things that therein are, and the sea, and the things which are therein, that there should be time no longer:

WE see judgment here!
Rev 11:18 And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets,

WE see judgment here!
Rev 20:12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.

WE know there is ONLY one judgment day!

Show me where else in the NEW TESTAMENT , That JESUS had given power over His Church ?

Eph 4:30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.


1Pe 1:5 Who are kept by the power of God through faith unto salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.


fear and doubt is his weapons!

OURS is Faith and LOVE and the Mighty Name of JESUS CHRIST!
WE have GODS Power in us! And if we want more? WE just ASK OUR FATHER GOD in FAITH!
Luk 11:13 If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children: how much more shall your heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to them that ask him?


Luk 10:19 Behold, I give unto you power to tread on serpents and scorpions, and over all the power of the enemy: and nothing shall by any means hurt you.

I do not agree with you! I do not mind you disagreeing with me !
I have no fear of the devil or anyone else on earth!

I only want to be pleasing too my LORD JESUS CHRIST!
Living or dying means nothing to me! Serving Him and obeying Him is all that counts to me!'

The LORDS protected me Many times! I have had men try to kill me! They were not allowed too!

Psa 116:15 Precious in the sight of the LORD is the death of his saints.

He has my way to leave this body!

I been dead twice , once each way ! I think so I could preach of it and know the truth , to tell others which i do!

satan will NEVER have power over the Body of Christ Jesus!

WE who are Born -Again , have the same power within us , that created all that was ever created! We might not fully live it ? But it is within us to live!

No devil or demon has that power with in them! Only GODS Holy Children!


I typed 14 pages of miracles in my life time about 6 years ago . Had lots more since! I am no more than the least in HIS BODY!

I did not do anything of my self! but by using my LORDS name .The HOLY GHOST did it or by just obeying HIS LIVING WORDS!


JESUS saved Noah in a earthly way! HE saves the true church in a spiritual way!
His wrath came upon the earth then !
Now once again , His wrath comes upon the Earth!
This time HE takes us Home!

Joh 17:16 They are not of the world, even as I am not of the world.
This planet is NOT our Home!
Out Home is NEW JERUSALEM

Joh 17:14 I have given them thy word; and the world hath hated them, because they are not of the world, even as I am not of the world


1Th 4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
1Th 4:18 Wherefore comfort one another with these words.

2Co 5:20 Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God.
WE are JUST passing though!

By the way! NO one was born -again in the old testament .They All had to wait in hell for the LORD to die for there sins!
The New covenant and New Testament ,Did not start til the LORD died on the Cross!

 

[MightyAngel1]

You do the same things many do ? You try to stand on one scripture , dumping those other i gave you!

Howdy Spirit1st!

On the Contrary. I do not stand on one verse of Scripture. I stand on three verses of Scripture. On top of that, I even showed you what the Scriptures said that I stand on.

Spirit1st--Your saying , for Odd REASON GODS turning HIS church over to satan?

According to God's plan, The Church of God must be purged. And, In this Church, 2/3's of the congregation will die according to God's plan in Scripture. Where does the Bible say this?

Zechariah 13:8-9.

8. And it shall come to pass, that in all the land, saith the Lord, two parts therein shall be cut off and die; but the third shall be left therein.

9. And I will bring the third part through the fire, and will refine them as silver is refined, and will try them as gold is tried: they shall call on my name, and I will hear them: I will say, It is my people: and they shall say, The Lord is my God.

New Testament Reference for Zechariah 13:8-9 is Matthew 23:39.

Matthew 23:39 For I say unto you, Ye shall not see me henceforth, till ye shall say, Blessed is he that cometh in the Name of the Lord.

You see Spirit1st, There is the Church of God The Father. See Acts 2 and Acts 7:38. And, There is the Glorious Church of Jesus Christ The Son. See Acts 15:14 and Ephesians 5:27.

Satan cannot come against and prevail against the Glorious Church of Jesus Christ The Son. But, God allows satan to make war with His saints, The Church of God The Father, and overcome them in Revelation 13:7. This is how God fulfills the Prophecy of Zechariah 13:8-9.

Spirit1st--Do you understand what your saying?

I understand totally what I am saying and I am showing you Scripture to back up what I am saying. However, with kindness, I really don't think you understand what I am showing you even with the Seed Covenant of Abraham right before your very eyes.

1) The Seed of Abraham multiplied as the stars of the heaven.
2) The Seed of Isaac multiplied as the stars of the heaven.
3) The Seed of Jacob multiplied as the dust of the earth.

You see, Spirit1st, Acts 7:38 talks about the Church in the Wilderness. This Church is God the Father's Church and members of this Church are identified in Scripture as Saints. The Church in the Wilderness is the Seed of Jacob multiplied as the dust of the earth.

Acts 2 is a continuation of the Church in the Wilderness of the Old Testament and this Church in Acts 2 is the Seed of Isaac multiplied as the stars of the Heaven as prophesied by God in Genesis 26:4. Because, They believe in Jesus Christ as the Messiah.

Today, in this time right now, We have the Seed of Abraham multiplied as the stars of the Heaven as prophesied by God in Genesis 15:4-5 who is the Glorious Church of Jesus Christ. See Acts 15:14, Ephesians 5:27, and Galatians 3:7.

So, When you look at Revelation 13:7, Who do you see? You see the Seed of Jacob multiplied as the dust of the earth being purged by God and God uses Satan to do just that. Zechariah 13:8-9.

And, Those Saints who survive this purging by God become the Seed of Isaac multiplied as the Stars of the Heaven and enter into the Millennial Kingdom after Jesus Christ returns to this earth.

Spirit1st--Rev 13:7 And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them:

Now with your thinking? MY LORDS going to let satan have his evil way with His church [Body]
Think it about it? That make any sense ?

According to the Seed Covenant of Abraham above, Yes, Absolutely this makes sense.

God The Father allows Satan to overcome His Church so that God the Father's Church can be purged according to the Prophecy in Zechariah 13:8-9. That is the Church of Acts 2 that is continued in Revelation Chapters 6-16. See Acts 7:38.

And, As you can clearly see, The Glorious Church of Jesus Christ The Son is not purged. We do not need to be purged. Therefore, The Saints in Revelation 13:7 is the Church of God the Father. Not Jesus Christ.

Spirit1st--Rev 13:8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

Many will be saved during the great tribulation!

Absolutely. By the Preaching of the Gospel of the Kingdom as prophesied by Jesus Christ in Matthew 24:14. See Revelation 7:1-8.

Spirit1st--Salvation does not end just because we leave here!

Oh, I agree with you here on this point. However, The Operation of the Holy Spirit does change. See Revelation 7:3.

Spirit1st--Many will see ,that they missed out and must live though this evil time on earth!

Some will live through this time, but, Many will die by being beheaded. See Revelation 20:4.

Spirit1st--Many who does not know the scriptures well and how to battle these demons!

Hos 4:6 My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge

satan nothing , just a liar and deceiver.

I agree.

Spirit1st--Rev 10:6 And sware by him that liveth for ever and ever, who created heaven, and the things that therein are, and the earth, and the things that therein are, and the sea, and the things which are therein, that there should be time no longer:

WE see judgment here!
Rev 11:18 And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets,

WE see judgment here!
Rev 20:12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.

WE know there is ONLY one judgment day!

My Bible shows me the following judgments...

1) The Judgment Seat of Christ--1 Corinthians 3:11-15. See also Romans 14:10 and 2 Corinthians 5:10.
2) The Judgment of the Nations--Matthew 25:31-46.
3) The Great White Throne of Judgment--Revelation 20:11-15.

And, None of these Judgments above occur on the same day. Here is a Judgment that has already taken place.

Matthew 27:52-53 and Ephesians 4:8. See John Chapter 20 for the details.

Spirit1st--Show me where else in the NEW TESTAMENT , That JESUS had given power over His Church ?

Jesus does not allow satan to overcome or prevail against His Glorious Church. But, as I have already stated, God the Father allows satan to prevail and overcome His Church so that the Church of God the Father can be purged according to Bible Prophecy.

Spirit1st--I only want to be pleasing too my LORD JESUS CHRIST!

Then, You must do the following...Live by the Law of Faith, Romans 3:27, Live the Law of belief, Romans 10:9-10, Live the Law of the Spirit of Life, Romans 8:2, Live the Law of Study, 2 Timothy 2:15, and Live the Law of Prayer, 1 Thessalonians 5:17.

Spirit1st--Living or dying means nothing to me!

Well, Living should mean a lot to you. Jesus died in your place so you could live. John 10:10b. Living means everything to me in Jesus Christ.

Spirit1st--Serving Him and obeying Him is all that counts to me!'

Serving Jesus and obeying His Spiritual Laws of the New Testament count for me as well.

Spirit1st--satan will NEVER have power over the Body of Christ Jesus!

Oh, I agree.

Spirit1st--By the way! NO one was born -again in the old testament .They All had to wait in hell for the LORD to die for there sins!
The New covenant and New Testament ,Did not start til the LORD died on the Cross!

I agree. I only pointed you to the Book of Job to show you a point.

God Bless You!

Dr. Mike

 

[spirit1st]

The true church is UNSEEN!
It is the Spirit of people who have been given a NEW SPIRIT!

Heb 12:23 To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,

Heb 10:14 For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified.

1Co 6:11 And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.

Heb 12:9 Furthermore we have had fathers of our flesh which corrected us, and we gave them reverence: shall we not much rather be in subjection unto the Father of spirits, and live?


Rom 9:8 That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God

Rom 8:8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.

2Co 4:18 While we look not at the things which are seen, but at the things which are not seen: for the things which are seen are temporal; but the things which are not seen are eternal.

Heb 13:5 Let your conversation be without covetousness; and be content with such things as ye have: for he hath said, I will never leave thee, nor forsake thee.

 

[MightyAngel1]

The true church is UNSEEN!
It is the Spirit of people who have been given a NEW SPIRIT!

Howdy Spirit1st!

The True Church is unseen? Really? So, The light that you have in you, You keep hidden so no one can see Jesus in you?

Matthew 5:14 Ye are the light of the world. A City that is set on an hill cannot be hid.

Matthew 5:16 Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven.

Romans 2:19 And art confident that thou thyself art a guide of the blind, a light of them which are in darkness.

Ephesians 5:8 For ye were sometimes darkness, but now are ye light in the Lord: walk as children of light.

You said quote "The True Church is unseen!" Well, How in the world are you going to be a witness for Jesus Christ hiding from everyone?

Spirit1st--Heb 12:23 To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,

One of my favorite verses in the Bible. Many times quoted by many Christians but few understand what this verse actually shows us. The Powerful Knowledge in this verse is amazing.

To the General Assembly and Church of the Firstborn. What a very powerful statement in this verse.

The General Assembly is the Seed of Isaac multiplied as the stars of the heaven. In the Greek, The General Assembly is the Paneguris in the New Testament period. See Acts 2.

They preach the Gospel of Circumcision. Galatians 2:7. Peter was sent preaching the Gospel of Circumcision to the seed of Jacob multiplied as the dust of the earth. When They believe this Gospel, They become the Seed of Isaac multiplied as the stars of the heaven.

The Church, is the Glorious Church of Jesus Christ, which is the Seed of Abraham multiplied as the stars of the heaven. In the Greek, The Church is the Ekklesia in the New Testament period.

They preach the Gospel of Un-Circumcision. Galatians 2:7. The Apostle Paul was sent to the heathen, that is Gentiles, and when they believe this Gospel they become the Seed of Abraham multiplied as the stars of the heaven.

Spirit1st--Heb 10:14 For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified.

The Seed of Isaac multiplied as the stars of the heaven are sanctified by Jesus Christ. Yep!!!

Spirit1st--1Co 6:11 And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.

The Seed of Abraham multiplied as the stars of the heaven have been washed, sanctified, and justified.

Spirit1st--Heb 12:9 Furthermore we have had fathers of our flesh which corrected us, and we gave them reverence: shall we not much rather be in subjection unto the Father of spirits, and live?

Spoken to the Seed of Isaac multiplied as the stars of the heaven.

Spirit1st--Rom 9:8 That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God

Paul is addressing the Seed of Jacob multiplied as the dust of the earth. This very seed is shown in Romans 11:8 blinded by God. They are also the Children of darkness as described by the Apostle Paul in 1 Thessalonians 5:5b - 8.

Spirit1st--Rom 8:8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.

Paul is addressing the Seed of Abraham multiplied as the stars of the heaven who walk not after the Spirit, Romans 8:1, but rather walk in the flesh.

Spirit11st--2Co 4:18 While we look not at the things which are seen, but at the things which are not seen: for the things which are seen are temporal; but the things which are not seen are eternal.

Paul is addressing the Seed of Abraham multiplied as the stars of the heaven who walk in the Spirit. This group is the Ekklesia of Ephesians 5:27. See Hebrews 12:23.

Spirit1st--Heb 13:5 Let your conversation be without covetousness; and be content with such things as ye have: for he hath said, I will never leave thee, nor forsake thee.

The Writer of Hebrews is addressing the Seed of Isaac multiplied as the stars of the heaven. This group is the paneguris in the New Testament. See Acts 2 and Hebrews 12:23.

God Bless You!

Dr. Mike

 

[spirit1st]

Gal 4:29 But as then he that was born after the flesh persecuted him that was born after the Spirit, even so it is now.

Rom 8:16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:

Rom 8:4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.


Rom 8:10 And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.


Rom 7:17 Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
Rom 7:18 For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.
Rom 7:19 For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.
Rom 7:20 Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
Rom 7:21 I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.
Rom 7:22 For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:
Rom 7:23 But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.
Rom 7:24 O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?
Rom 7:25 I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.


1Co 2:14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.


Rom 8:7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.

2Co 10:4 (For the weapons of our warfare are not carnal, but mighty through God to the pulling down of strong holds


You do not understand!

 

[MightyAngel1]

Gal 4:29 But as then he that was born after the flesh persecuted him that was born after the Spirit, even so it is now.

Howdy Spirit1st!

Ah, The Allegory of Abraham. A very powerful Allegory. Abraham, Sarah, and Hagar.

The Son born after the flesh was Ishmael from Hagar. The Son born after the Spirit was Isaac from Sarah who was the son of promise, i.e. born after the Spirit, which is a Jewish Idiom by the way in this context.

You do know what a Jewish Idiom is don't you? I pray that you do.

Spirit1st--Rom 8:16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:

The Seed of Abraham multiplied as the stars of the Heaven, Genesis 15:4-5, are born again believers in Jesus Christ. And, Therefore, Are Children of the Most High God.

Spirit1st--Rom 8:4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

Yes, Indeed. And, I have already shown you what these Laws of Righteousness are. The Law of Faith, Romans 3:27, The Law of belief, Romans 10:9-10, The Law of the Spirit of life, Romans 8:2, The Law of Study, 2 Timothy 2:15, and the Law of Prayer, 1 Thessalonians 5:17.

These are the Spiritual Laws of the New Blood Covenant established by Jesus Christ in Matthew 26:26-30 that The Seed of Abraham multiplied as the stars of the heaven are required by God to walk in by Faith.

Unfortunately, There are many Christians who do not even know these Spiritual Laws exist.

Spirit1st--Rom 8:10 And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.

That is right. The Seed of Abraham multiplied as the stars of the heaven become a new creature in Christ. 1 Corinthians 5:17.

When a heathen, or Gentile, hears and believes the Gospel of Un-Circumcision, Ephesians 2:8-9, They become the Seed of Abraham multiplied as the stars of the heaven. See Galatians 3:7.

Spirit1st--Rom 7:17 Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
Rom 7:18 For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.
Rom 7:19 For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.
Rom 7:20 Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
Rom 7:21 I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.
Rom 7:22 For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:
Rom 7:23 But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.
Rom 7:24 O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?
Rom 7:25 I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.

Of course, I am sure you are fully aware that this is The Apostle Paul describing himself.

And, The Apostle Paul who is an Israelite, Romans 11:1, of the Tribe of Benjamin, circumcised the 8th day, of the stock of Israel (Jacob--Genesis 32:28) an Hebrew of the Hebrews, and as touching the Law, A Pharisee...Philippians 3:5...

is of the Seed of Isaac multiplied as the stars of the heaven. Genesis 26:4, Genesis 21:12, Romans 9:7, and Hebrews 11:18.

Spirit1st--1Co 2:14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

The Seed Covenant of Abraham is a very powerful Covenant of God that is most definitely Spiritually discerned. Approximately 95% of all Christians do not understand this most powerful Covenant. Only about 5% do.

Which one are you, Spirit1st? Are you a 95 percenter? Or, Are you a 5 percenter? I say, We shall soon find out.

Spirit1st--Rom 8:7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.

The Carnal mind does not understand the Spiritual Laws of the New Blood Covenant. Neither does the carnal mind have a desire to study them and walk in them.

Spirit1st--2Co 10:4 (For the weapons of our warfare are not carnal, but mighty through God to the pulling down of strong holds

I have a question for you. Are you a faith walker?

Spirit1st--You do not understand!

That is your choice. Not mine!

God Bless You!

Dr. Mike

 

[spirit1st]

Listen ! To have Salvation , We are Born -again .
The seed we are born of is GODS SEED!

Has nothing to do with these dying bodies and No one was Born -again . Til Jesus Christ died on the Cross and Went to hell , then heaven [NEW JERUSALEM] And sent back the Holy Ghost!

This for tJoh 3:3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.
old of Salvation!
Eze 11:19 And I will give them one heart, and I will put a new spirit within you; and I will take the stony heart out of their flesh, and will give them an heart of flesh:

Eze 36:26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.

Joh 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
Joh 3:6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
Joh 3:7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.
Joh 3:8 The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.

Our OLD spirit is our Old Man. It is Nailed to HIS CROSS!

Rom 6:6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.

Eph 4:22 That ye put off concerning the former conversation the old man, which is corrupt according to the deceitful lusts;


Col 3:9 Lie not one to another, seeing that ye have put off the old man with his deeds;



Eph 2:15 Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;


Eph 4:24 And that ye put on the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness.

Col 3:10 And have put on the new man, which is renewed in knowledge after the image of him that created him:

1Pe 1:23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

 

[MightyAngel1]

Listen ! To have Salvation , We are Born -again .

Yep! I agree.

Spirit1st--The seed we are born of is GODS SEED!

The Seed of Abraham multiplied as the stars of the heaven is GOD'S SEED!!!

The Seed of Isaac multiplied as the stars of the heaven is GOD'S SEED!!!

And, Abraham and Isaac are Father and Son! And, They are Father and Son FOREVER!!!!!!!! The New Testament does not change this relationship.

Spirit1st--Has nothing to do with these dying bodies and No one was Born -again . Til Jesus Christ died on the Cross and Went to hell , then heaven [NEW JERUSALEM] And sent back the Holy Ghost!

Well, It is a good thing He did that, because If He had not, We would die in our sins.

Spirit1st--This for tJoh 3:3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

That is what He said, and I believe it. And, Jesus spoke this to a member of the Seed of Jacob multiplied as the dust of the earth. His name was Nicodemus who was a ruler of the Jewish People. John 3:1.

Spirit1st--old of Salvation!
Eze 11:19 And I will give them one heart, and I will put a new spirit within you; and I will take the stony heart out of their flesh, and will give them an heart of flesh:

Eze 36:26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.

This Prophecy in Ezekiel is a Prophecy concerning the Seed of Jacob multiplied as the dust of the earth in the New Testament.

Spirit1st--Joh 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
Joh 3:6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
Joh 3:7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.
Joh 3:8 The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.

Jesus was speaking to Nicodemus here who is a member of the Seed of Jacob multiplied as the dust of the earth.

Spirit1st--Our OLD spirit is our Old Man. It is Nailed to HIS CROSS!

Christians who walk in the flesh walk around with a resurrected old man. They take him off of that cross. Kind of makes wonder why don't it?

Spirit1st--Rom 6:6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.

I agree.

Spirit1st--Eph 4:22 That ye put off concerning the former conversation the old man, which is corrupt according to the deceitful lusts;


Col 3:9 Lie not one to another, seeing that ye have put off the old man with his deeds;

Yep, I agree. And, The Apostle Paul is addressing the Seed of Abraham multiplied as the stars of the heaven.

Spirit1st--Eph 2:15 Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;

The Father and the Son are the One New Man in the New Testament. That is the Seed of Abraham multiplied as the stars of the heaven and the Seed of Isaac multiplied as the stars of the heaven is the One New Man in the New Testament.

And, The Father and The Son relationship DOES NOT CHANGE!! With the One New Man, The Father and Son remain Father and Son.

Spirit1st--Eph 4:24 And that ye put on the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness.

Yep! The One New Man is Abraham and Isaac. See John 10:30. Jesus said I and the Father are one.

And, According to Ephesians 2:19, Abraham's seed multiplied as the stars of the heaven are fellow citizens with the Seed of Isaac multiplied as the stars of the heaven.

Spirit1st--Col 3:10 And have put on the new man, which is renewed in knowledge after the image of him that created him:

Abraham and Isaac are the New Man in the New Testament. And, God takes Abraham and Isaac and shapes them and molds them into the Image of His Son. Romans 8:29 applies to both Abraham and Isaac.

Spirit1st--1Pe 1:23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

Peter wrote this to the Seed of Isaac multiplied as the stars of the heaven.

God Bless You!

Dr. Mike

 

[spirit1st]

Everything you think is CARNAL!
Abrahams seed is the Israel people!
It was Abrahams FAITH that made HIM the father of faith!
Had nothing to do with his body! It died and rotted away!
He never had eternal life til the LORD died on the cross for HIM!
The name of the person goes to the grave with the body!
The NEW Creature our new Spirit gets a new body!



Rev 2:17 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the hidden manna, and will give him a white stone, and in the stone a new name written, which no man knoweth saving he that receiveth it.

He DID NOT DIE to save these bodies!

Rom 2:28 For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:
Rom 2:29 But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.